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NHTSA asks Tesla to recall 158,000 [now 135,000] vehicles for eMMC failure. Voluntary Recall issued

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First, a decade is not enough. NHTSA said 15 years is the minimum for automotive products.
Second, software bloat is not the issue. It's the amount of datalogging Tesla did. Flash wears out due to writes. A few 1GB updates doesn't wear it out- constant background writing which adds up to terrabytes does.
The NHTSA wouldn't know about this yet if they kept file sizes down. Logging uses up memory but there was enough before the bloat. increased firmware made failures happen in 3-5 years instead of 12-20 because they ran out of unused space for the logging to burn. They never stopped logging even now, they reduced a lot of the unnecessary linux file system logging but it still records everything you do. Logging isn't how they could fix this - the only way is to have more memory to burn whether increasing chip size or decreasing used portion.

They stopped bloat updating MCU1 when they realized it was going to get very expensive. Bloat is why 2017s wear out in 3 years but 2012s took 6+. The used firmware portion quadrupled in size and that means logging had 25% of it's original planned scratch area to burn. 1.2GB updates aren't causing the chip to fail but running out of memory sooner is. They designed the chip with 250mb firmwares and a lot more scratch. BLOAT reduced scratch and causes failure when the new firmware is overlapping burned scratch areas.

A lot of us have had temporary "fixes" applied by the service center using their "Double update" method where they update the same version twice, bouncing your active partition from the "A" side to "B" side when the scratch area is below 0% left and encroaches on one of the usable firmware areas. As those usable areas grew the time for this to happen was dropped by years. Downgrading to 1.0 would fix an MCU1 for a few more years but they won't.

MCU2 could see the same problem in a few years if they bloat it with enough games. It will take a lot more used space but it has the same underlying issues with memory, logging, and planned scratch areas to burn.
 
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Adding to what gearcruncher says...I have a 2017 X with MCU1 and HW3, and we have been having a LOT of freezes and reboots on both the dash display and the infotainment screen. I initially thought it might be the emmc issue, because the symptoms seem so similar. I no longer think so.

Over a few service appointments Tesla has cleaned up a bunch of files, reflashed part of my firmware, released a new firmware version, suggested I try not using my USB stick, and mentioned a known navigation bug (they said there would be a fix for this, but they don't know when) which implies that not using navigation will reduce problems. As they promised, each of these has indeed resulted in a lower number of freezes/reboots...in fact yesterday we went on a several-hour drive, and had no problems at all. So clearly, a lot of these problems are caused by factors other than bad emmc chips.

I fear the above paragraph may cause confusion about my point, so let me be clear that I am not suggesting that driving without sentry, teslacam and navigation is a solution. My trouble-free drive was because I inconvenienced myself to avoid the problem, rather than because Tesla fixed the problem. Their computer should not crash based on what's plugged in to the USB port (the same high-end USB card works fine on my Model 3, but even if it's really bad, the Tesla computer should give an error rather than crashing), or when navigation is in use. I agree this is potentially a safety issue (though I am more worried about future emmc issues!), and most likely caused by Tesla - specifically, Musk - focusing all development work on new vehicles without allocating sufficient resources to the older ones. Tesla should definitely be fixing these issues rather than waiting for everyone to get exasperated and pay for the MCU2 upgrade. I'm really unhappy with how the driving experience of our X has degraded.

My point in posting is to point out that not every crash and reboot is caused by a bad emmc chip, and sometimes when Tesla techs suggest you try something other than replacing the chip, they really are trying to help and not just lying to you to make you go away. It's too bad the local service techs can't fix firmware bugs and we have to wait on Musk to make it a priority. Which, who knows, he may never do on his own given the feedback he's getting from the market about his current strategy. That's where NHTSA reports might help.

Mcu1 development is basically just, hey intern when you get a chance could you work on this. No rush, just when you get time. Work on polytopia and chess first, then if there's time could go grab us lunch and then maybe squeeze in MCU1 thanks
 
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The NHTSA wouldn't know about this yet if they kept file sizes down. Logging uses up memory but there was enough before the bloat. increased firmware made failures happen in 3-5 years instead of 12-20 because they ran out of unused space for the logging to burn.

They stopped bloat updating MCU1 when they realized it was going to get very expensive. Bloat is why 2017s wear out in 3 years but 2012s took 6+.

The Tesla community has known about flash wear out for years. Here's a thread about two failures in a 2012 car, in 2017:

MCU fails for the second time

If 2012's took 6 years to burn out, we would not have been well aware of this in 2017. A 2012 car with no software updates was not going to make it 12-20 years.

Plus, not all of that is "bloat" - they added navigation, autopilot, and a lot since 2012, that were all parts of the advertising of the car's functions when it was sold. I doubt most of us want to go back to 2012.
 
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Agreed. we all saw this coming, it became obvious as bloat increased and people with the most hours of operating time showed us what was coming. Tesla never listens to us so here we are looking at a recall they are still resisting.

Nav has a completely separate memory chip that can go bad as well. I had mine replaced a few years ago. They planned on that one being replaced easily.

I'm sorry I missed you into thinking "all of that is bloat" - not my intention or message. Bloat is why we have a recall now instead of a decade from now, it was always going to happen but the reason they stopped updating us was because we would already have 100% failure rates if they continued to bloat at the place they were at. 100% was always guaranteed - bloat just chopped years off the clock.
 
Adding to what gearcruncher says...I have a 2017 X with MCU1 and HW3, and we have been having a LOT of freezes and reboots on both the dash display and the infotainment screen. I initially thought it might be the emmc issue, because the symptoms seem so similar. I no longer think so.

Over a few service appointments Tesla has cleaned up a bunch of files, reflashed part of my firmware, released a new firmware version, suggested I try not using my USB stick, and mentioned a known navigation bug (they said there would be a fix for this, but they don't know when) which implies that not using navigation will reduce problems. As they promised, each of these has indeed resulted in a lower number of freezes/reboots...in fact yesterday we went on a several-hour drive, and had no problems at all. So clearly, a lot of these problems are caused by factors other than bad emmc chips.

I fear the above paragraph may cause confusion about my point, so let me be clear that I am not suggesting that driving without sentry, teslacam and navigation is a solution. My trouble-free drive was because I inconvenienced myself to avoid the problem, rather than because Tesla fixed the problem. Their computer should not crash based on what's plugged in to the USB port (the same high-end USB card works fine on my Model 3, but even if it's really bad, the Tesla computer should give an error rather than crashing), or when navigation is in use. I agree this is potentially a safety issue (though I am more worried about future emmc issues!), and most likely caused by Tesla - specifically, Musk - focusing all development work on new vehicles without allocating sufficient resources to the older ones. Tesla should definitely be fixing these issues rather than waiting for everyone to get exasperated and pay for the MCU2 upgrade. I'm really unhappy with how the driving experience of our X has degraded.

My point in posting is to point out that not every crash and reboot is caused by a bad emmc chip, and sometimes when Tesla techs suggest you try something other than replacing the chip, they really are trying to help and not just lying to you to make you go away. It's too bad the local service techs can't fix firmware bugs and we have to wait on Musk to make it a priority. Which, who knows, he may never do on his own given the feedback he's getting from the market about his current strategy. That's where NHTSA reports might help.


This is incredible. This is the EXACT verbatim conversation we had with Tesla Coral Gables today. We are having the same exact issues as listed in virtually every thread, the car has been in 4x and they come back with the same exact feedback listed above each time. We leave the dealer with a 10 second delay and then over the next week it just fails. You can't do ANYTHING in the vehicle - no backup camera, turn signal noises, heat, air, change radio stations, etc. I don't understand why Tesla continues to deny the issue - it just doesn't make sense. There are 15 pages here of people that are experiencing the same issue and today we were told our vehicle (MCU 1, HW 3) doesn't apply to the NHTSA bulletin because the screen was already replaced due the issue occurring over the summer. It just doesn't make sense and I don't know what other options we have, but right now we feel like we're driving around in a car that is not safe....and we have a toddler we drive drive to school every day. Any ideas?
 
This is incredible. This is the EXACT verbatim conversation we had with Tesla Coral Gables today. We are having the same exact issues as listed in virtually every thread, the car has been in 4x and they come back with the same exact feedback listed above each time. We leave the dealer with a 10 second delay and then over the next week it just fails. You can't do ANYTHING in the vehicle - no backup camera, turn signal noises, heat, air, change radio stations, etc. I don't understand why Tesla continues to deny the issue - it just doesn't make sense. There are 15 pages here of people that are experiencing the same issue and today we were told our vehicle (MCU 1, HW 3) doesn't apply to the NHTSA bulletin because the screen was already replaced due the issue occurring over the summer. It just doesn't make sense and I don't know what other options we have, but right now we feel like we're driving around in a car that is not safe....and we have a toddler we drive drive to school every day. Any ideas?

It's pretty obvious, isn't it?

* They've solved the problem once (updated MCU-1 sku with more memory for more write endurance)
* They've solved the problem twice (MCU-2 update)

* They've decided that, as a business decision, they're happy to poke you in the eye rather than eat the cost of the repair. Their company, their prerogative (just like it's yours to not put up with their abuse when you buy your next car).
* They've biffed their supply chain management in not keeping enough spares on hand to cope with the expected issues.
* They're happy to pissed off regulatory organizations rather than manage risk like a mature organization (Well, except maybe GM which proved to be perfectly happy to let their customers occasionally eat steering column rather than recall their ignition switches, though you could say that GM managed the risk by hiding the evidence; who knows how many times they haven't been caught?)
* The guy at the top is more acutely aware that any recall is going to eat *his* money unlike execs at other car companies that get paid regardless of how much money the company makes.

Tesla is not an organization that is large enough, from a management perspective, to chew gum and walk at the same time. They're trying to grow exponentially while trying to avoid getting crushed by recall / warranty expenses in their high volume products. They don't seem to have the focus to drill down into actually supporting the cars they've made to the same degree of quality as a MB or Lexus or even Toyota. They're currently more at the Roots or AMC or Leyland level of legacy product support.

The S and X are the beta program for the 3 and Y; to that extent we (the beta testers) have demonstrated how much you can wear an MCU before it becomes an issue, how to manage battery chemistry across the extreme ends of thermal and charge regimes for different chemistries, etc. A mistake with the S/X program costs some millions; a mistake like batterygate on the 3/Y program would potentially doom the company even with their current financials.

It is my opinion that they should treat the S/X customers a bit better. Partially because it seems like the right thing to give a little more support to the earlier adopters, but mostly because it is poor advertising for their high-touch products like the roadster, plaid, cybertruck, and semi. I'm a shareholder and a tesla owner, but practically speaking, my vote doesn't count for much.

So the tl/dr is this:
If your car is broken to the point where it makes you uncomfortable driving it, just pay to fix it (demand the $500 MCU 1 fix or the 3000 MCU2/radio upgrade, or drop the radio and save a bit). Maybe you'll get reimbursed / maybe you won't, but at least you'll get your car back. And never buy a tesla again, unless the working car parts are enough to put up with the broken corporation parts.

Another alternative is to report to the NTSB every time it breaks and document how dangerous it is. Live with the terrible car and potentially getting fired by tesla as a customer.
 
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It just doesn't make sense and I don't know what other options we have, but right now we feel like we're driving around in a car that is not safe....and we have a toddler we drive drive to school every day. Any ideas?

A few options:

Upgrade to MCU2 out of pocket ma nd move on with life
Take Tesla to small claims court for the MCU2 cost. They say they don't know how to fix the issue, but they do.
Report issue to NHTSA
Look at your state laws for lemon laws.
 
Perhaps 100 small claim actions will cause enough bad press that Tesla will fix things?

Perhaps Tesla can't source the parts - nah - they got 500,000 MCU2s in 2020.

Perhaps Tesla can install MCU2s at zero profit as a goodwill measure. Wonder what their cost is for a MCU2 - $1k?

I think everyone (almost) would be happy with a $1200 MCU2 change ($200 for labor). I would be happy even with a 6 month wait.
 
Reading this thread, it's become clear that MCU1 isn't really stable for many people, even if it doesn't have the eMMC wear out issue that NHTSA is currently considering a recall for. But it is clear that NHTSA considers a non-operational MCU a safety issue.
I'm starting to think that the eMMC is actually a bit of a red herring Tesla put in front of NHTSA and Tesla thought they would be able to just handle with warranty and get NHTSA off their backs. NHTSA cares if the MCU isn't working, not only if it isn't working due to flash wear out.
I suggest anyone that is having issues with MCU1, that has been told by Tesla that it isn't the flash issue, to report this to NHTSA.:File a Vehicle Safety Complaint | Safercar.gov | NHTSA

Tesla tried to argue software could fix the flash issue. If the software is also the issue with MCU1 not working properly, they can fix the software, or they could decide to upgrade everyone to MCU2. But let's make sure that NHTSA knows that lots of drivers are having issues with using MCU1 for the backup camera, blinker noises, heater/defrost controls, headlight controls and more even when Tesla claims that hardware is operating as expected. We don't even need to argue about MCU1's safety criticality- NHTSA has already agreed to that in the eMMC recall.

Example report:
I am the owner of a 201X Tesla Model. The "center screen" in this car is central to the use of many safety functions of the car, such as the reverse camera, headlight controls, defroster controls, and turn signal chimes. The screen in my car has become highly unreliable, often locking up, rebooting, or failing to respond, causing the aforementioned functions to be unavailable. It is my observation that these functions worked well in the past when the vehicle was originally delivered, but have degraded over time as Tesla has pushed software updates to my car.

I have discussed this issue with Tesla and am aware of the proposed NHTSA recal of the center screens due to a eMMC flash wear out issue. Tesla has assured me that this is not the issue with my car, and has requested that I wait for future software updates to resolve these issues. However, it is my observation that software updates have continuously made this situation worse, and Tesla has offered no specific date on which this will be resolved. This is unacceptable for safety functions of a vehicle. Tesla has also mentioned that I can upgrade to "MCU2" at a cost of $3000, and that this system works much better. Owners of 3 year old vehicles still under warranty should not be required to pay to maintain the safety of their vehicle.

I request that you investigate the scale of Tesla "MCU1" center screen issues beyond the eMMC flash issue and work with Tesla to make sure this is resolved quickly for the 150,000 owners of these vehicles.

Thank for posting the NHTSA link... I encourage anyone with ongoing issues to report a complaint.
File a Vehicle Safety Complaint | Safercar.gov | NHTSA
 
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Only, that isn't true. They only made ~58,000 vehicles in 2020 that used a MCU2. (And then they had more MCU2s that were used for Infotainment Upgraded purchasers.)

I would guess that the 3/Y MCU and the S/X MCU have a very similar "bill of materials" and have the same basic set of functionality when it comes to programming them. As such when you're making a contract to get all that stuff, you can lump 90% of the S/X parts manifest/purchase contracts into the same orders for the 3/Y parts. Different board / final assembly, but otherwise very similar. That'd be a reasonable design/project goal anyhow.
 
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Perhaps 100 small claim actions will cause enough bad press that Tesla will fix things?

Perhaps Tesla can't source the parts - nah - they got 500,000 MCU2s in 2020.

Perhaps Tesla can install MCU2s at zero profit as a goodwill measure. Wonder what their cost is for a MCU2 - $1k?

I think everyone (almost) would be happy with a $1200 MCU2 change ($200 for labor). I would be happy even with a 6 month wait.

$1k? Maybe if they're buying them at full retail from Best Buy??? Check the price of a Samsung Chromebook
 
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It's pretty obvious, isn't it?

* They've solved the problem once (updated MCU-1 sku with more memory for more write endurance)
* They've solved the problem twice (MCU-2 update)

* They've decided that, as a business decision, they're happy to poke you in the eye rather than eat the cost of the repair. Their company, their prerogative (just like it's yours to not put up with their abuse when you buy your next car).
* They've biffed their supply chain management in not keeping enough spares on hand to cope with the expected issues.
* They're happy to pissed off regulatory organizations rather than manage risk like a mature organization (Well, except maybe GM which proved to be perfectly happy to let their customers occasionally eat steering column rather than recall their ignition switches, though you could say that GM managed the risk by hiding the evidence; who knows how many times they haven't been caught?)
* The guy at the top is more acutely aware that any recall is going to eat *his* money unlike execs at other car companies that get paid regardless of how much money the company makes.

Tesla is not an organization that is large enough, from a management perspective, to chew gum and walk at the same time. They're trying to grow exponentially while trying to avoid getting crushed by recall / warranty expenses in their high volume products. They don't seem to have the focus to drill down into actually supporting the cars they've made to the same degree of quality as a MB or Lexus or even Toyota. They're currently more at the Roots or AMC or Leyland level of legacy product support.

The S and X are the beta program for the 3 and Y; to that extent we (the beta testers) have demonstrated how much you can wear an MCU before it becomes an issue, how to manage battery chemistry across the extreme ends of thermal and charge regimes for different chemistries, etc. A mistake with the S/X program costs some millions; a mistake like batterygate on the 3/Y program would potentially doom the company even with their current financials.

It is my opinion that they should treat the S/X customers a bit better. Partially because it seems like the right thing to give a little more support to the earlier adopters, but mostly because it is poor advertising for their high-touch products like the roadster, plaid, cybertruck, and semi. I'm a shareholder and a tesla owner, but practically speaking, my vote doesn't count for much.

So the tl/dr is this:
If your car is broken to the point where it makes you uncomfortable driving it, just pay to fix it (demand the $500 MCU 1 fix or the 3000 MCU2/radio upgrade, or drop the radio and save a bit). Maybe you'll get reimbursed / maybe you won't, but at least you'll get your car back. And never buy a tesla again, unless the working car parts are enough to put up with the broken corporation parts.

Another alternative is to report to the NTSB every time it breaks and document how dangerous it is. Live with the terrible car and potentially getting fired by tesla as a customer.


I tried to pay to fix with a new daughterboard back in Sept. Part ordered Oct 5th, still not shipped.

Was told yesterday even if they had they part, and I paid for it, I would not get it because all boards are going to cars that have black screen.

Cancelled my appt. Still have 18 months of b to b warranty for the car.
 
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So I'm going through this issue right now.
MCU freezes, jumbled characters etc
Had it looked at along with a few other others before my ESA runs out... diagnostics indicate my MCU is fine <shrug>

My SC has always been and continues to be great, but it seems like a corporate decision to just wait it out.