Ohmman's Airstream Adventures

[ohmman]

With less energy consumption any plans to go larger or longer trailer? Do you plan on doing any wintertime camping?

No to both, currently. I have a Rivian on order and may consider a larger trailer at that point, since my kids are growing and the trailer isn’t. But this is the right trailer for a Model X. We still have strict tongue and tow weight restrictions.

Never been tempted to manually turn off hitch mode to enable autosteer?

It cannot be turned off so long as the 7-pin is connected. So no, I haven’t.

 

[wooter]

It cannot be turned off so long as the 7-pin is connected. So no, I haven’t.

Odd, in Europe I manage to turn off hitch mode and use autosteer.

 

[ohmman]

Odd, in Europe I manage to turn off hitch mode and use autosteer.

Even with the 7-pin connected?

 

[wooter]

Even with the 7-pin connected?

In Europe you have 13 pins on your Tesla. I have a 13 to 7 pin adapter, and my trailer has a 7 pin connector.

Every time I start the car, the car detects the trailer and goes intro hitch mode, but I manually can turn it off. It then displays the hitch in orange instead of blue because it's kinda knowing something is wrong, but allows me to drive with autosteer.

The setting is there to allow bike racks. In Europe, many bike racks come with additional lights because the license plate and rear lights cannot be blocked by cargo.

With hitch mode manually turned off, you feel that TACC is not adapting to the additional weight of the hitch, and isn't calculating routes with taking extra consumption in account.

 

[ohmman]

In Europe you have 13 pins on your Tesla. I have a 13 to 7 pin adapter, and my trailer has a 7 pin connector.

Every time I start the car, the car detects the trailer and goes intro hitch mode, but I manually can turn it off. It then displays the hitch in orange instead of blue because it's kinda knowing something is wrong, but allows me to drive with autosteer.

The setting is there to allow bike racks. In Europe, many bike racks come with additional lights because the license plate and rear lights cannot be blocked by cargo.

With hitch mode manually turned off, you feel that TACC is not adapting to the additional weight of the hitch, and isn't calculating routes with taking extra consumption in account.

Interesting. I couldn’t do it with my 90D. I’ll try today, as we are hauling, but don’t plan to use auto steer anyway.

 

[ThomasD]

My Gf wants to get a camper. I've been looking at Oliver
Travel Trailers | Luxury Quality Campers & RVs | Oliver

 

[BM3B]

I tried to give him a beaver pelt to take home -- he just had to get it off the beaver. Actually, when he was visiting me, a beaver came right up on the beach in front of the house and stood up for us to all watch, as he grabbed a branch from shore. It was the perfect Canadian scene.

Happy Canada Day tomorrow... 150 years old! So young when you think about it.

I’ll take the beaver pelt. Joking aside, I really enjoy reading this thread thank you @ohmman and all contributers. I just got a new Model X LR++ with 371 miles rated range. I am looking at Airstreams that sleep 5, including kids ages 1-8. It seems the 19’ one is the largest I can tow in the X. Any advice or guidance is welcome. With Raven and extra range I think my X will be perfect for camping.

 

[ohmman]

Every time I start the car, the car detects the trailer and goes intro hitch mode, but I manually can turn it off.

Confirmed I still cannot turn it off. It is “greyed out”.

 

[ohmman]

Today we made the haul from Wahweap to the Flagstaff SC. Last night I was prompted to install 2020.40.5, which had the "range increase" to 371 miles rated, so I installed it. I had scheduled a charge to 100% to finish at 7:30am, when we planned to depart. But when I woke at 5:45am, I checked the app and saw that charging hadn't started. I think it was confusion between Utah timezone and Arizona timezone, as the car was switching back and forth between towers and changing the time an hour forward or backward throughout the day. I started it then, and was able to leave this morning with a 96% charge. Less than I wanted, but I figured I'd go slow, which I did.

Some stats:
Distance: 143.87 miles
Battery consumption: 93% used (charged to 96%, arrived with 3%!)
Elevation: +8063, -4899, net +3164 feet!
Speed: Max 55mph, Average 45mph (some slow driving for range and a number of long flagged construction stops brought this down)
Trailer Weight: I haven't hit a scale, but based on previous measurements and the amount of cargo we have this time, I'm guessing about 4400-4500 lbs.

The car was reporting overall consumption of 610Wh/mi, which is clearly unrealistic and doesn't match with my real consumption. I'm still not sure what to make of it.

That said, I'm happy that we made it. It's the farthest we've towed, especially considering the elevation gain. The previous high with our 90D was 137 miles, from Bend, Oregon to The Dalles Supercharger. That had an elevation drop of 3603, however. I was ready to drop the camper when my range was equal to <distance to destination> + 10 miles. We never hit that level, but I was still a bit stressed on the drive, doing 3 hours of mental range math along the way.

We are settled near Sedona now, and we have no more challenging stretches of that kind in our future.

Oh, I took the bikes and bike rack off and stowed them inside the camper. No wiggle room on this jaunt.

 

[dmurphy]

Today we made the haul from Wahweap to the Flagstaff SC. Last night I was prompted to install 2020.40.5, which had the "range increase" to 371 miles rated, so I installed it. I had scheduled a charge to 100% to finish at 7:30am, when we planned to depart. But when I woke at 5:45am, I checked the app and saw that charging hadn't started. I think it was confusion between Utah timezone and Arizona timezone, as the car was switching back and forth between towers and changing the time an hour forward or backward throughout the day. I started it then, and was able to leave this morning with a 96% charge. Less than I wanted, but I figured I'd go slow, which I did.

Some stats:
Distance: 143.87 miles
Battery consumption: 93% used (charged to 96%, arrived with 3%!)
Elevation: +8063, -4899, net +3164 feet!
Speed: Max 55mph, Average 45mph (some slow driving for range and a number of long flagged construction stops brought this down)
Trailer Weight: I haven't hit a scale, but based on previous measurements and the amount of cargo we have this time, I'm guessing about 4400-4500 lbs.

The car was reporting overall consumption of 610Wh/mi, which is clearly unrealistic and doesn't match with my real consumption. I'm still not sure what to make of it.

That said, I'm happy that we made it. It's the farthest we've towed, especially considering the elevation gain. The previous high with our 90D was 137 miles, from Bend, Oregon to The Dalles Supercharger. That had an elevation drop of 3603, however. I was ready to drop the camper when my range was equal to <distance to destination> + 10 miles. We never hit that level, but I was still a bit stressed on the drive, doing 3 hours of mental range math along the way.

We are settled near Sedona now, and we have no more challenging stretches of that kind in our future.

Oh, I took the bikes and bike rack off and stowed them inside the camper. No wiggle room on this jaunt.

143 miles from closetofull, and an elevation change of +3100 feet. Rock on! Should be no problem to hit 150 on fairly level surfaces.

610wh/mi seems about right to me. That’s 87.76kWh for 143.87mi. If you burned 93% of battery that’d indicate about 94.5kWh of “usable” capacity in the H pack. Probably fairly close, no?

 

[BM3B]

143 miles from closetofull, and an elevation change of +3100 feet. Rock on! Should be no problem to hit 150 on fairly level surfaces.

610wh/mi seems about right to me. That’s 87.76kWh for 143.87mi. If you burned 93% of battery that’d indicate about 94.5kWh of “usable” capacity in the H pack. Probably fairly close, no?

I measured 101 kWh charging capacity in new -H battery. I expect discharge to be about 6% less based on my M3 data, so 95 kWh or spot on to your estimate. Well done, sweet LR++

 

[Webby]

My Gf wants to get a camper. I've been looking at Oliver
Travel Trailers | Luxury Quality Campers & RVs | Oliver

After consult with @ohmann and others on this thread and scouring these forums, we bought an Oliver Elite I in Jan 2019, towed it from TN to the Rockies for a 3-month ski trip, and since then multiple desert adventures around the CO/WY/MT Rockies and UT canyonlands. I'm happy to chat with you and your GF about what I've learned so far. We're likely to sell it soon as our 2 boys have grown substantially (and Ollie only sleep 3 officially). I've begged Oliver to adapt a gaucho bunk or make a 4-sleeper version but apparently I'm the only one asking. We use a 2018 MX100D as our TV.

 

[ohmman]

610wh/mi seems about right to me. That’s 87.76kWh for 143.87mi. If you burned 93% of battery that’d indicate about 94.5kWh of “usable” capacity in the H pack. Probably fairly close, no?

In this old thread by @wk057, he notes how to calculate usable capacity of a battery by using the rated range times the rated consumption number. The LR+ original rated consumption was 300Wh/mi. Rated range was 351mi. The implication there is that usable capacity was supposed to be 105300Wh (105.3kWh). What I noticed with the upgrade is that the range increased to 371mi, but the rated consumption decreased to 284Wh/mi. That also calculates out to 105.3kWh of usable capacity.

That's all a little beside the point, but it's a bit relevant. If rated range is 284Wh/mi, it implies that a trip that uses approximately 284Wh/mi will consume as many miles of range as I've traveled. That is, a 100 mile trip where the IC displays usage at 284Wh/mi should use about 100 miles of battery range on the meter. In that case, I should be able to consume 610Wh/mi and use slightly more than twice my rated range (2.14x to be exact). To use twice my rated range, a trip should average 568Wh/mi. However, that wasn't the case here. I went from 96% (356 miles) down to 3% (11 miles), consuming 345 miles while traveling 143 miles. At the displayed multiplier, I should have consumed 306 rated miles.

To be clear, this isn't a towing-only issue. I drove untethered by a trailer today to visit a friend 80 miles away. I found that the IC display continued to inaccurately display consumption, even when not using HVAC or other auxiliary components. I realize this isn't new ground; we've covered this before at TMC. In this case, it just seems slightly farther out of a margin of error than I've experienced with my X 90D or which I experience with my P85. It's my first exposure to the issue outside of a reasonable range, which is why I mentioned it.

I'm going to continue to log data, and I've spoken to @aesculus briefly outside of TMC about providing some data for his excellent EVTO-Tesla app so that planning and consumption measurement is a little more predictable with a camper.

Otherwise, things are going well on the trip. We are at our last campsite near Sedona and plan to head back home on Sunday/Monday on a long haul blow-it-out session (which should be great from a data perspective).

 

[ecarfan]

I was still a bit stressed on the drive, doing 3 hours of mental range math along the way.

Glad you made it, and if you had been able to depart with a 100% charge sounds like the drive would have been less stressful.

The car was reporting overall consumption of 610Wh/mi, which is clearly unrealistic and doesn't match with my real consumption. I'm still not sure what to make of it.

I wonder if Tesla has changed the range calculation algorithm to provide a “hidden” safety margin?

I'm going to continue to log data, and I've spoken to @aesculus briefly outside of TMC about providing some data for his excellent EVTO-Tesla app so that planning and consumption measurement is a little more predictable with a camper.

Perhaps EVTO is going to have to add a new choice in the drop down menu in “My Cars” for the Raven versions?

 

[aesculus]

Perhaps EVTO is going to have to add a new choice in the drop down menu in “My Cars” for the Raven versions?

Perhaps. I did add another profile for high trailers and we will need to compare that with the one he used too.

But in reality if you adjust the max range value in My Cars I think it should have covered the small difference between the 100D and Raven. TBD.

 

[BM3B]

In this old thread by @wk057, he notes how to calculate usable capacity of a battery by using the rated range times the rated consumption number. The LR+ original rated consumption was 300Wh/mi. Rated range was 351mi. The implication there is that usable capacity was supposed to be 105300Wh (105.3kWh). What I noticed with the upgrade is that the range increased to 371mi, but the rated consumption decreased to 284Wh/mi. That also calculates out to 105.3kWh of usable capacity.

That's all a little beside the point, but it's a bit relevant. If rated range is 284Wh/mi, it implies that a trip that uses approximately 284Wh/mi will consume as many miles of range as I've traveled. That is, a 100 mile trip where the IC displays usage at 284Wh/mi should use about 100 miles of battery range on the meter. In that case, I should be able to consume 610Wh/mi and use slightly more than twice my rated range (2.14x to be exact). To use twice my rated range, a trip should average 568Wh/mi. However, that wasn't the case here. I went from 96% (356 miles) down to 3% (11 miles), consuming 345 miles while traveling 143 miles. At the displayed multiplier, I should have consumed 306 rated miles.

To be clear, this isn't a towing-only issue. I drove untethered by a trailer today to visit a friend 80 miles away. I found that the IC display continued to inaccurately display consumption, even when not using HVAC or other auxiliary components. I realize this isn't new ground; we've covered this before at TMC. In this case, it just seems slightly farther out of a margin of error than I've experienced with my X 90D or which I experience with my P85. It's my first exposure to the issue outside of a reasonable range, which is why I mentioned it.

I'm going to continue to log data, and I've spoken to @aesculus briefly outside of TMC about providing some data for his excellent EVTO-Tesla app so that planning and consumption measurement is a little more predictable with a camper.

Otherwise, things are going well on the trip. We are at our last campsite near Sedona and plan to head back home on Sunday/Monday on a long haul blow-it-out session (which should be great from a data perspective).

Was it a continuous drive or did you stop along the way? Stops mess up the efficiency numbers across multiple drives because energy is used but not recorded by the energy meter, only recorded when in "D". For example: HVAC, battery cooling, doors, etc. Let's keep an eye on it, I also log all my drives using TeslaFi and analyze them to see if we can figure out what is going on. Still the difference is large as you noted, I am not sure what is going on.

 

[ohmman]

Was it a continuous drive or did you stop along the way? Stops mess up the efficiency numbers across multiple drives because energy is used but not recorded by the energy meter, only recorded when in "D". For example: HVAC, battery cooling, doors, etc. Let's keep an eye on it, I also log all my drives using TeslaFi and analyze them to see if we can figure out what is going on. Still the difference is large as you noted, I am not sure what is going on.

It was continuous, and I wasn't even using HVAC most of the way (though while driving it should be counted). TeslaFi needs adjustment to match up with what the car reports as well, but I haven't done that exercise yet.

 

[idoco]

@ohmman

I actually gave up using the IC rated miles a while back and switched to percent remaining. I've found it to be much more accurate than the IC rated miles, as long as I have a pretty good idea of my expected consumption. These estimates usually fall pretty much in line with the display of the MCU energy consumption and miles remaining.

I keep a few numbers in my head which works just fine. For example...on my 90D (~80kWh pack):

400 wH/mile (20 miles per 10% remaining)
Downhill or downwind

470 wH/mile (17 miles per 10% remaining)
Normal highway driving in good weather and relatively flat

500 wH/mile (16 miles per 10% remaining)
A little wind or a little elevation gain or speeds > 62mph

640 wH/mile (12.5 miles per 10% remaining)
Moderate elevation gain or headwinds expected

 

[idoco]

Circling back to a conversation we were having a year ago regarding using the 7-pin for boondocking power.
Ohmman's Airstream Adventures

We just got back from three weeks on the road. Almost all of it was boondocking without electrical hookups. We kept the trailer plugged into the 7-way connector on the MX almost all the time.

We only needed to plug the trailer into an electrical outlet once during the trip in order to recharge our lead acid trailer battery. We did that during a planned overnight stay when we moving from one location the next. Overall we were really happy with our ability to stay off grid with this combo.

Some observations.

Over one ten day stretch our trailer battery went from 100% to 52% (120aH from trailer battery)
Over another eight day stretch our trailer battery went from 100% to 70% (~72AH from trailer battery)
The MX on average was supplying ~2-3amp/hour to the trailer (depending on SOC of the trailer battery).
The 7-pin output turns off after ~6-8 hours of non-use of the MX. Occasionally I would wake the car (if needed) with the key fob.
The MX main battery pack dropped no more than I would expect from phantom loss during that same period of time.

Other notes
Based on the OBDII the DC/DC runs at 14.5V most of the time when the car is not "sleeping". This is whether the 7-pin is hooked up or not.
The voltage at the trailer battery end is ~13V. The battery is at the back of the 24' trailer plus the 10' extension cord I use from the MX (@ohmman 's law ).
We were camping under full canopy trees so solar would not have been a great option.

One other thing. Due to the voltage drop of the long wire run it's not possible to charge the trailer battery to full from the MX. I'm thinking of adding as buck/boost converter at the trailer battery end in order to bring up the voltage and allow full recharging from the MX

 

[ohmman]

One other thing. Due to the voltage drop of the long wire run it's not possible to charge the trailer battery to full from the MX. I'm thinking of adding as buck/boost converter at the trailer battery end in order to bring up the voltage and allow full recharging from the MX

I've considered tapping into the jump terminals in the frunk and using some fat cables to charge the camper. It wouldn't be tough, but I hate the idea of bricking or killing my tow vehicle. My rooftop solar keeps my lithium topped in most places.

We are headed in the direction of home tomorrow, on what will likely be a two day, 900 mile marathon. The trip has been great, and the new car has given me a lot more range. I'll try to do a better job of logging IC vs MCU reports vs actual miles traveled.. energy permitting.