Nightmare! (Supercharger queues)

[qwickshot]

You’ll never get 350kw, you need an 800V battery system for that and Tesla is 400V.

The chargers are limited by the number of Amps they can provide. Volts x amps = power in Kw. On a 400V system, I think the max power they can provide is ~175kw.

Tesla V3 super chargers provide the highest number of amps which is why they can go up to ~250kw @400V.

It could be any number of reasons why you didn’t get the full power including from the car and the charger. It would be good if both the car and the charger gave an indicator as to why. If you are ever on a KemPower charger it will tell you if the speed is car or charger limited.

 

[Utumno]

Good idea. You’re right, I should consider other non Tesla chargers such as Ionity. Never really done that but I should. Especially now that they are, I think, added into the sat nav. Thus far I’ve always perceived alternative chargers as either too complicated, too much of a faff, more expensive and generally a less valid option than the ease of using the Tesla network. So I’ve ignored them. I probably need to broaden my charging horizons after what turned out to be an over 8 hour journey yesterday.

Was a lot easier when I bought my first Tesla in 2019 but that’s the price of progress I suppose.

It's definitely the case that the non-Tesla charging networks simply aren't as easy and straightforward to use, not to mention the woeful reliability of some. Ionity, InstaVolt, Osprey and Fastned are all "nearly there" usability and reliability wise from my own experience, and 3 of those 4 are conveniently available using an Electroverse RFID card/account so it's not too bothersome from a card/contactless/app experience either.

Cost these days seems to be much of a muchness and honestly my time is worth more than spending a few pennies more or less per kWh.

That said I'll still Supercharge first, but if I can't Supercharge I'll hunt around for chargers from those four networks first as needed.

 

[Adopado]

Seems things have calmed down today.

#panic-over

Indeed ... I will still stop at Tebay if/when I need to ... 3 chargers available just now ...

 

[DaveNN]

Indeed ... I will still stop at Tebay if/when I need to ... 3 chargers available just now ...

I bet the p.oxy daily mail aren't reporting that...

 

[K-ev 1]

The infrastructure on the M6/M40 corridor is starting to creak a little bit, especially the v2 superchargers which weren't really sized for the number of Tesla's on the road these days.

My experience thus far has been a 20 minute wait going down from Scotland and 10 minutes going up at Gretna Green. Even if the queue looks big, people are generally very reasonable, a queue is formed and people are quick to get on the charger and let the next person in ASAP.

On that stretch, Banbury and Birmingham both have a larger number of faster v3 chargers, it's a little bit of shame you didn't have enough charge left to push a little further.

I was stuck at gretna for 4.5 hours on the 27th thats including charging for 30 min , had to explain to whsmiths so they could log with parking eye so no overstay fine , absolute shitfest

 

[init6]

I was stuck at gretna for 4.5 hours on the 27th thats including charging for 30 min , had to explain to whsmiths so they could log with parking eye so no overstay fine , absolute shitfest

You could have pushed the car to the next charging point in that time. Why wait so long?

 

[Sean.]

The chargers are limited by the number of Amps they can provide.

As I understand it, the limiting factor is the current supplied through the pedestal charging cable, which is cooled - but there would be a limit to how much heat can be dissipated by the design.

 

[candida]

You’ll never get 350kw, you need an 800V battery system for that and Tesla is 400V.

The chargers are limited by the number of Amps they can provide. Volts x amps = power in Kw. On a 400V system, I think the max power they can provide is ~175kw.

Tesla V3 super chargers provide the highest number of amps which is why they can go up to ~250kw @400V.

It could be any number of reasons why you didn’t get the full power including from the car and the charger. It would be good if both the car and the charger gave an indicator as to why. If you are ever on a KemPower charger it will tell you if the speed is car or charger limited.

Yep, I know I can’t get 350. But what I had was disappointing. Good site though.

 

[Astrape]

I was at the new 12 stall Gridserve at Reading this morning. It was empty. But, but… I’d preconditioned and only got 98kw from the supposed 350

Strange, what was your SOC? How long was a the precondition? I stopped at Redbridge Oxford new 12 stall type 3s on the return journey from London to Forest of Dean on Sunday, SOC 19%. Energy screen was predicting -7% at destination so I added 12% in 5 minutes, initial charge rate showed at 170kW on the screen. Teslafi recorded the charge as starting at 140kW and ending at 110kW. I guess these high values are highly dependant on SOC and battery temperature. This splash gave me a predicted arrival with 5% SOC which was exactly on the Jules.

 

[Simavon]

Currently charging at at Tebay. The car tried to divert to Gretna due to a wait here. But obviously it old everyone else as well and so soon Gretna had a wait. Net effect was to waste some energy preconditioning until I overrode it. When I arrived at Tebay there were 3 slots available.

 

[Simavon]

I got a charge at Fastned in Hamilton. Wouldn’t accept octopus card, had to use contactless so didn’t get the discount.

 

[Adopado]

Strange, what was your SOC? How long was a the precondition? I stopped at Redbridge Oxford new 12 stall type 3s on the return journey from London to Forest of Dean on Sunday, SOC 19%. Energy screen was predicting -7% at destination so I added 12% in 5 minutes, initial charge rate showed at 170kW on the screen. Teslafi recorded the charge as starting at 140kW and ending at 110kW. I guess these high values are highly dependant on SOC and battery temperature. This splash gave me a predicted arrival with 5% SOC which was exactly on the Jules.

As you may know 170kW is the max for a Model 3 RWD (and the previous SR+ models). SR+ was 100kW until a software update lifted it to 170 ... sometimes goes a touch above that on a V3 actually.

 

[DaveNN]

I was stuck at gretna for 4.5 hours on the 27th thats including charging for 30 min , had to explain to whsmiths so they could log with parking eye so no overstay fine , absolute shitfest

Mine tried to send me that way on the 27th too.
Oh..and Tebay too.
Decided to ignore..glad I did.

 

[neuralsandwich]

how's the glasgow - midlands journey if done via Adderstone/scotch corner these days? was this charging ok when tebay/gretna were clogged?

Not Glasgow but I've done Fife to Cambridge 4 times since September and going via Gretna I got stuck in a queue for an hour. Managed to get a charge at the Ionity finally but I checked a few times and there were 2 Porche's charging for near dead to full.

Adderstone is the only reliable way down south in my eyes. 2 more stalls and no power sharing. Only once I've even seen more than 3 stalls being full. Scotch corner is the only other issue on that route for me. Depending when I am leaving it can get quite busy, power sharing Gen 2s and quite a small car park makes it awkward but there is a cafe to get a drink at while you wait.

 

[scdoubleu]

I drove from East Mids to Stirling on Dec 27 in my MYLR. Knew chances were high of long queues at Scotch Corner/Tebay/Gretna/Abington, so stopped at Charnock Richard SC after taking the A50 across to the M6. Got straight on the last SC out of 12, then went to grab a bite to eat at the services.

By the time I returned 20 minutes later, the queue was 6 deep. Curiously, the car made no attempt to limit my charge to 80% due to SC congestion. Instead, the nav suggested my next stop would be Eurocentral, which required I depart with a bit over 90% in the tank. Felt a bit guilty hogging an SC while others queued but there really wasn't any other option; every SC to the north was showing a wait. In any case, SC turnover was decent considering the 12 stalls available at Charnock Richard.

I did attempt a comfort stop at Gretna (for some caffeine and a stretch) but gave up; the car park was absolutely rammed. Saw a large line of queuing Teslas - super glad I did not have to take on any electrons there!

Arrived on 10% at Eurocentral, straight onto an SC for a quick splash-n-dash.

More EV charging capacity on that route can't come soon enough.

 

[thewishy]

By the time I returned 20 minutes later, the queue was 6 deep. Curiously, the car made no attempt to limit my charge to 80% due to SC congestion. Instead, the nav suggested my next stop would be Eurocentral, which required I depart with a bit over 90% in the tank. Felt a bit guilty hogging an SC while others queued but there really wasn't any other option; every SC to the north was showing a wait. In any case, SC turnover was decent considering the 12 stalls available at Charnock Richard.

Absolutely not your fault that you had to go to a higher SOC, and with a v2 charger, your "buddy" would likely have picked up the rest of the 150kw capacity. But it does go to show how poor capacity in one stretch then cascades further down, and causes general congestion for hundreds of miles each way.

It's always great to get to one of the 16 bay v3's at the end of a bad section and lob 200+kw into the pack

 

[Simavon]

The idea of going low and charging fast and often only works if you can be confident of getting a charge when you need it.

 

[neuralsandwich]

The Gen2 chargers power sharing is just a mad idea. I don't know why they thought having a charge site that goes slower when it's getting full was a good idea. Replacing the Gen2 with Gen3 would help a fair bit at most these sites.

Gretna or Abington going to Gen3 and doubling in size would hopefully easy the busy holidays

 

[DeejUK]

The Gen2 chargers power sharing is just a mad idea. I don't know why they thought having a charge site that goes slower when it's getting full was a good idea.

It's very frustrating, and leads to all sorts of ill-temper between Tesla drivers trying to charge. I had no idea about it until the first time I parked next to someone, and get a rather uncharitable telling-off from the guy I parked next to.

I would expect rather than anyone thinking it was a good idea, it was a cost/benefit/risk trade-off when the Supercharger network was new, and it wasn't clear how much take-up there'd be. Plus, the idea of having car chargers drawing potentially a gigawatt was probably new then too, and the local infrastructure wasn't up to scratch. Then the v2s were installed, the Model 3 and Y were still aspirations and Tesla were selling what, about 10% as many cars? So it was probably a pragmatic choice at the time.

I just wish they'd hurry up and install more Norway-style charging stations in the UK. The Maidstone Supercharger is particularly pants.

 

[thewishy]

At the time, the v2s doing 150kw between two was reasonable enough. There wasn't *that much* of the charge cycle above 100kw anyway, so if you've got one car at the top of the charge cycle, and one at the bottom, it balanced out. Now you can pull 200+kw on a M3LR or 170 on a M3SR, it's much more of an issue.

Worth noting that the V3s still have *some* power sharing and a battery, they certainly can't pull 750kw per 3 stools for an extended period.