Off-peak Hours confusion…

[ranova]

no matter how many times you guys say "you are making it more complicated than it is", it's still confusing and unintuitive for me (and apparently many others). I've tried peak hours and scheduled departure and it would sometimes start charging during peak hours. I have went back to scheduled charge start times for now.

They just need to have these options:
- static scheduled charge start time (i.e. Start charging at midnight, on X, Y, and Z days)
- charge only during off-peak hours (FROM hour x TO hour y) (i.e. Only charge between midnight to 4pm on X, Y, and Z days)
- scheduled departure time (and options to obey off-peak hour rules AND whether to break off-peak hour rules to hit set charge limit by departure time) (i.e. I want to leave at 7am every weekday and obey offpeak rules BUT break off-peak rules if I won't hit set charge limit within off-peak hour charging)

 

[father_of_6]

I think the issue is that the software seems to have been written with the idea in mind that your desired SoC is a hard requirement. For many people, that's just not the case. You may set it at 60%, but would be fine if it only made it to 50%.

My take on this is that Tesla should get rid of "Scheduled Charging" and "Scheduled Departure", this is part of the confusion. All we need are the following settings:

1. Charging start time
2. Charging end time
3. Minimum state of charge
4. Maximum state of charge

It would work like this:

• The car should always prefer the charging end time... charging as late as possible to hit the max SoC.
• The car should charge as slow as possible, using the entire charging time range to hit maximum SoC if possible (slower is healthier, right?).
• If the maximum SoC cannot be reached within the time range, then it would at least charge enough to hit the minimum SoC.
• If the minimum SoC cannot be reached within the time range, then it would disobey the charging start time.
• The minimum SoC will always be honored (if possible).

 

[freeAgent]

I think the issue is that the software seems to have been written with the idea in mind that your desired SoC is a hard requirement. For many people, that's just not the case. You may set it at 60%, but would be fine if it only made it to 50%.

I think this is exactly the problem. Tesla assumes that you must get the car to the charge limit set by the customer. In reality, most people don't care about getting to exactly that state of charge for regular, daily driving because most people don't drive their cars anywhere near 0% on any sort of regular basis.

I disagree that Tesla should assume people want to charge as slowly as possible in order to reach the desired SoC at the end of the charging window, though. I can think of many situations where someone might interrupt charging before that scheduled time and want to be as close to the max SoC target as possible. People also aren't going to want to have to configure the end time every time they start charging.

I wish Tesla would just allow people to black out L2 charging when the car is at a specific location (e.g. Home) during a specific time range. If the car is plugged in during that time, it should notify the owner that it is waiting to charge and allow the owner to override the blackout period for this session in the app or on the car's screen. If the car detects that it won't be able to charge to the target SoC before the blackout period begins, it could notify the user of this estimate (e.g., "your car will only reach 50% SoC before 4pm when your charging blackout is scheduled to begin") and similarly allow them to do a one-time override of the charging blackout in the app or car screen.

I sound like a broken record on this point, but Chargepoint does it perfectly with their EVSEs. I set a time range when I don't want to charge. If my vehicle is plugged in anyway, I can go into the app and start charging manually. It's simple and does exactly what I want. The only thing it's missing is the logic to let you know that your car won't get to its target SoC before hitting the blackout period. Tesla could easily do that, though, since they know the battery statistics.

 

[McFlurri]

OK, so I want to update my perspective on this topic.

My wife just picked up a new 2021 Chevy Bolt EV yesterday. It has a scheduled charging section too and was SOOOOOO much easier.

It lets you set up off-peak charging. You simply put in the details of your peak, mid-peak, and off-peak and that's it. Unbelievably simple. I really wish it was just like that with my Model 3.

 

[ranova]

OK, so I want to update my perspective on this topic.

My wife just picked up a new 2021 Chevy Bolt EV yesterday. It has a scheduled charging section too and was SOOOOOO much easier.

It lets you set up off-peak charging. You simply put in the details of your peak, mid-peak, and off-peak and that's it. Unbelievably simple. I really wish it was just like that with my Model 3.

yeah, it's unbelievable that some people are actually defending the current charging options in Teslas.

 

[gnuarm]

OK, so I want to update my perspective on this topic.

My wife just picked up a new 2021 Chevy Bolt EV yesterday. It has a scheduled charging section too and was SOOOOOO much easier.

It lets you set up off-peak charging. You simply put in the details of your peak, mid-peak, and off-peak and that's it. Unbelievably simple. I really wish it was just like that with my Model 3.

Will it work for a schedule with two peak periods, one AM and one PM? That's what I have 8 months of the year and the other 4 months I have one peak period in the afternoon. A bit messy, but that's the reality of the cost of providing electricity with uneven demands. In the summer the peak rate is 10x the off peak rate. I program my AC to not run for four hours each day. It's a bit messy to program, but in the summer months it runs the temperature down a degree or two an hour ahead of the peak time to help coast through without overheating the house.

 

[dcp123]

OK, so I want to update my perspective on this topic.

My wife just picked up a new 2021 Chevy Bolt EV yesterday. It has a scheduled charging section too and was SOOOOOO much easier.

It lets you set up off-peak charging. You simply put in the details of your peak, mid-peak, and off-peak and that's it. Unbelievably simple. I really wish it was just like that with my Model 3.

The Bolt had this right in 2017. Tesla still isn't close. All I want it to do is start charging when off-peak rates start and end when off-peak rates end (although it would be extremely rare for it not to finish charging during off-peak rates). I guess it might be nice if you could also set a minimum charge below which it would start immediately, but having to manually tell it to start charging in those situations would also be fine.

I do not want the car to try to reach a full charge at some particular time. It's not really that important to me whether it's fully charged when I unplug it and my schedule isn't remotely that predictable.

 

[freeAgent]

The Bolt had this right in 2017. Tesla still isn't close. All I want it to do is start charging when off-peak rates start and end when off-peak rates end (although it would be extremely rare for it not to finish charging during off-peak rates). I guess it might be nice if you could also set a minimum charge below which it would start immediately, but having to manually tell it to start charging in those situations would also be fine.

I do not want the car to try to reach a full charge at some particular time. It's not really that important to me whether it's fully charged when I unplug it and my schedule isn't remotely that predictable.

They could simply allow you to set the car to, by default, only charge during off-peak hours set by the user (Superchargers excepted). Then, if the car is plugged in and below the max charge threshold, the car (and app) could notify the owner that the car is plugged in and not charging due to scheduling, allowing them to manually override the schedule at their discretion. IMO, that would be perfect. The car would default to only charging during off-peak hours, but proactively notify me if it's not charging while plugged in so if I can't forget to manually override the schedule. I don't know why Tesla don't do it this way.

 

[Mattopotamus]

They could simply allow you to set the car to, by default, only charge during off-peak hours set by the user (Superchargers excepted). Then, if the car is plugged in and below the max charge threshold, the car (and app) could notify the owner that the car is plugged in and not charging due to scheduling, allowing them to manually override the schedule at their discretion. IMO, that would be perfect. The car would default to only charging during off-peak hours, but proactively notify me if it's not charging while plugged in so if I can't forget to manually override the schedule. I don't know why Tesla don't do it this way.

I made a post earlier about how if you start your charging time at the start of your off-peak pricing you will probably finish charging during that window.

If you plug your car in at any other time before that start time, the car does not automatically charge unless you launch the app and select "start charging", so your second point is the way it already works. While it doesn't notify you that it is not charging, if you plug it at 5pm you should know it won't start until 11pm if you have it set up that way.

 

[freeAgent]

I made a post earlier about how if you start your charging time at the start of your off-peak pricing you will probably finish charging during that window.

If you plug your car in at any other time before that start time, the car does not automatically charge unless you launch the app and select "start charging", so your second point is the way it already works. While it doesn't notify you that it is not charging, if you plug it at 5pm you should know it won't start until 11pm if you have it set up that way.

It's not a given that if you start charging at 'x' time, you're likely to finish by whenever it is you need to be finished by. This is just an assumption on your part, and I am sure that it's not true for many people, particularly those who charge on 120v outlets. It depends on the SoC to begin, the target SoC, the amount of time available, and the charging rate/amperage of the circuit. What I'm suggesting is a way for Tesla to update the way they "do" charging scheduling and notifications to help people who can't "probably finish" their charging cycle in a given window.

I made this suggestion because I've seen people with the problem. It's not a problem I personally have. I actually have a home charger that already allows for excellent control over charging times. I don't use Tesla's scheduled charging features at all, but many do so why not make them better?

 

[everydaychris]

lol
It's so confusing yes.
All you need to know is what is the START time of your highest peak rate?
Mine is 4-9 PM.

Then, schedule your off peak end time for 3:45 PM (to be safe) or 4 PM.

If your battery is low, it will charge UP to 3:45 or 4 pm if plugged in... STOP.. and resume charging again later when you scheduled your departure time to its percentage

 

[puckpurnell]

Try after 9 p.m., i.e middle of the night.

 

[gnuarm]

lol
It's so confusing yes.
All you need to know is what is the START time of your highest peak rate?
Mine is 4-9 PM.

Then, schedule your off peak end time for 3:45 PM (to be safe) or 4 PM.

If your battery is low, it will charge UP to 3:45 or 4 pm if plugged in... STOP.. and resume charging again later when you scheduled your departure time to its percentage

I'm confused. How do I tell it to resume charging at 9 pm when peak is over?

 

[everydaychris]

I'm confused. How do I tell it to resume charging at 9 pm when peak is over?

So you can easily change it to scheduled charging to charge at 9. I like the other way better because it can charge a little before 4 PM my start of peak time, and then know to finish charging when I leave at 3:30 AM. This is perfect if I want it to be at 100% before a trip. no calculations needed

 

[gnuarm]

So you can easily change it to scheduled charging to charge at 9. I like the other way better because it can charge a little before 4 PM my start of peak time, and then know to finish charging when I leave at 3:30 AM. This is perfect if I want it to be at 100% before a trip. no calculations needed

Again, I'm not following. I wish to charge my Tesla. It is 2 pm. Peak time starts at 4 pm and ends at 9 pm. How do I tell it to start charging now, then stop at 4 and resume at 9 pm? Are you suggesting I have to program it to stop at 4 pm and the return after that and reprogram it to resume at 9 pm?

Actually, when I was on ToU billing it was even worse because 8 months of the year the peak times were 6 to 9 am and 5 to 8 pm. If you are not on a pretty fast charger you can easily end up needing the car to turn on and off multiple times. I can't imagine why a Tesla can't be as smart as a simple mechanical dial device I have it plugged into. The only problem with that gadget is it loses track of time when the power fails...

 

[everydaychris]

Again, I'm not following. I wish to charge my Tesla. It is 2 pm. Peak time starts at 4 pm and ends at 9 pm. How do I tell it to start charging now, then stop at 4 and resume at 9 pm? Are you suggesting I have to program it to stop at 4 pm and the return after that and reprogram it to resume at 9 pm?

Actually, when I was on ToU billing it was even worse because 8 months of the year the peak times were 6 to 9 am and 5 to 8 pm. If you are not on a pretty fast charger you can easily end up needing the car to turn on and off multiple times. I can't imagine why a Tesla can't be as smart as a simple mechanical dial device I have it plugged into. The only problem with that gadget is it loses track of time when the power fails...

lol. You just have to worry about 4 PM so set yours to 3:45 like mine. If you plug in with 10% charge at 2 pm, it will charge immediately up to 3:45 PM to get as much juice in as possible. Then sometime later during the night maybe 12 am?? It all depends when you set your scheduled departure time to, it will FINISH charging to your pre set percentage, say 80%.

 

[gnuarm]

lol. You just have to worry about 4 PM so set yours to 3:45 like mine. If you plug in with 10% charge at 2 pm, it will charge immediately up to 3:45 PM to get as much juice in as possible. Then sometime later during the night maybe 12 am?? It all depends when you set your scheduled departure time to, it will FINISH charging to your pre set percentage, say 80%.

Sorry, I'm really not following this. If the departure time is say, midnight and the car could easily charge all through the peak time, how does it know not to resume charging until peak time is over?

 

[everydaychris]

Sorry, I'm really not following this. If the departure time is say, midnight and the car could easily charge all through the peak time, how does it know not to resume charging until peak time is over?

THAT is the tricky part.

It doesn't and it's why alot of peole get upset.

From 10% battery to 80%, it can take up 5 hours to charge.
If you plug in at 8 PM and need to depart by 11 PM, no matter what the Tesla is going to start charging even on expensive rates because, well you need FUEL.


You have to time it a little bit. So say you arrive from work at 2 PM and STILL need to depart by 11 PM, the car will charge for 2 hours from 2-3:45 PM. Stop charging and, using it's own logic, figure out when to start charging again to depart by 11 PM. By that time, depending how low your SOC started, it may start charging at 8 PM, 9PM, or whenever to make sure you're at what percentage you want by the time you leave.


This is good... making a YT video on it so it will be fun

 

[gnuarm]

THAT is the tricky part.

It doesn't and it's why alot of peole get upset.

From 10% battery to 80%, it can take up 5 hours to charge.
If you plug in at 8 PM and need to depart by 11 PM, no matter what the Tesla is going to start charging even on expensive rates because, well you need FUEL.


You have to time it a little bit. So say you arrive from work at 2 PM and STILL need to depart by 11 PM, the car will charge for 2 hours from 2-3:45 PM. Stop charging and, using it's own logic, figure out when to start charging again to depart by 11 PM. By that time, depending how low your SOC started, it may start charging at 8 PM, 9PM, or whenever to make sure you're at what percentage you want by the time you leave.


This is good... making a YT video on it so it will be fun

I think Tesla dropped the ball on this big time. I want to charge as much as I can off peak. I don't necessarily want the car to charge on peak rates unless I tell it to explicitly. Yeah, Tesla has decided how we should use our cars for us. Like Musk says, "All input is error" and this Tesla "input is error".

Bad, Tesla. BAD!

 

[3sr+buyer]

A simple charge scheduling interface that should work for most people...

4 options when at home:
1. Charge whenever plugged in until finished.
2. Charge whenever plugged in until finished, except during peak rate hours.
3. Charge to finish at a designated departure time.
4. Charge to finish at a designated departure time, avoiding peak rate hour charging.

(3 and 4 act like 1 and 2 if the designated departure time is sooner than when charging could be finished.)

And a way to designate what the peak hours are (at least for options 2 and 4 above).