Ohlins R&T Coilovers with Swift Springs!

[Jigglypuff]

Your favorite graphic.

 

[Motion122]

Your favorite graphic.

Perhaps you can see how much articulation is needed to get the spring to line up correctly in this photo.

 

[ElectricGhost]

I decided to swap the standard sport 11/12K springs that came with the Ohlins R&T coilover kit on my M3P for a set of softer 8/9K Swift springs.

I (and the fam) found the Ohlins springs to be a little too aggressive for daily street use, which even in the softest damping settings resulted in a little more suspension feedback than what I (we) wanted. Now I knew going into the R&T kit, the ride would be firmer than stock, but after a week or so behind the wheel, it was evident the kit was far more track oriented than street. After consulting with the guys over at Ohlins, Swift, and a few others in the industry, it was clear one of the key differences between most sport and street oriented coilover setups was that the street, aka comfort or GT kits, had 20-25% softer springs than their sport counterpart. So with that info on hand, I decided to swap in a set of speced 8/9K Swift springs and let me tell you something - I couldn't be happier with the results!

Ride quality improved significantly, with little to no distinguishable difference in the vehicle's level of stability. Naturally on a track or for really aggressive street driving (on good roads), the standard 11/12K Ohlins springs would prevail, but the softer 8/9K Swift springs IMO offer a much more balanced level of performance and comfort for everyday street use. I also found that the dampening adjustments with the softer Swift springs are much more prevalent, and the 20 click range offered by the R&T kit is adequate to keep the car street friendly, while still offering a respectful level of "track-ability" at the firmer end of the adjustments.

Installation and setup was straightforward and this time around, I had all four corners swapped and ready to go in just an hour and a half. The softer springs also allow for more of drop than with the firmer standard Ohlin springs, so I was able to go a little lower with the suspension. The car is currently sitting right around 30mm lower than stock (I had it at 25mm prior), which definitely closed up the monstrous wheel gaps the Model 3 is infamous for. Erring on the side caution, and to make the ride height a little more street friendly, I may ultimately bump up the suspension a bit. I will also see how it all fares after I get it aligned again later this week.

So although the R&T kit took a little fine tuning, and additional resources, it is now IMO a far more balanced road & track setup. I am aware there are other kits out there that would have sufficed in what I was looking for (and cost less) but having ridden all sorts of motorcycles for the past 40+ years, many of which with Ohlins suspension components, I knew if I went with anything other than Ohlins, I would have always second guess and or regret my purchase. Everything I have ever owned that utilized Ohlins suspension in one way or the other, has always performed beyond my expectations, and I'm happy to report, that is still the case.

The whole Ohlins R&T setup with the Swift springs set me back right around $3600. It’s not for everyone, but if you absolutely want nothing less than the best, it's a small price to pay. I was also pleasantly surprised that the Swift springs I sourced from Redwood Motorsports came painted in the identical yellow color as that of the Ohlins springs!

Here are the part numbers for the 8/9K Swift Springs, which are sold in pairs.
Front: Z65-203-080 (8 kgf/mm - 448 lbs/inch)
Rear: Z65-178-090 (9 kgf/mm - 504 lbs/inch)

Thank you to everyone at European Auto Source (EAS), Redwood Motorsports, Ohlins USA, and Swift Springs in assisting me with all this.

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So is this is basically repurposing the RT kit with the same spring rate as the GT? Should new buyers go GT?

 

[tm1v2]

So is this is basically repurposing the RT kit with the same spring rate as the GT? Should new buyers go GT?

@ElectricGhost If you want the ride of the Redwood GT kit, then yes just buy it. To refocus the R&T on ride quality to the extent of the GT kit you'd have to get it revalved as well as swapping the springs. And your one-off custom valving probably wouldn't really match what Redwood has come up with in their testing and development.

Also Redwood's GT kit should have softer springs than @JKarbon went for, at least in the front. The Redwood Performance Sport kit uses 8kg front, 11kg rear - so @JKarbon's front spring rate matches Redwood Performance Sport front. Not sure about rear spring rates on the GT. My guess is 8kg, but maybe it's as high as 9kg.

Turning the adjustment knob softer on the Ohlins DFV is not the same as a full revalve focused on softer springs and ride comfort. I'm not saying it's a bad setup to just put softer springs on without revalving the R&T (that's not what I'm saying at all!), but you won't get the same damping curves as with the Redwood GT dampers or anything valved with more comfort in mind. (This is my understanding, I'm not an expert, but it matches what I've read from Ohlins documentation.)

 

[dsgerbc]

Perhaps you can see how much articulation is needed to get the spring to line up correctly in this photo.

Any who tried installing the Redwood rear spring+helper combo knows how much articulation there is...

 

[Motion122]

Any who tried installing the Redwood rear spring+helper combo knows how much articulation there is...

Helpers will solve the less critical half of the issue. The beehive style like OEM and lowering springs are far less susceptible to bowing.

 

[Motion122]

@ElectricGhost If you want the ride of the Redwood GT kit, then yes just buy it. To refocus the R&T on ride quality to the extent of the GT kit you'd have to get it revalved as well as swapping the springs. And your one-off custom valving probably wouldn't really match what Redwood has come up with in their testing and development.

Also Redwood's GT kit should have softer springs than @JKarbon went for, at least in the front. The Redwood Performance Sport kit uses 8kg front, 11kg rear - so @JKarbon's front spring rate matches Redwood Performance Sport front. Not sure about rear spring rates on the GT. My guess is 8kg, but maybe it's as high as 9kg.

Turning the adjustment knob softer on the Ohlins DFV is not the same as a full revalve focused on softer springs and ride comfort. I'm not saying it's a bad setup to just put softer springs on without revalving the R&T (that's not what I'm saying at all!), but you won't get the same damping curves as with the Redwood GT dampers or anything valved with more comfort in mind. (This is my understanding, I'm not an expert, but it matches what I've read from Ohlins documentation.)

You are good on R&T to go 30% in either direction with spring rates. Keep it at 20% if you are concerned, but it has not been an issue on many other platforms.

 

[tm1v2]

You are good on R&T to go 30% in either direction with spring rates. Keep it at 20% if you are concerned, but it has not been an issue on many other platforms.

@Motion122 I'm not saying it's an issue! I believe you that 20-30% less stiff springs on stock R&T valving works well. I'm just saying it won't be the same ride as the Redwood GT coilovers. Same thing if I were to put softer springs on my Redwood Performance Sport dampers - it still wouldn't ride like the Redwood GT kit, unless I also got the dampers rebuilt with the GT valving.

Ohlins documentation says the DFV compression adjustment range is limited. See the top of Page 8 of https://www.ohlinsusa.com/files/ohlins/manuals/OWN_AUTO_R_T.pdf. By all accounts the R&T have pretty firm compression damping, as makes perfect sense for a "Road & Track" product. Simply setting the adjusters soft is not going to give GT damping behavior. I'm also guessing there's more to valving than simply "softer or firmer."

 

[Motion122]

@Motion122 I'm not saying it's an issue! I believe you that 20-30% less stiff springs on stock R&T valving works well. I'm just saying it won't be the same ride as the Redwood GT coilovers. Same thing if I were to put softer springs on my Redwood Performance Sport dampers - it still wouldn't ride like the Redwood GT kit, unless I also got the dampers rebuilt with the GT valving.

Ohlins documentation says the DFV compression adjustment range is limited. See the top of Page 8 of https://www.ohlinsusa.com/files/ohlins/manuals/OWN_AUTO_R_T.pdf. By all accounts the R&T have pretty firm compression damping, as makes perfect sense for a "Road & Track" product. Simply setting the adjusters soft is not going to give GT damping behavior. I'm also guessing there's more to valving than simply "softer or firmer."

You do realize the adjuster is for low speed rebound, right?

 

[tm1v2]

You do realize the adjuster is for low speed rebound, right?

Yes. It's also supposed to adjust low speed compression, but not as much as it adjusts rebound.

 

[Motion122]

Yes. It's also supposed to adjust low speed compression, but not as much as it adjusts rebound.

it's only around 10%.

 

[tm1v2]

Bottoms up! I mean out! Bottoming out update!

A taste of the road du jour. 35 miles of this. First time driving this road, but essentially no traffic, I had it to myself.

View attachment 859088

I started off at 16 of 32 clicks from stiff, just as a baseline, then went to 11 clicks a few miles in, right before it got real narrow, nasty, and gnarly.

With the Performance Sport 8kg:11kg springs, and Performance Sport dampers set 2/3rds stiff (11 of 32 clicks), I still bottomed out the rear over a few dips. No surprise at all on such a road. What *was* new to me was slamming the front down onto the pavement over one surprisingly large dip!

I'm going to say this again: if you like tearing up the back roads then don't go too soft with your springs. Or damper settings. These cars have limited ground clearance and limited suspension travel, it helps to have some firmness when driving fast.

Or if your roads are all smooth and well-maintained, go firm anyways because why not?! I'm not complaining though, handling whatever the pavement throws at you is part of the fun.

Did I mention that road got nasty? Driving it fast knocked an endlink loose! The clunking started the next evening. Wasn't loose enough to identify the source by sight or hand, nor by pressing down on the car sitting still. Under load it would shift.

I think it was from the hits on that road, especially the huge dip where the front bottomed out pretty hard. I'm probably having too much fun on these empty back roads and ought to tone it down a little. Or at least judge those dips better. The Redwood Ohlins coilovers and top hats are all good and survived it just fine though!

Stock endlinks and sway bar, if you're wondering.

 

[tm1v2]

Did I mention that road got nasty? Driving it fast knocked an endlink loose! The clunking started the next evening. Wasn't loose enough to identify the source by sight or hand, nor by pressing down on the car sitting still. Under load it would shift.

I think it was from the hits on that road, especially the huge dip where the front bottomed out pretty hard. I'm probably having too much fun on these empty back roads and ought to tone it down a little. Or at least judge those dips better. The Redwood Ohlins coilovers and top hats are all good and survived it just fine though!

Stock endlinks and sway bar, if you're wondering.

Also MPP front lower control arm bearings survived it just fine too.

 

[ElectricGhost]

@ElectricGhost If you want the ride of the Redwood GT kit, then yes just buy it. To refocus the R&T on ride quality to the extent of the GT kit you'd have to get it revalved as well as swapping the springs. And your one-off custom valving probably wouldn't really match what Redwood has come up with in their testing and development.

Also Redwood's GT kit should have softer springs than @JKarbon went for, at least in the front. The Redwood Performance Sport kit uses 8kg front, 11kg rear - so @JKarbon's front spring rate matches Redwood Performance Sport front. Not sure about rear spring rates on the GT. My guess is 8kg, but maybe it's as high as 9kg.

Turning the adjustment knob softer on the Ohlins DFV is not the same as a full revalve focused on softer springs and ride comfort. I'm not saying it's a bad setup to just put softer springs on without revalving the R&T (that's not what I'm saying at all!), but you won't get the same damping curves as with the Redwood GT dampers or anything valved with more comfort in mind. (This is my understanding, I'm not an expert, but it matches what I've read from Ohlins documentation.)

Hmm. Right now i have UP dual rate springs and am very happy for the price. They corner as flat as I need but arent too stiff.

I do want ohlins dampers and ideally more compliance than I have now that can handle LAs roads better. Ideally I also want to be able to lower it up to 0.5 inches like I have now, or even raise it up a little from OEM for some rally tires for back roads to access less crowded backcountry hiking trail heads.

So really Im try to find the best combos of being able to access unmaintained dirt roads with a different wheel and tires setup (not ralley, just navigate and clear them), keeping the street performance I have now (no race performance needed), being able to adjust the height for the GF to drive when Im out for extended time periods, and increasing compliance (ohlins should help a lot here). Its not an easy list for suspension requirements. It seems doable to me if I find a suspension that considers those requirements.

 

[Jigglypuff]

Redwood GT kit.

 

[Leafable]

Weekend job. Now it's a lot softer and ride very smooth.

Look at the rod size different and the higher the K the heavier the spring.

Can we adjust the rear damper height? It's a bit too low now. In the manual it didn't say anything about height adjustment.

 

[Berylg2019@gma]

I swapped my Ohlins 11/12k springs to Swift 8/9k. Now I am so happy - ride quality improved a lot!

 

[Jigglypuff]

If I wanted the smoother ride, I'd have gotten the GT kit

 

[nadkoolio]

Can we adjust the rear damper height? It's a bit too low now. In the manual it didn't say anything about height adjustment.

Yes you can raise the rear spring perch if it's too low now

 

[nadkoolio]

Weekend job. Now it's a lot softer and ride very smooth.

I swapped my Ohlins 11/12k springs to Swift 8/9k. Now I am so happy - ride quality improved a lot!

I have the RT kit for my Model Y and am trying to decide if softer springs would be worth it. My main gripe is that my tires sometimes leave the ground on bumps on the highway. I've tried all different damper settings with no avail.

Did you guys have this issue with the stiffer springs before switching? How is ride comfort now? Comparable to OEM but with better handling? What damper settings re you guys running with the softer springs?