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Oh the irony

Discussion in 'Model 3' started by Puddles, Jun 2, 2017.

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  1. scaesare

    scaesare Well-Known Member

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    Actually, he could...
     
  2. scaesare

    scaesare Well-Known Member

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    Seems about the same time they actually stopped shipping them with the lighter portion of the assembly ...
     
  3. scaesare

    scaesare Well-Known Member

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    Actually, I suspect the DC-DC converter itself is fine, it's how the computer operates it that is likely at issue.

    As an interesting data point, when my 12V failed recently and they replaced it, it was a 3rd revision of the 12V battery. I was going to replace it myself but they had to change the configuration parameters on the car so it knew which model 12V battery was installed... so the care is making decisions on how to treat the 12V based on some profile it has.
     
  4. ikjadoon

    ikjadoon Member

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  5. eSpiritIV

    eSpiritIV Member

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    Just so everyone knows, the Powerwall batteries and the Tesla car batteries have different chemistry and charging characteristics. You CANNOT use the tesla to power your house. You will VOID your warranty if you attempted to do so. Its in the manual.
     
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  6. ModelNforNerd

    ModelNforNerd Active Member

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    The Tesla powerwall and car batteries are different..........until the Model 3 is available.

    Powerwalls have been built with 2170 cells since early this year, and the Model 3 will be the first vehicle to use those same cells.


    Your other point remains correct, though. You cannot power your home with your car.
     
  7. mongo

    mongo Well-Known Member

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    The 3 will have the same form factor (2170), not the same chemistry.
     
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  8. JeffK

    JeffK Well-Known Member

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    #28 JeffK, Jun 5, 2017
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2017
    Exactly, Model 3 2170's will probably get their first production run this month, in preparation for July Model 3 production start.

    Powerwall uses NMC and Tesla S/X/3 use NCA chemistry. Still cannot use Model 3 as a stationary power source. Jeff Dahn's recent research into increasing longevity, which is not yet integrated into production, will apply to Tesla Energy products (NMC), not the vehicles (NCA).

    This is not to say it's impossible to use NCA as a stationary power source... it just voids your warranty.
     
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  9. dsvick

    dsvick Active Member

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    It isn't the chemistry that matters. That'd be like saying you can't put Starbucks coffee in a Dunkin Donuts cup, they both hold coffee, like both of the batteries hold electricity. And, you can charge your Tesla from your solar panel and powerwall set up so it can certainly be done. But, you're right, you can't go the other way.
     
  10. scaesare

    scaesare Well-Known Member

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    Exactly. Many people still don't grasp this.

    You can find a traditional "AA" format battery with carbon, Alkaline, Nickel Cadmium, or Lithium Ion chemistries. Same "AA" battery size, vastly different characteristics.

    Just because two cells may both be 2170's, their chemistry, and thus capabilities can be very different.
     
  11. scaesare

    scaesare Well-Known Member

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    Certainly true that there's nothing preventing the use of NCA cells for stationary storage, After all, WK057 has a couple of Model S pack modules stacked up for his whole-house energy storage system.

    The issue is applicability. When considering number of discharge cycles, depth of discharge, power density, etc... home storage and EV usage have differing requirements.

    So the "can't" comes from the fact that you can't treat one chemistry like the other and assume similar cell life, power delivery, etc...

    In WK057's example above, he specifically cycled them to different depths, sized the array to limit # of cycles, etc...
     
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  12. JeffK

    JeffK Well-Known Member

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    ... "Can't" is also inferred the literal warning in the owner's manual that if you do you void your warranty.
    [​IMG]

    If it's out of warranty or you have a spare battery lying around, then by all means.
     
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  13. internalaudit

    internalaudit Member

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    Just advice the neighbor to get those li-ion battery packs that double as device chargers. I got a battery tender and anker ones and haven't had to use them during winter.
     
  14. scaesare

    scaesare Well-Known Member

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    Agreed. Clearly the cat is not designed to do that, and therefore hacking around in the HV system is going to void your warranty. And perhaps kill somebody who doesn't know what they are doing.

    But as the follow-on discussion addressed chemistry and a discussion of if it could be done, there's also the fact that even though cells of one chemistry can be used for applications for which they weren't intended, you can't do so and expect similar lifetimes, etc...
     
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  15. hoang51

    hoang51 Member

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    If you're referring to jumping another car through the 12 V socket (supersedes cigarette lighter socket), you can't. They're usually capped at a low amp fuse, the fuse would blow and will not allow the other car to suck enough current from a working 12 V battery. The norm in jumping a dead battery is unrestricted when tapped directly to a good 12 V battery, which no fuse exists to prevent an overload protection.

    Now, one can buy one of these from Costco...

    [​IMG]
     
  16. Siciliano

    Siciliano Member

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    I have a Maserati, and it did in fact come with a cigarette lighter. No idea why. I don't smoke so I don't need it nor do I want it. I actually kept it in my center console for a while just to show ppl and see their reaction... lots of "blast from the past" remarks. I have no idea where it is now lol
     
  17. ModelNforNerd

    ModelNforNerd Active Member

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    Having just been in Europe, and Italy specifically, smoking hasn't quite received the social stigma over there as it has here. I can see where an Italian automaker would still include a cigarette lighter.
     
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