New S features vs. the competition

[BooMan]

Lol and I agree . Tesla’s not for everyone

I

Lol and I agree . Tesla’s not for everyone

wait, you DONT want the reach around function??? I…. I mean a friend of mine said he would most def pay for FSD if it included this…

The Taycan definitely has better build quality an better interior materials. Hands down.
But at a higher price, less range, slower acceleration, no supercharging network.

All depends on priorities.

Higher price - I agree (depends on options/trim), range? TBD. Tesla seems to be “optimistic” with stated range vs real world for most normal people. Porsche (and pretty much everybody else) tends to be slightly pessimistic vs EPA. Supercharging network? I think for many (US and West Europe) may not notice a significant difference today. And it’s obvious CCS is the future unless you believe ALL other OEMs will fold and car will = Tesla in a the future…. which would mean you have…. ”isssues”

 

[RobDickinson]

Sorry - I'm not an S driver and don't come often to this forum so maybe this has already been discussed - but I didn't see it.

I'm looking at the new S being released and honestly am not impressed with the comfort features. Did they actually look at Mercedes, BMW, etc. and try to provide competing feature set? I once compared S and 3 and bought the 3 even though I'd rather buy upmarket model. Looking at the new S - I think I'd do the same again. So it has the amazing performance, some comforts - but it looks basically to be a souped up 3. You can play games and it has gaming controller - like that's what's important. Where is the HUD ?? Where is the top-camera?? Particularly for a $130K car. My 7-year old BMW has better comfort - and apparently paying double the Model 3 price still doesn't get me there. Sure now there are ventilated seats - a feature I never use on my BMW (and the BMW has massage too). There is an instrument cluster - but nothing important on it. The way you need to engage drive/reverse seems pretty ridiculous to me (a lot more inconvenient sliding on a screen). The yoke is a joke, I'd never buy a car with that. I was looking at the reviews and videos to see whether the updated S can be my next car - and honestly don't see that.

Am I missing something ?

Model 3 Perf -= $56k, Model S long range = $80k.

Larger car more features, more comfort, more range etc.

New (ventilated) seats, quiet glass, noise cancelling, rear display, 17" screen, etc.

 

[st_o_p]

Am I missing something ?

Model 3 Perf -= $56k, Model S long range = $80k.

Larger car more features, more comfort, more range etc.

New (ventilated) seats, quiet glass, noise cancelling, rear display, 17" screen, etc.

This is what you get for the extra $24K ??
Quiet (quiet glass, noise cancelling,etc - same thing), Model 3 already got quiet in 2020; not much here. "rear display, 17" screen" - cosmetic. "New (ventilated) seats" one if the few actual new features - and this one pretty useless (I have it and never use it).

So yes - I'd say you're missing something. Go compare BMW 3-series and 5-series - massive feature diff for the same price diff. At 80K Model S is competing directly with BMW 5-series and Merc E-class - but on features it's not really competing. A lot of people would not consider it simply because of that - because for them comfort is important.

BTW - those talking about Taycan - sure one can buy that. If I wanted a Porsche - I'd buy a Porsche. Not really relevant to discussion of where Model S is coming short.

 

[red2017s]

"S" it is clear you are a BMW fan and not a Tesla S fan----after reading the responses it is unclear why you started this thread other than to entice responses you could disagree with. Why else would someone go on a Forum and just knock the main product of that Forum? Anyhow, comparing the BMW to the Tesla S----Tesla has the best charging network by far. Nothing on the market today comes close. That alone offsets any cosmetic or minor feature enhancement any other competitor has to offer. And then specifically to the BMW------repair and maintenance costs once the warranty wears out are astronomical for BMW's. And then you have the poor dealership service---like when we were picking up one of our BMW's from a minor repair for $X million dollars when two of their drivers crashed into one another. Yes, with our car being one of them--as we watched from 20 yards away. Their solution----they could do us a great favor by fixing the body damage on our car for their cost!!! And they were actually surprised we didn't jump for joy at this offer. After 20 minutes of emphatically informing them that we weren't going to pay a cent, and that in fact we were surprised they weren't offering us discounts on the exisitng repair bill, etc., they offered us a special deal on new tires ---that was higher than the ad in that day's newspaper and on the tv ads????

As I said before, some people like vanilla ice cream and others prefer chocolate chip-----you prefer BMW's over the S, and you couldn't give me a BMW. For pure luxury-----the old Cadillacs gave the most comfortable ride going back to the 1950's for me.

 

[Yanniz]

I

wait, you DONT want the reach around function??? I…. I mean a friend of mine said he would most def pay for FSD if it included this…

Higher price - I agree (depends on options/trim), range? TBD. Tesla seems to be “optimistic” with stated range vs real world for most normal people. Porsche (and pretty much everybody else) tends to be slightly pessimistic vs EPA. Supercharging network? I think for many (US and West Europe) may not notice a significant difference today. And it’s obvious CCS is the future unless you believe ALL other OEMs will fold and car will = Tesla in a the future…. which would mean you have…. ”isssues”

No but the Deep Tissue Massage sounds great

 

[ucmndd]

This is what you get for the extra $24K ??

No, the main thing you get for the extra $24k is 33% more battery and another hundred miles of range. The extra creature comforts are quite frankly fluff.

 

[RobDickinson]

This is what you get for the extra $24K ??
Quiet (quiet glass, noise cancelling,etc - same thing), Model 3 already got quiet in 2020; not much here. "rear display, 17" screen" - cosmetic. "New (ventilated) seats" one if the few actual new features - and this one pretty useless (I have it and never use it).

So yes - I'd say you're missing something. Go compare BMW 3-series and 5-series - massive feature diff for the same price diff. At 80K Model S is competing directly with BMW 5-series and Merc E-class - but on features it's not really competing. A lot of people would not consider it simply because of that - because for them comfort is important.

BTW - those talking about Taycan - sure one can buy that. If I wanted a Porsche - I'd buy a Porsche. Not really relevant to discussion of where Model S is coming short.

May I suggest you go and buy a taycan? And stop trolling this board?

 

[msm859]

I own a Model 3 and a 5 series BMW. I am very well aware how fun Teslas are to drive. Yet every time I sit in my Tesla - there are things I'm missing, and I wish I was in the BMW. I can understand that for Model 3 - it's more economy-level car (relatively speaking) so no room for some features. In a newly redesigned Model S though - particularly in price range north of $100K - that is kind of unforgivable.


My priorities are NOT comfort and nothing else. What I'm saying is when I buy a high-end sedan - I expect that don't need to feel like it's missing basic stuff. I'm not asking for the sky here - but seriously, no top camera (in this price range) ?? No HUD ?? But they did spend (I bet) inordinate amount of resources to produce the ridiculous yoke. I can't help but feel disappointed. When I first bought my BMW - I felt the car is perfect, and I was very happy for a few years. I've never felt that way about a Tesla - no matter how great it is in some respects - it's always missing some basic and important stuff. Just feels like a missed opportunity.

Buy the Model X if you want more luxury. You walk up to it and the front door automatically opens. Get inside, touch the brake and it closes. You can open and close all the other doors with your key fob or the touch screen. Pull up to pick up passengers and open the FWD (Falcon wing doors) that is luxury - and will impress - more than the features you mention in your BMW. HUD - I do like - but Tesla is pushing FSD so not as important - and FSD does work really well on freeways - luxury. Finally, they are about the safest cards on the planet - I would call that a luxury feature.

 

[st_o_p]

No, the main thing you get for the extra $24k is 33% more battery and another hundred miles of range. The extra creature comforts are quite frankly fluff.

That is a point. But then again - it makes the S mostly a souped up 3 rather than different class vehicle.

Buy the Model X if you want more luxury...

And still no HUD. Just makes my point - if you spend $500K on a Tesla, it will still be missing basic stuff.

"S" it is clear you are a BMW fan and not a Tesla S fan----after reading the responses it is unclear why you started this thread....

Ok - I'll stop. Apparently I hit a raw nerve with the converted.
Just FYI - I am even more critical of BMW on the BMW boards. There is plenty of justification for sure. But for the record - I've owned BMWs for almost 20 years, some of them past 10 years of age - and I survived the cost of ownership. I'll grant you - it's a legitimate criticism.

Point is you guys cannot take legitimate criticism either. The only reason I keep responding is because people are offering arguments trying to justify something that clearly has no merrit. I'm not here to try and feel better for the fact that the new Model S is sub-par in some ways. I posted because I really really wanted to have a car without the downsides of a BMW and the more glaring omissions of a Tesla - that I can buy next. I guess in the real world that's not happening. Like I said - I won't post anymore on this.

 

[ucmndd]

I posted because I really really wanted to have a car without the downsides of a BMW and the more glaring omissions of a Tesla - that I can buy next. I guess in the real world that's not happening.

In the next year or so there will be PLENTY of options to fill this niche. Others have mentioned Porsche, but I'll say the Audi E-Tron GT sounds like it's exactly what you're looking for. Lucid appears to be chasing after this space too. Jaguar, Mercedes, Volvo, hell - even BMW.

I think the criticism is due to your seeming insistence that Tesla needs to play in this luxury pond to be competitive - despite their having no interest nor strategic direction with that in mind. The hang-up on the HUD is an illustrative example. It's antithetical to Tesla's strategic ambition to be a leader in autonomous driving (again, setting aside their ability to actually deliver on that, which is a mostly unrelated conversation), but you can't seem to let go of the idea that you're "missing out" on some major feature that you personally have decided is non-negotiable.

Criticizing a company for not doing something they've decided is strategically unimportant doesn't make sense. I can buy a Corvette or a 6 series for ~$70k - but I don't find it particularly productive to point at the Corvette and say "What the back-breaking balls it doesn't even have 6-way adjustable lumbar support like the BMW does!" Of course it doesn't.

Tesla has made no secret about what you're buying, and you're either on board with that or not. Sounds like you're not, and that's ok. BMW and others will happily keep taking your money - and might even sell you an EV.

 

[msm859]

That is a point. But then again - it makes the S mostly a souped up 3 rather than different class vehicle.


And still no HUD. Just makes my point - if you spend $500K on a Tesla, it will still be missing basic stuff.


Ok - I'll stop. Apparently I hit a raw nerve with the converted.
Just FYI - I am even more critical of BMW on the BMW boards. There is plenty of justification for sure. But for the record - I've owned BMWs for almost 20 years, some of them past 10 years of age - and I survived the cost of ownership. I'll grant you - it's a legitimate criticism.

Point is you guys cannot take legitimate criticism either. The only reason I keep responding is because people are offering arguments trying to justify something that clearly has no merrit. I'm not here to try and feel better for the fact that the new Model S is sub-par in some ways. I posted because I really really wanted to have a car without the downsides of a BMW and the more glaring omissions of a Tesla - that I can buy next. I guess in the real world that's not happening. Like I said - I won't post anymore on this.

If my arguments had no merit, then why did you completely ignore each of my points and only mention the 1 thing I acknowledged the Tesla was missing that I actually miss (I have a C7 Corvette with HUD). And I actually forgot to list the most important "luxury" feature. Driving without burning gas - all while having better performance than virtually every car out there. Never having to go to a gas station. Charging in the luxury of your garage. A car that gets better after you buy it......

 

[whitex]

The 360 cam is apparently coming (albeit on Elon Time, so you know, maybe never) and I agree this one is an oversight that should be presumably easy to fix.

What are you basing this assertion on? Faith in Elon? He has done a great job making people believe that everything they want is coming to their Teslas, preferably for free via over the air update too. Apple Car Play, Android Auto, surround view, level 5 FSD, third party apps, Cyberpunk2077, etc. In the case of 360 view, did Elon even say anything about it coming? Source?

 

[whitex]

Lol and I agree . Tesla’s not for everyone

Yep. Dream to drive, pain to own to correct production issues unless you luck out and get one which doesn't need corrections (I've bought 4 Model S, every one of them needed fixing in the first month of ownership, ranging from not charging or not unfolding mirrors, to weird noises due to loose parts or lacking sound dampening). The ownership turns into a nightmare if you need any serious service (no proper parts planning, service backups, conflict of interest because each warranty fix affects Tesla bottom line so why not try to tell the customer to stop coming to the shop with a problem which is expensive to fix).

All that said, even on features alone, I bet there will be a good number of people who would prefer something like EQS over the new Model S. The only thing I can say Model S has on the EQS is acceleration. On pretty much everything else, EQS wins hands down. Compare the interiors for example.

 

[DBV1]

I see both sides. I have a Model S LR scheduled for delivery end of this week and am waffling as always been a BMW guy. My current car is a loaded BMW 5 Series. I love to lease and Tesla leasing does not make sense, so forced to buy. Lots of things I am intrigued with on the Model S, like EV, power, quietness, technology, etc. Some drawbacks, which may sound stupid, like no blind spot monitoring, no CarPlay, no SiriusXM or AM radio or no HUD, but at least in the S you have have the normal screen in front of you.

Also - do a lot of driving and since EV would be new to me, I have some range anxiety, especially in the winter months in NE Ohio.