"non refurbished" CPOs?

[bmah]

Hi Bruce. Thanks. I think this is it: CPOs "not refurbished"?

Yeah, the trick is that it's in the "Tesla for Sale" sub-forum of "Marketplace", where I don't have moderator privileges. So either: 1) someone who moderates "Marketplace" can move it to one of the Model S forums, and then I can merge it, or 2) someone at a higher pay-grade than me, who has moderator privileges in both this sub-forum and "Tesla for Sale" can do the whole thing in one shot. I asked a site admin to try to handle this.

Clear as mud, right?

Bruce.

 

[HankLloydRight]

I think you should ask for a raise to double your salary.

 

[P85Dave]

See an update here via Electrek:

Tesla stops ‘refurbishing’ its used cars ahead of big influx of leased vehicles coming back

So basically:

1- Sorry we can't deal with the increasing number of lease returns, so if you really want a car, you'll go through the hoops and pay for the refurb:
==> So, math 101: if you have leased more cars, more cars are going to come back at the end of the lease. Maybe you should have planned for it?. Heads up: you did a bunch of 2-year deals 2 years ago, esp in Q3 2016...these cars are coming back soon.

2-Prospect want pics? Prospect is going to have to ask for them.
==> That's going to scale well: prospect --> OA --> Where is the car? --> someone on location taking pictures --> OA --> prospect. --> Car not good? Let's do it all over again. --> oh wait I found one but now I need to understand how much it's going to cost me to fix --> too expensive? --> let's do it all over again, again and again.


Telsa, I love you. But sometimes, I just don't.

I honestly don't see how this is going to work for Tesla or their customers either other than have a bunch of customers who are going to have their Tesla purchase experience ruined and Tesla employees who can barely keep up with the workload as it is having to now track down cars and email photos?

How is the photo emailing going to go? "Um. I received the photos but they are really grainy and I can't make out much detail. Can you please resend larger photos in better lighting where I can see more detail?" And what happens when some damage is not obvious on one of the photos, a customer goes to pick up the car, and throws a fit? What happens when after the photos are taken the car gets trashed as a loaner. Who pays for the refurbishment then because that was not disclosed. This is going to be a complete disaster.

Someone at Tesla really needs to talk to one of their family members and ask them if you were going to buy a used car for $75,000 what would you need to see and how would you like to be treated and it is not likely to be how Tesla wants to treat their customers with this policy.

Can they evaluate each car, auction off cars that are not in good condition, and then refurbish and sell the cars that are in decent condition. Tesla really need to figure out a consistent experience.

Otherwise they should offer Refurbished cars at a certain price and offer non refurbished cars at a discounted price. What is not going to fly is pricing cars high AND refusing to refurbish the cars as I don;t think many people are looking to pay a lot and pay for damage caused by someone else.

 

[P85Dave]

I think you should ask for a raise to double your salary.

Or at least complimentary refurbishing for a used Tesla

 

[Astraviel]

I honestly don't see how this is going to work for Tesla or their customers either other than have a bunch of customers who are going to have their Tesla purchase experience ruined and Tesla employees who can barely keep up with the workload as it is having to now track down cars and email photos?

How is the photo emailing going to go? "Um. I received the photos but they are really grainy and I can't make out much detail. Can you please resend larger photos in better lighting where I can see more detail?" And what happens when some damage is not obvious on one of the photos, a customer goes to pick up the car, and throws a fit? What happens when after the photos are taken the car gets trashed as a loaner. Who pays for the refurbishment then because that was not disclosed. This is going to be a complete disaster.

Someone at Tesla really needs to talk to one of their family members and ask them if you were going to buy a used car for $75,000 what would you need to see and how would you like to be treated and it is not likely to be how Tesla wants to treat their customers with this policy.

Can they evaluate each car, auction off cars that are not in good condition, and then refurbish and sell the cars that are in decent condition. Tesla really need to figure out a consistent experience.

Otherwise they should offer Refurbished cars at a certain price and offer non refurbished cars at a discounted price. What is not going to fly is pricing cars high AND refusing to refurbish the cars as I don;t think many people are looking to pay a lot and pay for damage caused by someone else.

Ideally they would be doing it how other high-end car dealers do it. I had no issues buying a Porsche CPO in the past after looking at it in person and viewing photos.

 

[P85Dave]

Ideally they would be doing it how other high-end car dealers do it. I had no issues buying a Porsche CPO in the past after looking at it in person and viewing photos.

Except do you see any aspect of this that they are doing similar to how high end car dealers do things?

I bet someone is going to hurriedly take a bunch of random cellphone photos and email it as that's what they did to a previous CPO car we were interested in.

We once bought a CPO Mercedes from Mercedes Benz of Manhattan (one of the few Mercedes dealerships actually owned by Mercedes the company) and I bought it without seeing it in person because they sent high resolution photos of the car, and a through list of everything they've done to refurbish the car. Tesla is doing none of that.

 

[Astraviel]

Except do you see any aspect of this that they are doing similar to how high end car dealers do things?

No, but that's the point. If Tesla wants to continue being a top producer of electric cars, they better get their act together before makers like Porsche and Audi and Jaguar eclipse Tesla in terms of quality and reliable service in the next couple of years. I can't fathom a company like Porsche for example selling me a disgustingly serviced CPO.

 

[P85Dave]

No, but that's the point. If Tesla wants to continue being a top producer of electric cars, they better get their act together before makers like Porsche and Audi and Jaguar eclipse Tesla in terms of quality and reliable service in the next couple of years. I can't fathom a company like Porsche for example selling me a disgustingly serviced CPO.

Totally agree. For all the flack dealers get for very legitimate reasons, selling CPO cars is something that they do extremely well by delivering like new cars that are a few years old resulting in a great customer experience without some of the unpleasantness associated with buying a used car.

 

[gaswalla]

Elon needs to stop sleeping on the factory floor and track down the guy who thought of this plan.

 

[barjohn]

I don't think their extended warranty offering will be enough to convince people to pay their CPO price so they may be sitting on a lot of used Teslas.

 

[Dathong01]

What happens when you order a car and pay shipping costs and comes in looking like “crap”?

 

[Super_Popular]

What happens when you order a car and pay shipping costs and comes in looking like “crap”?

You refuse it until they make it right or walk away.

 

[Olle]

You refuse it until they make it right or walk away.

Unless the car is expected to not be refurbished. I bought a couple of cars at Off Lease Only, knowing they would be "as is". Sure enough, one of them was totally gross -a price I was willing to pay to avoid a traditional dealership (=talking to salespeople, wasting time, paying junk fees and so on.) I may be OK buying a gross car from Tesla too, for the exact same reason. If they explicitly tell me beforehand that it could be gross. It's all about expectations.

 

[hmmm]

Except do you see any aspect of this that they are doing similar to how high end car dealers do things?

I bet someone is going to hurriedly take a bunch of random cellphone photos and email it as that's what they did to a previous CPO car we were interested in.

We once bought a CPO Mercedes from Mercedes Benz of Manhattan (one of the few Mercedes dealerships actually owned by Mercedes the company) and I bought it without seeing it in person because they sent high resolution photos of the car, and a through list of everything they've done to refurbish the car. Tesla is doing none of that.

For "fun", here is an internal doc re. the refurb process for Mercedes Benz CPOs (page 30 to 37):

http://assets.mbusa.com/vcm/CAC_RAPMD/images/CPOprogramandreconditioningmanual.pdf

And picture-wise, I would also have low expectations. These guys are doing it reasonably well (link for "wear and tear" pictures below the main listing pics:
Buy a used 2008 Tesla Roadster

I like @P85Dave 's idea of refurb vs. non-refurb CPOs, ie it's all about expectations...but man I wish I had bought a CPO last week.

Also, heads up, my 2016 P90DL lease is ending in Feb '2019 and I *KNOW* it will be in great shape, inside and out, if anyone is interested.

 

[Electricious]

Unless the car is expected to not be refurbished. I bought a couple of cars at Off Lease Only, knowing they would be "as is". Sure enough, one of them was totally gross -a price I was willing to pay to avoid a traditional dealership (=talking to salespeople, wasting time, paying junk fees and so on.) I may be OK buying a gross car from Tesla too, for the exact same reason. If they explicitly tell me beforehand that it could be gross. It's all about expectations.

IMHO Tesla should not be in the business of selling gross cars.

New or used, when Tesla sells a car, it should meet certain standards beyond the car working "mechanically."

 

[tbone586]

My CPO rep said that as part of the new plan, buyer has a period of time (either 24 or 48 hrs...can't remember which) in which to return the car and receive a full refund. So that's some protection.

 

[Super_Popular]

My CPO rep said that as part of the new plan, buyer has a period of time (either 24 or 48 hrs...can't remember which) in which to return the car and receive a full refund. So that's some protection.

Yes, I was told the same thing when I placed my order. If the car arrives and it's awful and they don't make it right you can return it within 24 hours for a full refund. However I always inspect my Tesla's outdoors, so I can see the car clearly. Learned that the hard way and it only took once.

It's kind of sad that we have to treat Tesla like the enemy when picking up our cars, with checklists and whatnot. Really shows a long history of bad deliveries. Yet, I just ordered my 11th Tesla.

3> you Elon.

 

[Super_Popular]

So some news on the forefront. Most teslas currently listed for sale have been refurbished. So if you look at Hanks site look for the older “date added” cars and if it was say before April it was refurbished. The P85D I bought was, thank god! The pics they sent look really good.

 

[Electricious]

So some news on the forefront. Most teslas currently listed for sale have been refurbished. So if you look at Hanks site look for the older “date added” cars and if it was say before April it was refurbished. The P85D I bought was, thank god! The pics they sent look really good.

But how can that be though because it seems many of the CPO cars are used as loaners and in the past they seem to have refurbished cars only when someone buys it. I don't recall someone buying a CPO car that was already refurbished where they only had to ship it. Seems the usual routine is someone buys a CPO car, they then have to find it and figure out who is driving it as a loaner, have the customer return the loaner, and then ship and refurbish the car before delivery.

 

[DanKC]

But how can that be though because it seems many of the CPO cars are used as loaners and in the past they seem to have refurbished cars only when someone buys it. I don't recall someone buying a CPO car that was already refurbished where they only had to ship it. Seems the usual routine is someone buys a CPO car, they then have to find it and figure out who is driving it as a loaner, have the customer return the loaner, and then ship and refurbish the car before delivery.

That wasn't my understanding of the old process (certainly could be wrong though). My understanding was that once they were accepted as a CPO, that they went into the refurb queue. It's just that it it usually only took a short time for someone to buy it once it hit the website, so they ended up waiting for a few weeks while it shipped to the refurb facility and went through the process. Some loaners end up as CPO cars for sure, but I believe they made a clean break once they deemed it "CPO worthy". As for trade-ins being used as loaners, I would also find that pretty surprising. Those would either go to CPO or auction. When you get a loaner, you don't want something with 50K that's got someone's gum stuck in the cupholder.