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OpenStreetMaps and Smart Summon

S4WRXTTCS

Well-Known Member
May 3, 2015
5,742
6,897
Snohomish, WA
Recently it's been discovered that Smart Summon builds its path data using OpenStreetMaps data.
Or at least there is a lot of supporting evidence that suggests this.

Like this post on Reddit
Smart Summon paths use OpenStreetMap data for parking aisles, intersections, one-way directions (otherwise it can go wrong way / through parking spots) : teslamotors

As far as I understand the car uses OpenStreetMaps for any navigational data. So things like the speed limit it shows for a certain road is likely from OpenStreetMaps.

Assuming that's correct then we should be able to contribute to OpenStreetMaps ourselves where we pick a few places in our region as test cases, and we get them updated. After updating them it should only take a Map update cycle or two before the car has the additional data.

So my plan is to pick one place to add Parking lot data, and one place to fix a speed limit. Then sit back and see what happens. How long it takes to get onto OpenStreetMaps, and how long it takes to eventually make its way onto the car.

But, I don't have any experience with OpenStreetMaps. If I can't figure out how to do it myself then I'll probably just bribe someone to do it.

My hope was to find a few other people in the PNW to work with on this experiment. If I'm not able to figure it out I'll probably just end up bribing someone to fix a few areas that annoy me. :p
 

ratsbew

Active Member
Mar 3, 2012
1,290
1,027
O'Fallon, IL
Yes. I just spent about 45 minutes updating my local parking lots that I use to "torture test" smart summon. Who knows how long it will take for that data to be used by the car though. Maybe it's realtime and not connected to nav database updates.

Most of my torture test locations weren't even in OSM, but those that are...I recall the car preforming MUCH better so it's quit obvious to me that it's using OSM data.

Here is my family farm that I just sketched out. Smart Summon was hopeless here when I tried it since they are dirt/gravel/grass paths and not the concrete and curbs that the perception net has been trained on.

9porr1W.png
 

im.thatoneguy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
331
602
Seattle, WA
I updated all of my commutes speed limits one day. It didn't show up in Tesla for several map updates. They don't pull speed limits from OSM very often.

I did update my work parking lot a few months back just-because and it's reflected in smart summon.
 

S4WRXTTCS

Well-Known Member
May 3, 2015
5,742
6,897
Snohomish, WA
Yes. I just spent about 45 minutes updating my local parking lots that I use to "torture test" smart summon. Who knows how long it will take for that data to be used by the car though. Maybe it's realtime and not connected to nav database updates.

Most of my torture test locations weren't even in OSM, but those that are...I recall the car preforming MUCH better so it's quit obvious to me that it's using OSM data.

Here is my family farm that I just sketched out. Smart Summon was hopeless here when I tried it since they are dirt/gravel/grass paths and not the concrete and curbs that the perception net has been trained on.

9porr1W.png

What tool did you use to do the updating? Is there an App that you can use, and simply walk the path?
 

eli_

Member
May 14, 2018
394
755
Bellevue, WA
I've found OpenStreetMap is pretty easy to edit, just sign up for account and make sure to run through the tutorial. I hope the upcoming Smart Parking feature doesn't depend on OSM to find parking spots because it's rare to find spots that are individually mapped on there.
 
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joetomasone

Member
Oct 1, 2019
42
33
Spring Hill, FL
It would definitely appear that if Tesla is indeed using OSM that we will have to wait for a Nav update. I saw reference to someone who said that they edited OSM and the Tesla immediately began to use that data - in my testing, that is false.

I'm not going to go crazy editing parking lots until it can be verified that it will help Smart Summon. If so, I will be editing them like a madman.
 
Jan 15, 2019
58
89
Boston, MA
Can someone help me understand how I should be editing parking lots to best help Summon?

I assume it's best to give Summon explicit directional information about which way to travel in a parking lot, but please correct me if this understanding is incorrect (it takes more time to create these setups, anyways, so you certainly won't hurt my feelings!).

Thank you!
 

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MikeBur

ManualPilot
Dec 8, 2014
1,373
737
Seattle, WA
Can someone help me understand how I should be editing parking lots to best help Summon?

I assume it's best to give Summon explicit directional information about which way to travel in a parking lot, but please correct me if this understanding is incorrect (it takes more time to create these setups, anyways, so you certainly won't hurt my feelings!).

Thank you!
From what I know, admittedly not a great deal, it’s best to NOT make lanes directional unless they actually are
If you do, the car will presume it can travel down center of road as it’s one way vs staying to right when noticing oncoming traffic.

Also, this could make for longer travel time in parking lots as the A* algorithm (presumably) will have to follow the directionality as priority over shortest path
A* search algorithm - Wikipedia
 
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Jan 15, 2019
58
89
Boston, MA
If you do, the car will presume it can travel down center of road as it’s one way vs staying to right when noticing oncoming traffic.

Thank you for the reply -- did you check out my picture?

The car might not "travel down the center of the road as it's one way" with the layout I created ... not sure, though. I think I might keep one parking lot this way for a few weeks and see how Summon likes / does not like the design.
 

S4WRXTTCS

Well-Known Member
May 3, 2015
5,742
6,897
Snohomish, WA
Can someone help me understand how I should be editing parking lots to best help Summon?

I assume it's best to give Summon explicit directional information about which way to travel in a parking lot, but please correct me if this understanding is incorrect (it takes more time to create these setups, anyways, so you certainly won't hurt my feelings!).

Thank you!

I think this is the wrong approach.

OpenStreet maps is used in a lot of different ways, and we have to be respectful of that.

So when we update information we have to do so in accordance with the way OpenStreet Maps wants us to do it. That has to be rule #1, and as long as you follow that rule you can made tweaks to help smart summon as long as they're factually accurate.

I don't believe explicit directional information is in accordance with standard parking lot mapping using OpenStreet maps. I might be wrong about this as I've only done a single edit so far. On my edit I made it a single road as that's what it is. Of course smart summon went too far to the left. Argghh.
 
Jan 15, 2019
58
89
Boston, MA
I think this is the wrong approach.

OpenStreet maps is used in a lot of different ways, and we have to be respectful of that.

So when we update information we have to do so in accordance with the way OpenStreet Maps wants us to do it. That has to be rule #1, and as long as you follow that rule you can made tweaks to help smart summon as long as they're factually accurate.

I don't believe explicit directional information is in accordance with standard parking lot mapping using OpenStreet maps. I might be wrong about this as I've only done a single edit so far. On my edit I made it a single road as that's what it is. Of course smart summon went too far to the left. Argghh.

I don’t disagree — I just haven’t been able to find guidance one way or the other (you doesn't sound like you have either).

Sure, adding directional parking aisles might be considered overkill, but I haven’t found anything that says it’s incorrect.

If someone discovers it is incorrect, please let me know. Otherwise, I’m happy to spend effort on the overkill if it improves Summon in the parking lots I frequent.
 

MikeBur

ManualPilot
Dec 8, 2014
1,373
737
Seattle, WA
@theBurtReynold You likely should just use the open street map forums to find answers you will accept.

Some of us are already on those and seems that you need to be proved wrong vs able to receive advice.

as @S4WRXTTCS says, and I originally said, you need to be representing roads and directions in parking lots factually correctly vs your own interpretation of what be convenient for you. Check the open street map contributor requirements again. That work?
 
Last edited:

floatplane

Member
Aug 4, 2019
92
89
Kirkland WA
If the lane has perpendicular parking then it depends on whether there is one-way or two-way markings like painted arrows at the end of the lane or even no markings at all.

When there is angle parking even if there is no markings or signage you should almost always use directional lane, because it is not expected for vehicles to enter the wrong way. (That is the way it is by my local supermarket, if a car enters the “wrong way” chaos ensues if another vehicle is in the lane traveling the “right way”, because the lanes are narrow and most people can’t cope with close passing.)

If Teslas start traveling wrong way (because they don’t understand the angle parking etiquette) it’ll get stuck and you’ll have to run over and manually rescue it. Better to have it make a circuit of 2 entire lanes rather than get stuck creating chaos, and get a reputation amongst ICE drivers that Tesla’s are bad. We need to convince and convert everyone to EVs.
 

eli_

Member
May 14, 2018
394
755
Bellevue, WA
Can someone help me understand how I should be editing parking lots to best help Summon?

I assume it's best to give Summon explicit directional information about which way to travel in a parking lot, but please correct me if this understanding is incorrect (it takes more time to create these setups, anyways, so you certainly won't hurt my feelings!).

Thank you!

OpenStreetMaps is supposed to match reality, not edited to trick Smart Summon into working. Also road paths are not separated out for each direction of travel, unless they're physically separated in reality (like a grass or concrete median in the middle). Two-ways paths should just be a regular road without a one-way restriction.
 
May 1, 2013
422
327
Millington, NJ
Has anyone verified that updating open street maps helps summons?

I don't think the car uses openstreetmaps at all, the map details that I see on both car screen and phone app looks to be Google maps, not openstreetmaps.
 
Jan 15, 2019
58
89
Boston, MA
Has anyone verified that updating open street maps helps summons?

I don't think the car uses openstreetmaps at all, the map details that I see on both car screen and phone app looks to be Google maps, not openstreetmaps.

Someone did a compelling side-by-side where, suddenly, the path planning in a parking lot started respecting one-ways that he had created.
 

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