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No-license drivers?

Discussion in 'Autonomous Vehicles' started by Robert831, Aug 2, 2017.

  1. Robert831

    Robert831 Member

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    Will people who can't get a driver's license be able to "drive" the fully autonomous version once it becomes available? I know the law probably currently says no, but maybe that will change? This could be very liberating for people who can't get a license due to medical conditions, a disability, or DUI status, etc.

    Maybe even children would be "driving" to school? I'm not sure how that would work, but I imagine there would need to be some safety lockouts and remote monitoring, so they don't push the wrong buttons and end up in another state. Or get in the wrong car and end up at someone else's house!
     
  2. kev1n

    kev1n Member

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    i doubt it because someone would still need to be behind the wheel as a backup
     
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  3. Tam

    Tam Active Member

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    #3 Tam, Aug 2, 2017
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2017
    Right now, only 3 states allow a car without a driver running around on its own as long as it obeys traffic laws.

    Michigan goes further by allowing a car without any driver's controls such as steering wheel, accelerator, brakes...

    So, for your question, the answer is yes.

    It is not happening now because currently, no manufacturers can produce such a car for those 3 states, not because of the laws.
     
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  4. Tam

    Tam Active Member

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    That's the job of car manufacturers.

    It's easy for Tesla to use software to lockout all functions so a rider can't mess around with the car's settings, including steering, braking, speed...



    That should be easy: Tesla car would only open the doors if a rider's cell phone Bluetooth is approaching.
     
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  5. Phillip L

    Phillip L Gas Passer

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    That will be a totally life changing thing for people as they get too old to drive. The sudden loss of one's independence with the loss of a driver's licence will not be the often devastating thing it can be now to the elderly (who have the means). What politicians will try to thwart the wishes of the elderly voter bloc once self-driving cars have been shown to be safe?
     
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  6. animorph

    animorph Member

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    If the car can drive itself without a driver, and be used as a taxi on the Tesla Network, it can definitely be used by someone without a license. Certainly autonomous car makers will have to convince plenty of regulators/politicians to make that happen. And I don't think that would mean that someone not licensed would be allowed to drive, as in steer and control the speed in real time. The car would have to be in control.
     
  7. timk225

    timk225 Member

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    I don't think the law would allow some worthless POS drunk to get around their DUI restrictions. No driving means no driving.

    For old people, however, the level 5 autonomy would be good.
     
  8. Robert831

    Robert831 Member

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    A person who has had their license revoked because of DUI is allowed to be a passenger in a car, correct? If the car is doing the driving, then they are the passenger. Maybe they would have a special restriction of not being allowed to sit in the "driver" seat, or they would need the manual controls disabled, etc.
     
  9. tander

    tander Active Member

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    My Grandpa had to give up driving and the transition has been rough. Cars were a huge deal for him, he still talks about cranking his Dad's Model T. Personally I'd much rather go for a hike, but considering his age and that he still has WWII shrapnel in his legs, he loved going for long Sunday drives, where the only walking was maybe in the McDonald's parking lot. I've got an early m3 reservation and just offered it to my parents in hopes that they get it for him to cruise around with his ladyfriends (my Grandma passed many years ago). It would be a huge thing for him, and also for my parents who end up driving him all over. Hopefully my Grandpa sticks around long enough for this, I'm looking forward to seeing all these old farts on the road again:)
    I think of it as more of a safety thing for other drivers than a punishment sort of thing. Besides I'd rather they puke in their own cars than if I was taxi driver.
     
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  10. Phillip L

    Phillip L Gas Passer

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    Just was mentioning at work the other day that there were a lot of ebikes around. Someone told me that a lot of them are people who have lost their licenses from dui's etc. I would rather them in a driverless vehicle.
     
  11. Garlan Garner

    Garlan Garner Well-Known Member

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    Autopilot does not drive cars. People do.

    According to current Insurance companies - People have to be the liable parties in an accident. Not Cars.

    Insurance companies aren't insuring inanimate objects yet.
     
  12. Robert831

    Robert831 Member

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    Since fully automated driving has never existed before, then of course insurance companies don't know how to deal with it. Yet. Probably the owner of the car would be the liable party.
     
  13. Garlan Garner

    Garlan Garner Well-Known Member

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    They know indeed how to handle it. Rule is: the person in the drivers seat is the liable party. Its always been that way.
     
  14. kort677

    kort677 Banned

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    this is a case where the technologies are way ahead of the legalities. there are little worries here because FSD is still a long way aways and hopefully by then the regulators will update the laws regarding this issue.
     
  15. Garlan Garner

    Garlan Garner Well-Known Member

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    I don't think its a "regulators" issue.

    Ok. Flip the script. What if you are hit by an autonomous driving car? Lets say that an elderly person was the only one in the car - in the passengers seat.

    You want your car fixed and the elderly person says "I didn't do anything". And that's absolutely true.

    Who do you sue?
     
  16. kort677

    kort677 Banned

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    like I said, the laws are not up to the technology, you can be sure that the millions of ambulance chasing lawyers will have had this sorted out way before a fully autonomous car ever becomes available for the consumer.
     
  17. Tam

    Tam Active Member

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    Elon explained as if you own an elevator.

    There used to be a licensed elevator operator as illustrated by this film:

    [​IMG]

    You could hold that operator responsible and have him fired because he kept arguing that you said "thirteen" while you told him very clearly "thirty" and now you are on the wrong floor!

    Now, there's no more elevator operator but if there's something wrong, the owner can be held liable.

    Thus, the owner's building has insurance.

    That would be the same with your car. There used to be a driver. There won't be one. But you still need an insurance for a driverless car.
     
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  18. jgalak

    jgalak Member

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    Inanimate property is insured all the time - think real estate. Someone gets hurt on your property, you are liable, whether you caused it or not. Which is why there's homeowners insurance.

    Same with a self drive car. Owner will always be liable. So owner will have insurance.
     

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