Late 2017. That was the original promise me thinks.
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OFFICIAL BUTTON WATCH
- Thread starter Drrobmiller
- Start date
GeoffEV
Member
Sxxt or get off the pot, Elon! Your lawyers should concur on a standard blanket Hold Harmless & Indemnity Agreement with Successors&Assigns Rights waived that is litigation proof - or, at least such a high hurdle that few would dare to sue. Ensure that everyone who signs it (clicks multiple times that they acknowledge it's a beta and their responsibilities therewith), at a minimum had to scroll through it - these HH&I agreements are short&sweet so there's really no excuse for further delay. We paid for it, now give "The Button" to us PIF FSD owners! If any stoopidity is indicated by our cars' sensors which indicate an owner is violating safe driving practices, have the AI shut it down along with screeching warning klaxons and flashing red light dash accompaniments.
This seems like a great way to get regulators to come down on you. Other people on the street around you aren't bound by this agreement and it poses a public safety hazard. I'd bet your insurance company would want to know about this also and they are highly unlikely to cover you while driving a system which requires such an extraordinary disclaimer of liability.
Plus Elon is saying current AP is already "superhuman" and V9 is going to be safer than current AP, so why would they need a disclaimer when they don't already have one and it's already better than a human? The liability should be on them not giving this to people right now given they are holding back on technology they have that would save lives if released.
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GeoffEV
Member
I gather that you enjoy the feeling of forever anticipating, but never getting what you paid for and deserve? The highway on-ramp to off-ramp NAP has similar disclaimers - where are the regulators? I've arrived at an age when waiting for something I've been contractually promised is no longer acceptable.
NoA does not have anything near the level you describe:
If Tesla thinks they need that level of disclaimer to release FSD, it's highly indicative that it's not ready for wide release. Which of course is exactly what is true and why they can't release it in any way to more than a couple people under NDA. We can already see what Tesla is willing to put out there based on how current AP works (phantom braking, not stopping for completely stopped cars, steering into barriers), so that's a huge hint at just how iffy FSD must be (like actively turning in front of oncoming cars) for them to not be releasing it, given how important it is to the Tesla brand as a leader in autonomy. Of course, just one death or 10 really scary Youtube videos are probably worse than any delay. Most people already think Teslas can drive themselves, there's a lot to lose here.
LOL. As a Tesla AP2 owner since 2016, It's just that I'm used to it. You're talking about paying for something you deserve and have been waiting 6 months? Dude, Tesla / Elon has been doing this for 10 years. What you will eventually learn is that nothing Elon says has any basis in reality, and "delays" of years are just par for the course, and what you have "contractually been promised" pales in comparison to what was promised to people in 2016-2019.
I'm 100% with you and your anger/frustration. The best we can do is let any future purchasers know, and try and get the people that are still deep supporters to see some of their blind spots. For me, my basic story is "Yes, Teslas are great cars as long as you are not buying because of any of the "self driving stuff" or any other future features. Anything that comes after you buy is just a free bonus, even if you paid for it."
israndy
Supercharger Hunter
I consider his attitude a lack of buyer beware. Who signed up for Level 5 Autonomy, a thing that DOESN'T exist yet, and expected it in six months? HA! I have a friend that got FSD just because I did and we bought on the same day, and he probably isn't too happy with his decision either. I feel FULLY informed by this forum and all the Tesla news outlets what I was signing up for. It's a moment in history I wanted to be there for, and the only downside is all those who gripe "Why can't you do magic FASTER!"
BrianBigNFun
Giver of snark
it was sarcasm that plays on the notion that oil companies want Tesla to fail in any way
Not the first time someone didn't get my joke, but whaddya gonna do?
The thing is, he's quite a bit more reasonable than that. He asked for city streets beta with a huge disclaimer that it doesn't work and the driver has to be fully involved. He just wants *something* 6 months after the company said it would exist, which is reasonable with any normal company. I don't think normal American "buyer beware" is quite enough when dealing with Tesla, and that appears to be something each Tesla buyer has to learn after the purchase. Really sad that one of America's most valuable companies operates this way.
I keep thinking that Tesla really shouldn't sell FSD as part of the normal car purchase process. People think of it as an "option" on the car. They should sell you the car, and then tell you that you can go buy FSD right away if you want it, but then it makes it clear that this is a very different thing than buying a car in any way you have before.
Well sure, but he's only had his car for 6 months, so what happened to all those suckers that bought in 2019 couldn't happen to a buyer in 2020, right? Elon is much better "recently."
The bar was on the ground coming in to 2021 and he brought a shovel. He might not be actively promising as much but he's delivering less than an armless waiter.
@Randy Spencer said ”… I feel FULLY informed by this forum and all the Tesla news outlets what I was signing up for. It's a moment in history I wanted to be there for…”
There is merit in being in the moment of history (if it happens). I signed up to “assist and motivate” the development of FSD, knowing that I would get some improvements. The OTA updates are spectacular and go a long way to keeping my 2018 Tesla just as advanced as my 2020 Tesla.
The beta videos of FSD are very attractive. In the first seasons, maybe years, of FSD, I wouldn‘t be able to read a book in the car or sleep in the backseat. Paying attention and a hand on the steering wheel, most times, is about as relaxed as I’d get. Having the car look 360 degrees around me and take fast responses to potential accidents will be stress-reducing. Right now, FSD is helpful in routine driving. I think the next version, when the BUTTON comes will be a big safety improvement to me driving, just sayin….
There is merit in being in the moment of history (if it happens). I signed up to “assist and motivate” the development of FSD, knowing that I would get some improvements. The OTA updates are spectacular and go a long way to keeping my 2018 Tesla just as advanced as my 2020 Tesla.
The beta videos of FSD are very attractive. In the first seasons, maybe years, of FSD, I wouldn‘t be able to read a book in the car or sleep in the backseat. Paying attention and a hand on the steering wheel, most times, is about as relaxed as I’d get. Having the car look 360 degrees around me and take fast responses to potential accidents will be stress-reducing. Right now, FSD is helpful in routine driving. I think the next version, when the BUTTON comes will be a big safety improvement to me driving, just sayin….
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Just putting this here: Another snippet from the roll tapes catalog of the "much better" elon.
Döpfner: And what is the time horizon — when will level-five autonomy happen?
Musk: I'm extremely confident that Tesla will have level five next year, extremely confident, 100%.
Döpfner: But Tesla could do it next year in theory?
Musk: Absolutely.
An interview with Mathias Döpfner, December 2020
Elon Musk reveals Tesla's plan to be at the forefront of a self-driving-car revolution — and why he wants to be buried on Mars
Tesla CEO Elon Musk sat down with Axel Springer CEO Mathias Döpfner for an interview during his visit to Germany.
www.businessinsider.com
israndy
Supercharger Hunter
israndy
Supercharger Hunter
58, if I can get half a million miles out of this thing I should be good. All my ICE cars have only made it to ~175,000 miles, so we'll see. But it's not JUST "Take me to Walgreens" I'll be super happy to use "Take me to Disney World" or "Go to Fred's without me and pick up my 3D Printer"
Cheburashka
Active Member
Any ICE car will last past 175k if you rebuild the motor, tranny, etc at some point. Same with Tesla. No way will it last to 500k without needing major work.
Come on dude. Most men live till they are 78. That’s at least 20 years. Your gonna wanna upgrade way before then! Chin up mate.
It seems like 500,000 miles is achievable, with electric motor or battery likely requiring replacement.
Tesla Model S World-Record Holder Will Soon Pass 750,000 Miles
This week, Hansjörg Gemmingen took to Twitter to let the world know he was just about to cross a new milestone, 1.2 million km in his Tesla Model S.
insideevs.com
That’s 25,000 miles a year for 20 years. Perhaps after ten years, upgrading for me might look interesting when Tesla’s come with comfy chairs and beds. But I’m still considering keeping the Tesls as “last cars” if my driving habits stay similar to past uses.
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