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Open letter to Mr Elon Musk regarding showing prices "After incentives and gas saving

Discussion in 'Model S: Ordering, Production, Delivery' started by bylund, Jun 9, 2015.

  1. bylund

    bylund Member

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    Some ten days ago the design studio changed in many European countries, including Sweden, to show a price "After incentives and gas saving", instead of the actual price you pay to Tesla Motors. That caused a lot of discussion on the Tesla Club Sweden with a total 0 people supporting the move. At least in Sweden you expect prices you see to be the grand total you pay, including VAT, other taxes and fees (and tips for services where in the US tip is expected). Lots of people here feel that this move puts Tesla Motors putting in the category of less serious companies. Not that people will not actually believe that the car is 12 000 USD cheaper than it is, but people will see that this is a company that is not really to be trusted, and what else are they not honest about?

    Yes you can still see the total price, except for "Destination & Regulatory Doc Fee", that you for some reason need to add yourself to the total in the design studio, but the first price you see is not the real price.

    The president of Tesla Club Sweden wrote an open letter to Elon Musk about this, as we believe this is seriously hurting Tesla Motors.

    http://teslaclubsweden.se/open-letter-to-mr-elon-musk/
     
  2. Norseman

    Norseman Member

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    Agree with the Swedes: That kind of "pricing" belongs in the gutter, not on a website selling high end cars :crying:
     
  3. physicsfita

    physicsfita Member

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    I agree with the above sentence, with one caveat -- the words "high end" should be dropped.
     
  4. bob_p

    bob_p Member

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    Tesla's tried several variations of this to give the impression the car costs less.

    While it is true the Model S should have a lower effective cost over the lifetime of the car due to savings for items such as fuel and maintenance, when most people are looking at car prices - they are looking at the purchase price - what they have to pay to get the car - and to primarily be displaying the artificial price of the car after gas savings, continues to be misleading.

    Tesla shouldn't need to do this in order to sell cars - and by doing anything on their web site that would appear to be misleading risks damaging the credibility of their brand - and creating an opening for the auto dealerships to claim Tesla is deceiving customers with their direct sales model.

    I believe Tesla has had this feedback from customers - every time they implement a variation of the claimed savings on the order page.

    If they want to help potential customers see the savings - then list both the cash and after savings prices for each of the car models (on the left side of the order page).

    And, they should consider putting the cash price at the top on the right side and then show "after savings" below that.
     
  5. purplewalt

    purplewalt Active Member

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    Concur.
    TM should show the full price for the car minus the delivery fees, not some sort of projected price with incentives, rebates and operational savings added in.

    There really is no need to "tilt" the playing field one way or the other.
    Buyers are mature enough to understand what the actual car cost is, so please treat them with respect and give the the real price upfront.
     
  6. Drucifer

    Drucifer Active Member

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    #6 Drucifer, Jun 9, 2015
    Last edited: Jun 9, 2015
    Since my Model S actually uses about 25% more watt-hours per mile than my Chevy Volt does, maybe instead of $10k in savings over 5 years, for me it should indicated approx. $150.00 in additional "fuel" expense annually ($750.00 additional over 5 years).

    I am fine with the "net of tax savings", since they know where you live, and can produce that accurately. Quoting assumed gas savings is just stupid, and even insulting.
     
  7. MsElectric

    MsElectric Active Member

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    They should list the "savings" separately. We drive so little that the gasoline savings don't matter much to us at all. I think the vast majority of people are not a fan on how they present pricing.

    IMHO they should just list the actual price and below it list any anticipated savings.
     
  8. BerTX

    BerTX Member

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    An ICE car dealer would not show the price of their car lower because it gets better fuel economy than the average car.

    I guess this is my problem with it -- the disappointment that Tesla would be more deceptive than a car dealer...
     
  9. jmccrack

    jmccrack Member

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    They should list the "savings" separately. . I agree with this.
     
  10. Shawn Snider

    Shawn Snider Member

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    I agree completely that they should abolish the "est gas savings $$$" and also fix the transport+dock fee that you currently have to 'add-on' even though it's necessary......... Whoever they put in charge of their Design Studio needs to be let go or something, seeming as it's Tesla Motors primary interface with customer's, you'd think they'd sink some serious money into it to make it unbelievably appealing.... The current one looks like someone just **** it out.
     
  11. kuttakamina

    kuttakamina Member

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    Agreed. They should mention total cost first, and then optionally show deductions.
    The current pricing is deceptive, belongs to used cars salesmen.
     
  12. toto_48313

    toto_48313 CAN P #5

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    I agree, Tesla should put the complete price, and put an annual cost of ownership below. They may even add the price of an ICE car which have the same annual cost of ownership on the side so it will be easy for the customer to compare the impact of incentives and energy saving.
     
  13. 1208

    1208 Active Member

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    I agree with BerTX.

    It is similar to an ICE car company showing the price of a car with -£3500 after fuel savings*

    [1]If you drive it only 5 miles per year.

    It's a joke.:cursing:
     
  14. Stefan T

    Stefan T Member

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    good to lett the world see it
     
  15. eye.surgeon

    eye.surgeon Member

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    I agree, the after gas savings pricing smacks of old school car salesmanship. We can do our own math.
     
  16. Anthony7

    Anthony7 Member

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    They've already been marketing their cars price with included gas savings/$7500 tax credit in the US however I do agree it shouldn't be the case anywhere. As far as their gas savings estimate, I spend about half that on gas since I don't drive alot of miles. Everyone keeps talking about the Model X at $35k, well I'm willing to bet that is with the gas savings/credit, etc... plus if you want any extras in the car. That X will be close to 50-60k leaving those out that have been waiting to get that cheaper 35K car.
     
  17. yobigd20

    yobigd20 Well-Known Member

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    we've all said here that it's deceptive and misleading. much discussion. i have no idea why Tesla continues to advertise like this when "the people" (it's own customers!) are saying this is bad.

    one thread, including a quote from Elon where he said he's not changing this: Elon discusses showing Tesla Pricing as reflective of annual gasoline savings

    another recent thread: Tesla continues to list price with gas savings/incentives and offer odd bundles

    and another discussion about it embedded in this thread too: Tesla cuts 60kWh Model S, entry-level Model S is now 70D.

    it's very clear we all want this gone. it's a blemish on their image for sure.
     
  18. TomServo

    TomServo Member

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    I agree, resorting to this "fuzzy math" is so unbecoming. In fact when I was out shopping for my first Volt in Jan 2012 one of the local dealers tried the exact same sales tactic with me. I actually told him that was BS and bought my Volt from another dealer.

    Tesla please revise your marketing/web page. We know what it really costs to buy a new Tesla.
     
  19. JER

    JER Member

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    Lamentably, this change is on the UK design studio too.

    This is especially ridiculous when you consider what Tesla's strategic goal is. Imagine what it would look like if other manufacturers adopted this policy:

    Tesla maths.jpg
     
  20. physicsfita

    physicsfita Member

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    I have heard concern from some of my friends that the Model 3 base price is really going to be $45k, because that would hit the promised $35k price "after gas savings". I hope Tesla will at least provide some clarity on that -- I guess we'll find out when its announced...
     

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