Opening the doors in the Model S if power fails

[cinergi]

This last weekend, I learned some details about opening the doors that I almost forgot to share ...

• The interior handles on the front doors electronically open the door; if you continue pulling them all the way, a cable engages and unlocks the door in case of power loss
• The rear door latch is in the body frame and not the door. Therefore, in the event of power loss, there's something to pull on under the seat which will open the door
• There's no way to get into the car if it's 12V system completely fails (note that this is NOT the same as running out of range). Unlike the Roadster which has a keyhole in the bottom of the door. This would be an extremely rare situation (and has been on the Roadster, which has an inferior system)

 

[pguerra]

This last weekend, I learned some details about opening the doors that I almost forgot to share ...

• The interior handles on the front doors electronically open the door; if you continue pulling them all the way, a cable engages and unlocks the door in case of power loss
• The rear door latch is in the body frame and not the door. Therefore, in the event of power loss, there's something to pull on under the seat which will open the door
• There's no way to get into the car if it's 12V system completely fails (note that this is NOT the same as running out of range). Unlike the Roadster which has a keyhole in the bottom of the door. This would be an extremely rare situation (and has been on the Roadster, which has an inferior system)

Thanks cinergi this is very important. So what is the solution to get into vehicle if 12V system fails (but not the electric motor Li Ion batteries)? Do we just plug it in and the 12V system recharges? I presume after 5+ yrs this battery would have to be replaced.

 

[cinergi]

I doubt a failure of the 12V battery would mean a failure of the 12V system altogether. I'm also sure the car tracks the health of the 12V battery and Tesla will replace it before it's a problem.

 

[Robert.Boston]

Sorry, that's not a great answer. The battery leads on my car worked their way loose (or something -- they were loose) and I'd often find the car without power. Having no backup plan to get into the Model S unless the 12v battery is alive isn't very smart. Can the frunk open to provide access to the battery?

 

[cinergi]

It would certainly be an annoying situation. I don't know that a failure of the battery (or its connection) would constitute a complete failure of the 12V system (e.g. 12V also comes from somewhere else in order to keep that 12V battery charged). I suspect there'd still be a way to unlock the car. (this is based on my understanding of the Roadster and what I've heard about the improved systems in the Model S) But getting more details from Tesla would be nice. Maybe I'll see if I can find out ...

 

[Doug_G]

I suspect the 12V battery and the 400V traction battery (the "pack") would both have to fail in order to lock you out of the car.

Probably there is some emergency method for the Rangers to get into the car, requiring hand tools or some such.

 

[AustinPowers]

I'm not sure European safety laws would allow a car to be sold here if it can't be opened in case of a flat (or otherwise unusable) battery.
Tesla will have to provide another way that doesn't mean having to smash a window - or using a can opener, chainsaw etc. ;-)

 

[Norbert]

It will be a secret that Tesla shares only with AAA.

 

[Johan]

In that rare case maybe you can "jump" the 12V by connecting to another cars battery? If you can get to the "+" and "-" connector...

 

[jerry33]

The 12V battery seems to be a significant problem for every car that has a large battery. I've heard that originally Tesla didn't have a 12V battery but later they changed. What I haven't heard is why.

 

[ddruz]

The 12V battery seems to be a significant problem for every car that has a large battery. I've heard that originally Tesla didn't have a 12V battery but later they changed. What I haven't heard is why.

Do you suppose the 12V battery was added to power the ancillary systems to help prevent bricking? I read somewhere that's one of the reasons the Leaf also has a 12V battery. Where did they add that battery? Does anyone know? I've wondered if that's what's under the arm rests and why they can't give us storage there. Does anyone know the answers? Thanks.

 

[widodh]

Do you suppose the 12V battery was added to power the ancillary systems to help prevent bricking? I read somewhere that's one of the reasons the Leaf also has a 12V battery. Where did they add that battery? Does anyone know? I've wondered if that's what's under the arm rests and why they can't give us storage there. Does anyone know the answers? Thanks.

Maybe?

You could always charge the 12V battery with the big pack, but when the big pack goes under a certain point you can cut off all the power to the pack and just let it sit there.

The 12V battery could then still power some vital functions of the car (like the locks and GSM/GPS module) so it can be revived again.

It would however be useful if there was an easy accessible point where you can charge the 12V battery if it died for some weird reason.

Wonder if they are using some cool Lithium-Ion 12V battery (Probably not)

 

[Robert.Boston]

The problems created by getting rid of a physical key....

 

[widodh]

The problems created by getting rid of a physical key....

True. A backup physical key which allows you access to the frunk for example would be handy. From there you could then open the door with a physical cable or something.

 

[efusco]

There's gotta be some mechanism to get in if there's a failure of the 12V system--it doesn't necessarily need to be a complete battery failure causing the problem, but it's magical thinking to believe that this won't happen once in a while. Unless there's some external access to the 12V one would be reduced to using a jimmy bar just to get into the car.

 

[cinergi]

I've opened pandora's box :redface:

At this point, I'd say we don't have confirmation one way or the other. It's what one employee told me this weekend. They could be wrong. I'm trying to get confirmation now.. let's not turn this into 100 "me, too!" posts please :smile:

 

[Jeeps17]

let's not turn this into 100 "me, too!" posts please :smile:

+1

:biggrin:

 

[Doug_G]

I'm not sure European safety laws would allow a car to be sold here if it can't be opened in case of a flat (or otherwise unusable) battery.

In case of an accident, there is a trivial but destructive way to get in. Smash the window, reach in and pull the lever.

 

[grommet]

I remember when I returned to our dead Audi at the airport after a vacation; kids left the rear dome light on. No problem since I had a portable 12V jumper in the trunk, right? Turns out the trunk, even though it has a keyhole available, has an electronic lock... so it wouldn't open, and there is no "analog" cable to open it inside the car. And no, I wasn't able to crawl through the "ski" slot between the rear seats to get to the jumper. :wink: Isn't technology wonderful?

 

[SCW-Greg]

After looking at the latest skateboard deck they had on our showroom floor, and reviewing the test drive cars, can we even say the 12V system is separate from the main battery pack? I saw no evidence of a "separate" 12v battery anywhere... not that doesn't exist. Nor did I ask about it, but it just seemed that the whole car was so thoroughly built around a clean simple system - the main batt pack. ???

So perhaps it's just a matter of plugging the car in to get live juice?