Octopus Go vs EDF GoElectric Tariffs

[PITA]

I've just been number crunching and created a Spreadsheet of our last 4 months electric energy use.

The data has come from Octopus Go Smart Meter downloaded consumption (daily at 30 minute intervals).

Current Tariff : Octopus Go
5p : Off Peak
13.72p : Peak
25p Daily Standing Charge

Optional New Tariff : Octopus Go
7.5p : Off Peak
30.78p : Peak
25.08p Daily Standing Charge

Optional New Tariff : EDF GoElectric
4.5p : Off Peak
36p : Peak
27p : Daily Standing Charge

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

During the last 4 Months we used 6,135 kWh

Current Tariff cost us : £ 398.07
Optional New Octopus Go : £ 703.88
Optional New EDF GoElec : £ 591.26

So at the moment EDF would be a better Tariff (but I hate dealing with EDF)... and I think EDF do not have any means of tracking your electric usage. So I'd have to rely on my other apps (Tesla, SolarEdge) etc.

 

[PITA]

What I find very interesting as well.

Those off-peak hours, where we download electric to the car or our two Tesla Powerwalls... they're saving us a small fortune..... just by downloading overnight (compared to the daytime peak rate)

On our current Octopus Go Tariff, we saved £ 443.74

On the new Octopus Go Tariff, we would save £ 1,184.67

On the new EDF GoElectric Tariff, we would save £ 1,617.57

That's starting to build up into a lot of cash... especially as it's only over 4 MONTHS

So Smart Meters and battery storage ROI is getting much better...

 

[ACarneiro]

Also, it’s a Dual Fuel tariff with ridiculous exit fees so there is that to take into account.
I’m not sure if, and by how much, more expensive their gas is.

 

[ACarneiro]

What I find very interesting as well.

Those off-peak hours, where we download electric to the car or our two Tesla Powerwalls... they're saving us a small fortune.

On our current Octopus Go Tariff, we saved £ 443.74 .... just by downloading overnight

On the new Octopus Go Tariff, we would save £ 1,184.67 .... just by downloading overnight

On the new EDF GoElectric Tariff, we would save £ 1,617.57 .... just by downloading overnight

That's starting to build up into a lot of cash... especially as it's only over 4 MONTHS

Same here.
I’m actually almost coming to the point of doing the man-maths for 2 more (if I can get them, that is)

 

[PITA]

Also, it’s a Dual Fuel tariff with ridiculous exit fees so there is that to take into account.
I’m not sure if, and by how much, more expensive their gas is.

Yeah... I hate EDF... I really do.

Even though the new Octopus Energy Go Tariff is higher, I think I'll just stay with them. (I might put them under competitive pressure from EDF rates, and see if they'll flex a little bit?... who knows).

But at least with Octopus I can get access to the data to crunch over, and it's only an issue over Winter anyways. During Summer we've got the Solar Energy bumping us along nicely.

 

[Llama.]

This is a helpful post. It’s a shame that energy prices are going up so much.

I’m currently on Octopus Go. But my tariff ends in a couple of weeks.

Octopus have sent me an email suggesting a terrible tariff to go on to. But I can’t see how I can move on to their new Octopus Go tarrif on the website.

Is there some special trick to moving to the new Go tarrif? Do you have to just phone them?

 

[ACarneiro]

I think either phoning or emailing will suffice.
Some people have just done nothing and saw their Go rates renewed so that’s an option if you’re willing to risk it.

 

[PITA]

Same here.
I’m actually almost coming to the point of doing the man-maths for 2 more (if I can get them, that is)

I've seriously thought of buying one more... but held back.

I'd rather now bank the cash, and wait for the new 4680 cell Powerwall 3 with larger capacity.

In the meantime, stomach the small uplift in grid tariff cost for the missing extra 13.5kWh...

I've even considered a ground mounted 4kW Solar Array extension and 'Swift - brand' Wind Power generator

 

[Epico]

I've not heard anything from octopus about my go renewal, there is nothing on there website about an expiry date and they only ever bill me when I ask them...with everyone getting renewal quote I am very much not rocking the boat and seeing howo go I can get away with stay on my current tariff (5p overnight and 13p the rest...right now with an 8.2kw battery and solar I am making it most of the day on the batteries overnight top up

 

[Llama.]

I think either phoning or emailing will suffice.
Some people have just done nothing and saw their Go rates renewed so that’s an option if you’re willing to risk it.

Thanks for that. I’ll give them a ring. Hopefully they won’t try and tell me that Go is unavailable.

Sorry this is a little off topic. But I’m trying to find the silver lining with these energy price rises. I think with higher electricity cost, the break even date on my solar panels just got shorter!

 

[ACarneiro]

I've seriously thought of buying one more... but held back.

I'd rather now bank the cash, and wait for the new 4680 cell Powerwall 3 with larger capacity.

In the meantime, stomach the small uplift in grid tariff cost for the missing extra 13.5kWh...

I've even considered a ground mounted 4kW Solar Array extension and 'Swift - brand' Wind Power generator

They’re going to be constrained by 4680 availability for so long that I’ll doubt there will be a Powerwall 3 this side of the next 3 years.
4680 is actually not a big deal, as charge/discharge rates are plenty good enough with the current ones (limited by the inverter more than by the batteries) and energy density is fairly irrelevant for a static installation.
LFP chemistry would be far better, as longevity is THE thing on a Powerwall-type scenario.

 

[PITA]

They’re going to be constrained by 4680 availability for so long that I’ll doubt there will be a Powerwall 3 this side of the next 3 years.
4680 is actually not a big deal, as charge/discharge rates are plenty good enough with the current ones (limited by the inverter more than by the batteries) and energy density is fairly irrelevant for a static installation.
LFP chemistry would be far better, as longevity is THE thing on a Powerwall-type scenario.

Well, maybe my understanding of 4680 technology is wrong then, because I disagree with just about everything you've said there

My understanding is this...

4680 is the form factor and design of the battery. Wheras Elon Musk has already said the 4680 chemistry will vary depending on the application. Some will have Nickel, some Iron, some Cobolt etc... there will be many versions of the 4680 production

The variations have different weight implications, where the lightweight chemistry versions will be used in vehicles... and the heavy variations will be used in static site storage versions.

Energy density and efficiency of the 4680 battery tech is very relevant for a Powerwall scenario because it provide greater storage for the same size of unit, plus being much cheaper to manufacture & purchase (hopefully).

For Powerwalls, size & energy density is more important than weight.

 

[ACarneiro]

You're probably right, I guess I hadn't made the distinction between the form factor and the chemistry. I stand humbly corrected

I disagree on the energy density being more important on the Powerwalls, but I suppose that's an engineering and production decision to be made by Tesla.
And I stand by my assertion (granted, based on nothing but an educated guess) that the 4680 line will be severely constrained for quite a while still, so unlikely to make an appearance in their lower priority products like the Powerwall.

I suspect Cobalt will be gone altogether in the near future.

 

[PITA]

You're probably right, I guess I hadn't made the distinction between the form factor and the chemistry. I stand humbly corrected

I disagree on the energy density being more important on the Powerwalls, but I suppose that's an engineering and production decision to be made by Tesla.
And I stand by my assertion (granted, based on nothing but an educated guess) that the 4680 line will be severely constrained for quite a while still, so unlikely to make an appearance in their lower priority products like the Powerwall.

I suspect Cobalt will be gone altogether in the near future.

Haha, please don't hate me... but I disagree again.

The 4680 Powerwall is a massive strategic play for Tesla to become a Worldwide Energy Utility Provider.

Remember that Tesla is not a car manufacturer, they're a Technology Company.

My understanding is they're signing up as many battery manufacturers and mining companies as they can right now... to make as many variations of the 4680 battery as possible.

Tesla could dominate the Renewables Power Grid with 4680 based storage systems. It's a big market. So is a very strategic and important sector.

It wouldn't surprise me if Tesla sold off their Car Manufacturing business, to chase the Industrial & Domestic side of battery storage on a Global scale.

 

[ACarneiro]

Haha, please don't hate me... but I disagree again.

The 4680 Powerwall is a massive strategic play for Tesla to become a Worldwide Energy Utility Provider.

Remember that Tesla is not a car manufacturer, they're a Technology Company.

My understanding is they're signing up as many battery manufacturers and mining companies as they can right now... to make as many variations of the 4680 battery as possible.

Tesla could dominate the Renewables Power Grid with 4680 based storage systems. It's a big market. So is a very strategic and important sector.

It wouldn't surprise me if Tesla sold off their Car Manufacturing business, to chase the Industrial & Domestic side of battery storage on a Global scale.

I don’t hate you at all for being wrong

Regardless of how this pans out, it’s interesting and exciting times indeed!

 

[PITA]

I don’t hate you at all for being wrong

Regardless of how this pans out, it’s interesting and exciting times indeed!

Indeed

... we shall see

 

[PITA]

Also, it’s a Dual Fuel tariff with ridiculous exit fees so there is that to take into account.
I’m not sure if, and by how much, more expensive their gas is.

Hey, if this is true... I might go with EDF then. Because I could be their worst nightmare... and that would please me a lot.

If EDF are calculating a very low off-peak rate of 4.5p ... and a high off-peak rate of 36p ... then they're banking on your peak rate heating costs to make them money. Offset by a dual fuel Tariff with Gas so they get you both ways.

The dual fuel thing is to avoid attracting the Heat Pump converts who only use electric in their house with no Gas supply. Because that would be damaging to their profits, especially those with high capacity battery storage.

But our house still has a Gas Supply ... even though we don't use it much.

So our High Capacity battery storage, heat pump, induction cooking, electric showers, two electric cars charging and 3 Phase capability would really do them over... at 4.5p for 5 hours overnight charging... and 12-15MWh per year

Hmmmm....

 

[DoricJim]

I’m on the SVR with EDF at the moment and am switching to Octopus just because of the ridiculous gas tariff you have to take with EDF. It is so dumb of them. Calculations were close between the two and might have stayed on if they let me keep the gas SVR. Their Go has rate is 11.5p vs 7p for the new cap!