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New Return Policy - No Exchanges

techdash

Member
Jun 7, 2019
107
93
Maryland
Tesla seems to have changed their return policy. If you return, you cannot buy the same config for one year.
  • Once you have returned your vehicle, the return process is final and may not be cancelled. At this time, we are not able to facilitate vehicle exchanges. If you decide to order another vehicle, you may not order the same trim for a period of 12 months but may order another vehicle in a different trim at any time. However, if you are found to have abused this policy or have acted in bad faith, you will be prohibited from purchasing any vehicle for a period of 12 months.
Return Policy
 

Dr.K

Member
Feb 16, 2015
93
37
Palm beach, fl
This ?[aggressive?]wording may indeed be justified for some of their clients, but it certainly should hold for Tesla:

However, if you are found to have abused this policy or have acted in bad faith,

if they try to deliver a car with paint, fit or other defects, their inspectors - at multiple stages of production and delivery- are either abusing their customer or acting in bad faith if they don’t inspect and correct properly before delivery.

A lesson they should learn: they are creating problems because of aggressive customer non service. People who buy new cars should not feel like they examine it with experts the way one would buy a used car. I love my P85D but am ready to upgrade. I have not directly from living people seen or heard of bad fit paint or other problems. Yet I just see all these warning signs that they actually do have a lot of people rejecting their new cars. Maybe they have some abusers getting one week free drive, but that seems pretty extreme - after All the customer writes a big check. How many would think all that effort is worthwhile?

Also there is the problem of the 35k vs 135k car. You can bet your bottom dollar a Lexus LS gets treated better than a Toyota Corolla customer, a Rolls Royce better than a VW, and a Bentley better than a BMW 1 series. Seems like Tesla does not differentiate.
 

Uncle Paul

Well-Known Member
Nov 1, 2013
6,299
7,598
Canyon Lake,CA
Imagine that while less than 1% of deliveries are rejected by picky customers, that still results in thousands of cars that now will clog up the system.

These people also tend to be the LOUDEST complainers on the forums. They act like a little scratch or panel alignment is the end of the world and that they want the best car possible...since it is A BRAND NEW CAR! (my emphasis)

My X was not perfect when it was delivered to me, however it still is the best car I have ever owned.

Understand people not accepting a poorly made car with unfixable issues, but some people take minor cosmetic issues way too far (Entitled indeed).

One that rejected his car because they found a bracket inside the frunk that was poorly painted comes to mind :(
 

Loco_Nomad

Member
Apr 5, 2019
321
75
NorCal or Bishkek
regular car makers don't take their cars back nor exchange (maybe only for promotion or rare cases)... why tesla has to take every car back if just customer didn't like it for some reason? Either pay a big fee or do research before buying... they've been doing it for a while, enough is enough
 

SaveOurPlanet

Member
Jan 6, 2018
266
189
San Francisco
We never test drove anything, we only went to the Tesla store to see the interior/exterior color to confirm our choice. The store manager wanted us to test drive the car but we declined knowing that is what we want. The door trim on the passenger side was way off but they adjusted it with an appointment 2 weeks after delivery. I never walked around the car to check for paint and scratches. I guess it is all about expectation, we came from years of Mercedes ownership and knowing we are not buying a Bentley on a Tesla budget. But I guess some people expect more.
 
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AMPd

Active Member
Nov 27, 2012
4,614
4,418
Northern California
regular car makers don't take their cars back nor exchange (maybe only for promotion or rare cases)... why tesla has to take every car back if just customer didn't like it for some reason? Either pay a big fee or do research before buying... they've been doing it for a while, enough is enough
What? Buying a regular car at the dealer you get to see AND drive it before you decide to buy it. So if it has imperfections then you don’t buy it, simple as that.
 
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KSilver2000

Active Member
Dec 23, 2017
1,368
2,438
CA
regular car makers don't take their cars back nor exchange (maybe only for promotion or rare cases)... why tesla has to take every car back if just customer didn't like it for some reason? Either pay a big fee or do research before buying... they've been doing it for a while, enough is enough

Most (ICE) car makers don’t sell to order.
Most car buyers are able to look over a car and test drive it before deciding to purchase it or not. Unlike buying a Tesla.
 

KSilver2000

Active Member
Dec 23, 2017
1,368
2,438
CA
I never walked around the car to check for paint and scratches.
Because you don’t do it, other people should not be allowed to either?

I guess it is all about expectation, we came from years of Mercedes ownership and knowing we are not buying a Bentley on a Tesla budget. But I guess some people expect more.
A Tesla budget is the same as a Mercedes budget. Did you not care about any defects on the Benz?
Some people are coming from similarly priced Lexus that has (to me at least) perfect body.
Some people are coming from Toyota/Honda/GM, and so they are maybe more likely to be demanding of a car that costs 2-5x more.
 
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darxsys

Member
Dec 12, 2018
497
541
Seattle
Imagine that while less than 1% of deliveries are rejected by picky customers, that still results in thousands of cars that now will clog up the system.

These people also tend to be the LOUDEST complainers on the forums. They act like a little scratch or panel alignment is the end of the world and that they want the best car possible...since it is A BRAND NEW CAR! (my emphasis)

My X was not perfect when it was delivered to me, however it still is the best car I have ever owned.

Understand people not accepting a poorly made car with unfixable issues, but some people take minor cosmetic issues way too far (Entitled indeed).

One that rejected his car because they found a bracket inside the frunk that was poorly painted comes to mind :(

I haven’t been active on this forum for a few months and now I am reading some new posts and a lot of them literally have my brain going “wtf”. Including yours.

Entitled???? Really? Someone who cashed out $100k on a car and is complaining about poor panel alignment, paint issues, missed details etc is, in your opinion, entitled? $100k?

I would understand if this was a $20k car. No right to complain at all then. But $100k, or even more?

I don’t know what to tell you, maybe you’re trying to piss people off on purpose with ridiculous statements like that, but I’ll just say that not everyone here is okay with a $100k item looking like it was assembled by 15 year olds in their dad’s garage. People complaining have every right to do it. The only actual argument that you could make here would be something about Tesla being a new company, a startup where one should have been aware of potential issues when buying the car. I would agree on that. But calling people entitled after they cashed out so much?

Maybe your Model X is the best car you ever owned, but to me, when I see a model X, I feel bad for the person that cashed out so much money for something that looks obviously horribly assembled even from 50 feet away. To each their own, maybe you don’t care about that, but that doesn’t somehow make you a better person. Or “less entitled”.
 

Uncle Paul

Well-Known Member
Nov 1, 2013
6,299
7,598
Canyon Lake,CA
My point is that while some of the cars from Tesla are of unacceptable quality to most, others are still really fine cars, but with very minor flaws (like a scratch or smudge) that should not be rejected.

I agree that a poorly put together car should never be offered to a customer. Panel gaps should be aligned prior to presentation, etc.

But I also see people rejecting a car because of a dirty visor or a bracket inside the frunk that is not perfectly painted. Believe that many of these cars could be accepted and enjoyed for many years. Kind of like the tiny scratch on a door handle area that "could not be unseen".

45 minute inspections with high intensity lights and high definition photographs can reveal imperfections in most any mass produced vehicles.

Guess I am just wanting some balance here.

Some posts have featured customers that have rejected one vehicle after another, and posted with glee that they could find a flaw in most every car on the lot (they are that good at it).

Another example would be a person that spends his time, looking at others cars...from 50 feet away, and feeling bad for them. Instead could rejoice that perhaps that owner is enjoying every mile they travel in such a fantastic and confortable car.

I have owned Jaguars with horrible orange peal paint. Have owned a 911 with some of the most precise panel gaps, but spent most of it's time in the shop. Owned Rolls Royces that sat for months awaiting repair parts. Driven other American cars with panel gaps worse than Tesla, and also driven well built and efficient Asian cars that were dependable as could be, but also boring to a fault to drive.

I have seen well designed German cars, but their companies lied to the customers about the amount of pollution they were emitting and the amount of fuel they would consume. I have seen companies sacrifice safety features to save a few cents per car. I have read about companies cheating their employees out of pay with illegal programs and seen companies lay off thousands of "valued employees" to move their production to areas where they could pollute more.

Another point is that it is easier to make a perfect $20,000 simple gasser, than to make a state of the art, groundbreaking "running on Sunshine" change the world evolutionary personal transportation vehicle.
 
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AMPd

Active Member
Nov 27, 2012
4,614
4,418
Northern California
My point is that while some of the cars from Tesla are of unacceptable quality to most, others are still really fine cars, but with very minor flaws (like a scratch or smudge) that should not be rejected.

I agree that a poorly put together car should never be offered to a customer. Panel gaps should be aligned prior to presentation, etc.

But I also see people rejecting a car because of a dirty visor or a bracket inside the frunk that is not perfectly painted. Believe that many of these cars could be accepted and enjoyed for many years. Kind of like the tiny scratch on a door handle area that "could not be unseen".

45 minute inspections with high intensity lights and high definition photographs can reveal imperfections in most any mass produced vehicles.

Guess I am just wanting some balance here.

Some posts have featured customers that have rejected one vehicle after another, and posted with glee that they could find a flaw in most every car on the lot (they are that good at it).

Another example would be a person that spends his time, looking at others cars...from 50 feet away, and feeling bad for them. Instead could rejoice that perhaps that owner is enjoying every mile they travel in such a fantastic and confortable car.

I have owned Jaguars with horrible orange peal paint. Have owned a 911 with some of the most precise panel gaps, but spent most of it's time in the shop. Owned Rolls Royces that sat for months awaiting repair parts. Driven other American cars with panel gaps worse than Tesla, and also driven well built and efficient Asian cars that were dependable as could be, but also boring to a fault to drive.

I have seen well designed German cars, but their companies lied to the customers about the amount of pollution they were emitting and the amount of fuel they would consume. I have seen companies sacrifice safety features to save a few cents per car. I have read about companies cheating their employees out of pay with illegal programs and seen companies lay off thousands of "valued employees" to move their production to areas where they could pollute more.

Another point is that it is easier to make a perfect $20,000 simple gasser, than to make a state of the art, groundbreaking "running on Sunshine" change the world evolutionary personal transportation vehicle.
Can you please link or share the thread where someone rejected a tesla because of a dirty visor?

Why is it easier to build a 20k ice car than a tesla? Body assembly has no connection with the kind of drivetrain the vehicle runs. The problem with teslas body panel misalignment issues is tesla doesn’t want to take the time needed to correct them, they need to stamp out as many vehicles as possible, quality be damned.
 
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KSilver2000

Active Member
Dec 23, 2017
1,368
2,438
CA
My point is that while some of the cars from Tesla are of unacceptable quality to most, others are still really fine cars, but with very minor flaws (like a scratch or smudge) that should not be rejected.

I agree that a poorly put together car should never be offered to a customer. Panel gaps should be aligned prior to presentation, etc.

But I also see people rejecting a car because of a dirty visor or a bracket inside the frunk that is not perfectly painted. Believe that many of these cars could be accepted and enjoyed for many years. Kind of like the tiny scratch on a door handle area that "could not be unseen".

45 minute inspections with high intensity lights and high definition photographs can reveal imperfections in most any mass produced vehicles.

Guess I am just wanting some balance here.

Some posts have featured customers that have rejected one vehicle after another, and posted with glee that they could find a flaw in most every car on the lot (they are that good at it).

Another example would be a person that spends his time, looking at others cars...from 50 feet away, and feeling bad for them. Instead could rejoice that perhaps that owner is enjoying every mile they travel in such a fantastic and confortable car.

I have owned Jaguars with horrible orange peal paint. Have owned a 911 with some of the most precise panel gaps, but spent most of it's time in the shop. Owned Rolls Royces that sat for months awaiting repair parts. Driven other American cars with panel gaps worse than Tesla, and also driven well built and efficient Asian cars that were dependable as could be, but also boring to a fault to drive.

I have seen well designed German cars, but their companies lied to the customers about the amount of pollution they were emitting and the amount of fuel they would consume. I have seen companies sacrifice safety features to save a few cents per car. I have read about companies cheating their employees out of pay with illegal programs and seen companies lay off thousands of "valued employees" to move their production to areas where they could pollute more.

Another point is that it is easier to make a perfect $20,000 simple gasser, than to make a state of the art, groundbreaking "running on Sunshine" change the world evolutionary personal transportation vehicle.

The conversation, including the points you initially mentioned, is regarding paint, scratch, dent, panel gaps, and trim. A $20,000 car doesn’t make these appearance matters easier or harder to make than any other car. I don’t believe so, but, if anything, a $100,000 carmaker should know how to make cars with less of these visible defects. Your argument may make sense regarding the motor and power train, but not something like paint and trim cleanliness.

Bringing up mechanical issues in a conversation regarding appearance makes it seem like you’re stretching to justify something.
 
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darxsys

Member
Dec 12, 2018
497
541
Seattle
My point is that while some of the cars from Tesla are of unacceptable quality to most, others are still really fine cars, but with very minor flaws (like a scratch or smudge) that should not be rejected.

A scratch on a $40k Model 3 can be considered a minor flaw. On a $100k Model S absolutely not. Or any other car that costs as much for that matter. If a brand new S550 or Taycan have a scratch, reject them.


I agree that a poorly put together car should never be offered to a customer. Panel gaps should be aligned prior to presentation, etc.

So based on that, most Tesla cars shouldn’t be for sale, right? Almost every single Model X I’ve seen had misaligned panels. Model S seems to be a lot better in this regard somehow.

But I also see people rejecting a car because of a dirty visor or a bracket inside the frunk that is not perfectly painted. Believe that many of these cars could be accepted and enjoyed for many years. Kind of like the tiny scratch on a door handle area that "could not be unseen".
Again, the price level sets expectations. If a $20k Accord has a dirty visor, well, it’s a bit embarrassing for the company, but not a lot of room to complain because it’s cheap. But $100k car should be well taken care of at every single step of production and delivery. That’s at least my expectation as a customer. A dirty visor or poorly painted areas are a red flag to me alarming me that who knows what else was also done poorly on the car. Unaccceptable.

45 minute inspections with high intensity lights and high definition photographs can reveal imperfections in most any mass produced vehicles.

Twisting my words won’t get this discussion very far. Let’s not pretend that we are talking about X ray inspections or 45 minute high intensity light thorough walkthroughs. The issues we are talking about here are noticeable after a few minutes of somewhat careful walkthrough of the car. Just go to a Tesla store and count how many you can find by glancing at the car for 10 minutes. The number will be non zero.

Guess I am just wanting some balance here.
Guess we all are, but balance doesn’t mean the same things to everyone I guess.

Some posts have featured customers that have rejected one vehicle after another, and posted with glee that they could find a flaw in most every car on the lot (they are that good at it).
That’s not the topic here. I don’t care about people like that.

Another example would be a person that spends his time, looking at others cars...from 50 feet away, and feeling bad for them.
I can just smile at this.

Instead could rejoice that perhaps that owner is enjoying every mile they travel in such a fantastic and confortable car.
Everyone has their opinion. The cars are definitely not fantastic. Their batteries and motors are absolutely fantastic, no question. That’s the only part of this car that can be considered fantastic. Everything else is acceptable at best. Software, quality of materials, build quality, sound proofing. None of that is even close to fantastic. The batteries and EV excitement make it really worth to drive.

I have owned Jaguars with horrible orange peal paint. Have owned a 911 with some of the most precise panel gaps, but spent most of it's time in the shop. Owned Rolls Royces that sat for months awaiting repair parts. Driven other American cars with panel gaps worse than Tesla, and also driven well built and efficient Asian cars that were dependable as could be, but also boring to a fault to drive.
Pointing out Tesla’s problems doesn’t mean I am saying other companies don’t have problems. It’s funny how Tesla fans always try to twist the comparison argument in their favor. So when it makes Tesla look better, they will compare it all day long with other companies, but when other companies do better, Tesla fans will say “it’s not a fair comparison, Tesla is only X years old.” Decide for once if comparing Tesla with other companies is acceptable or not, and stick to it.

I have seen well designed German cars, but their companies lied to the customers about the amount of pollution they were emitting and the amount of fuel they would consume. I have seen companies sacrifice safety features to save a few cents per car. I have read about companies cheating their employees out of pay with illegal programs and seen companies lay off thousands of "valued employees" to move their production to areas where they could pollute more.
Uhm, seriously? Why not mention Tesla and Elon lying and deceiving customers all the time? Full self driving in 2016, anyone? FSD by end of 2019? It’s approaching fast, they better deliver. Model 3 timelines? Yellow screens “are not a warranty item”? Did you read about SolarCity mess? Their factory nightmare in Buffalo? Free supercharging for life, but not really because if the car went through a dealer, they strip it off the car? Lowballing trade in values on their own vehicles while at the same time respecting KBB values for ALL other brands? And on and on. Non argument.

Another point is that it is easier to make a perfect $20,000 simple gasser, than to make a state of the art, groundbreaking "running on Sunshine" change the world evolutionary personal transportation vehicle.
agree and disagree at the same time. Tesla has done a Herculean job with EV transportation. They’ve changed the world for the better and no one can take it away from them. They’ve started a revolution. But that’s not the topic here and it also still doesn’t mean that they aren’t making poorly built cars and have horrific customer service that’s getting worse by the day with decisions like these. And isn’t one of the huge arguments to buy a Tesla or any other EV the fact they have way less parts so they are easier and cheaper to maintain? How and why are they so much harder to assemble then? Wasn’t even Elon ambitiously claiming he can automate almost the whole process at the gigafactory? Piece of cake right? Cheers!
 
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