NYT article: Stalled on the EV Highway

[vfx]

Are those "Angel/Devil Horns"?

:wink:

 

[dsm363]

With minimal effort, the Model S is the perfect day trip car. With modest effort, it is a decent road trip car. It will take a long time until travel with an EV is as easy as an ICE car but those kinds of trips are uncommon for many people. For those people that need a long range, no compromises car then maybe an ICE or hybrid is the way to go.

 

[Beavis]

The guy is an automotive journalist, not some uninformed clown, right? Clearly, as a journalist he is supposed to investigate and report. His excuse that "Tesla didn't tell me to (fill in the blank)" doesn't fly with me. He should have done his homework, familiarized himself with the manual, and then driven the car like a real owner would. A real owner would range charge and not park the car in extreme cold without plugging in. A real owner would not leave a charging station with less projected miles than it takes to get to his destination. In that sense, his report is disingenuous at best. The skeptic in me says he set this up intentionally to sell papers but that Elon is also overstating his position to sell cars. We'll see when the logs are released.

 

[Krugerrand]

But that's not what "road trip" conjures in the average American's mind; culturally, we think "Vegas on a moment's notice".

Well, perhaps it's time for the average American's mind to culturally mature and get over it already. The spoiled rotten brat is going to be stamping their feet in a tantrum when gas prices continue to rise.

Instead, Elon should have been in a position to say "guy's a nimrod; we told him not to take that trip, but he did it anyway. You should ask him why." But even if he's within his rights to do so, Elon can only cry "fake" so many times before people hear "wolf".

Disagree completely on what Mr. Musk's position should be and your last is entirely unfair. He's always been open to criticism and welcomes it regardless of how it's delivered if it makes a legitimate point. He doesn't go around crying fake. Perhaps you just think he does because he carries a big stick and swings it liberally when he feels he's been wronged?

You have to be an idiot of the dictionary kind to leave that hotel without enough charge. I wouldn't care if Mr. Musk himself was on the other end of the phone telling me I could go 75 miles when the car only indicated I had 35 (or whatever those figures were). I get up in the morning, see that, and I'm all over putting my jammies back on and ordering room service for breakfast, while the car charges. When there's enough charge I go on my way, and when I reach my destination I view how much charge I have left and if all the extra charge I put on is still available, then I'm back on the phone with Mr. Musk saying, 'Dang, I don't know how that happened, but you were right.'

Trust, but verify. Yep, that's a good moto to live by under all sorts of circumstance.

 

[CapitalistOppressor]

I still can't understand taking off with less range than you need to make your trip though 32 miles of range for a 65 mile trip).

Me either. None of the other issues resulted in the car being towed. The best interpretation (for him) is that he was still thinking the pack was cold soaked and had more power than it said. Unfortunately, that was true at the hotel, but not true after sitting for half an hour with the heat running, then driving 11 miles, then charging for an hour.

As to the rest, he claims he knew the difference between a Standard charge and a Range charge and just chose not to do it because he didn't think he needed it, and because he didn't want to damage the battery. No real explanation for not charging longer at the second SuperCharger except that he didn't think he needed it.

My problem with the initial story is that he never points out that he continually made decisions to not fully charge the car. Most readers are left with the impression that he is exploring the limits of the car, when in fact he is just exploring the limits of his own ignorance.

 

[vfx]

... Range charge and just chose not to do it because he didn't think he needed it, and because he didn't want to damage the battery.....

First time in recorded history that someone with a loaner cared about the long term damage to the car?

 

[anticitizen13.7]

One thing that I hope that the automotive journalism world picks up on is how vociferous a defense actual owners of the Model S are making for the vehicle. I think that says a lot for both the general quality and exceptional experience that the Model S provides for its drivers.

 

[Beavis]

You are assuming the driver understands the importance of the "Max Range" button on a 200 mile trip.... maybe he assumed it was an easy trip because it's just 200 miles which can be accomplished in an ICE without thought.[/URL]"

I'm not buying this. I would assume that someone who is a professional and writing a review of a car with new technology is smart enough and diligent enough to familiarize himself with the most basic operation of the vehicle before heading out on a road trip.

 

[Beavis]

My problem with the initial story is that he never points out that he continually made decisions to not fully charge the car. Most readers are left with the impression that he is exploring the limits of the car, when in fact he is just exploring the limits of his own ignorance.

I love this. That's exactly it.

 

[evchels]

One thing that I hope that the automotive journalism world picks up on is how vociferous a defense actual owners of the Model S are making for the vehicle. I think that says a lot for both the general quality and exceptional experience that the Model S provides for its drivers.

And that's exactly the experience I'd prefer to see featured by all EV co's in their marketing and PR efforts.

 

[dsm363]

First time in recorded history that someone with a loaner cared about the long term damage to the car?

Exactly. For example, McLaren gives an automotive journalist an F1 and says 'take it out to the track'. I bet anything that journalist wouldn't average 50 mph around the track and do gentle acceleration runs on the straightaways.

 

[vfx]

Lest we forget the author's previous EV article from March of last year.
The Electric Car, Unplugged - NYTimes.com

Yet the state of the electric car is dismal, the victim of hyped expectations, technological flops, high costs and a hostile political climate. General Motors has temporarily suspended production of the plug-in electric Chevy Volt because of low sales. Nissan’s all-electric Leaf is struggling in the market. A number of start-up electric vehicle and battery companies have folded. And the federal government has slowed its multibillion-dollar program of support for advanced technology vehicles in the face of market setbacks and heavy political criticism.

 

[Discoducky]

The guy is an automotive journalist, not some uninformed clown, right? Clearly, as a journalist he is supposed to investigate and report. His excuse that "Tesla didn't tell me to (fill in the blank)" doesn't fly with me. He should have done his homework, familiarized himself with the manual, and then driven the car like a real owner would. A real owner would range charge and not park the car in extreme cold without plugging in. A real owner would not leave a charging station with less projected miles than it takes to get to his destination. In that sense, his report is disingenuous at best. The skeptic in me says he set this up intentionally to sell papers but that Elon is also overstating his position to sell cars. We'll see when the logs are released.

My thoughts as well. Did he realize he could do a range charge? Of course he did. Did he make a conscious decision to NOT do a range charge? Of course he did. Did he know he should plug in at night especially when it's freezing cold outside? Not a doubt in my mind. Did he speed? No question. In a sense, I believe he drove the car like someone who was pissed he had to plug it in at all. Did he know where hotels/motels were that would accommodate EV's? Most likely. Did he make a conscious decision to NOT use one of those hotels/motels. Most likely. Sorry, but that is how it comes across IMNSHO (InMyNotSoHumbleOpinion) as none of this is provable. This seems like he was given or had a goal of "get a picture of your car being towed".

 

[Norbert]

why 'lucky'? He says he "drove, slowly, to Stonington" which is perfectly sensible if he was trying to conserve range for the return trip.

That's great, but as a novice, he can't rely on that working exactly as planned, and nothing else coming in the way. Obviously you have to know that you won't be able to use ubiquitous gas stations (who made me say that? ).

In addition to my previous answer: While a novice might not guess this, it may be interesting to know that you actually save total travel time if you charge longer at a Supercharger, so that you can drive faster. Even better if you can use the time at the charger to do something, like surfing the internet, or sit in a coffee shop and read a book. Or the New York Times.

- - - Updated - - -

And that's exactly the experience I'd prefer to see featured by all EV co's in their marketing and PR efforts.

It's not one or the other. Tesla does both. And three battery sizes, with either no supercharging, optional supercharging, or included supercharging. Given the upcoming new Harris Ranch Supercharger station will have 10 stalls, it's obviously popular.

 

[Bearman]

Well his defense was he charged to 90%... so he knew he could charge more.
Btw he didnt forget to charge his camera and the only picture in the article is this one:

Masterfully planned and choreographed.
"A little more to the right...ok hold it"

The guy in the picture is the tow-guy, wonder what was said to him during the trip back to the charger.

 

[Odenator]

Based upon my recent experience of almost draining my battery on a road trip, for me, the main takeaway from this NYT article is that the battery has 20 miles of actual range left, driving at 45mph in 30 degree temps when the battery indicator shows zero.

 

[strider]

Well, I'm sure I'll get negative reputation points for this but who cares. I did not read the initial article but I did read Elon's tweets and the response posted in this thread. It was well-reasoned and calm, unlike Elon's tweets. I think Elon is a great visionary guy and I believe in his products (I've put my money where my mouth is) but he really should be muzzled in the face of any criticism. He comes off like a child throwing a tantrum. I have a 2-year-old so I've become a bit of an expert of late.

Bottom line is that Vampire load at night in the cold is a serious issue w/ Model S in its current state. I am confident they will figure out the right software bits to tweak to fix this but right now it's a real problem and that is a fact. No amount of Elon's whining can fix that - only solid engineering. The reporter lost 65 miles of range overnight w/ the car just sitting there. That is a serious amount of energy to disappear. Yes, he should have plugged in. But a person who is used to driving an ICE would not expect their range to drop while the car is turned off. Tesla should have made sure he plugged in at the overnight stop.

Tesla needs to get better at managing the press during these outings to make sure they're successful.

 

[brianman]

The guy in the picture is the tow-guy, wonder what was said to him during the trip back to the charger.

Any idea how to tip the tow truck driver for having to deal with this reporter? Maybe he has a paypal account?

 

[Norbert]

Well, I'm sure I'll get negative reputation points for this but who cares. I did not read the initial article but I did read Elon's tweets and the response posted in this thread. It was well-reasoned and calm, unlike Elon's tweets. I think Elon is a great visionary guy and I believe in his products (I've put my money where my mouth is) but he really should be muzzled in the face of any criticism. He comes off like a child throwing a tantrum. I have a 2-year-old so I've become a bit of an expert of late.

Bottom line is that Vampire load at night in the cold is a serious issue w/ Model S in its current state. I am confident they will figure out the right software bits to tweak to fix this but right now it's a real problem and that is a fact. No amount of Elon's whining can fix that - only solid engineering. The reporter lost 65 miles of range overnight w/ the car just sitting there. That is a serious amount of energy to disappear. Yes, he should have plugged in. But a person who is used to driving an ICE would not expect their range to drop while the car is turned off. Tesla should have made sure he plugged in at the overnight stop.

Tesla needs to get better at managing the press during these outings to make sure they're successful.

I'm not giving a neg rep point, but I'd like to point out that (in my mind) the fact that the article touches upon a real issue, doesn't make it a good article. It's a bad one nevertheless. (As I argued over in the other thread, so no need to repeat, I hope, as these points are not specific to the "response" in the OP of this thread.)

 

[SebastianR]

What amazes me is how many people seem to have this irrational desire to get stranded: The NYT article is not the first review I read where people behave crazy to "test range". No rational human being drives an ICE to empty just to "feel how it is".

People, if you want to test range, drive in circles - don't get stranded in the middle of nowhere without a charger. We make fun of people taking a "short trip to the desert" and not bringing water - what on earth makes people think it is a good idea to get purposely stranded on the road?

Bottom line for me is: If you want to test the car's driving, drive it like you mean it and charge it accordingly. If you want to test the range, drive in circles. Don't mix these two - or you will have a bad time.