Option to turn regen braking off...

[Adopado]

That's why god invented cruise control

Well, that should be the case but I find that I notice a slight on/off accelerator effect (in cruise) that I can completely avoid if I use human controlled foot action!

 

[gavine]

Well, that should be the case but I find that I notice a slight on/off accelerator effect (in cruise) that I can completely avoid if I use human controlled foot action!

Agreed. Human-controlled is better, but the op doesn't want to do that so cruise is a close second option.

 

[Rooster6655]

Coasting with no regen is the equivalent of coasting in neutral.

Yes if you could put it into neutral it would have the intended effect, not sure if possible unless parked though

 

[Durzel]

I was originally under the impression that the harder the car brakes the more regen is going on, but in the i3 if I change the display to show consumption or regen kWh then it actually peaks at the middle of the display. The display itself even suggests (and in Eco Mode even shows arrows that point towards the middle).

The display therefore suggests that optimal driving is actually feathering the throttle so that you're neither accelerating or slowing down, and that max regen occurs when the gauge is closer to the centre rather than when the car is regen braking hard (if you lift off the accelerator completely).

Is that wrong?

 

[Jason71]

I was originally under the impression that the harder the car brakes the more regen is going on, but in the i3 if I change the display to show consumption or regen kWh then it actually peaks at the middle of the display. The display itself even suggests (and in Eco Mode even shows arrows that point towards the middle).

The display therefore suggests that optimal driving is actually feathering the throttle so that you're neither accelerating or slowing down, and that max regen occurs when the gauge is closer to the centre rather than when the car is regen braking hard (if you lift off the accelerator completely).

Is that wrong?

current generates heat. heat is bad so the most efficient thing is to minimise current. which means the optimal for accelerating and regen braking is as gently as you can (be bothered with).

 

[gavine]

Yes if you could put it into neutral it would have the intended effect, not sure if possible unless parked though

I haven't tried it, but I think if you slide the gear selector up gently, it'll go-into neutral. If you push-past the indent, it'll go-into reverse.

 

[WannabeOwner]

I haven't tried it, but I think if you slide the gear selector up gently, it'll go-into neutral. If you push-past the indent, it'll go-into reverse.

Yes. I routinely use N for coast (to me it feels more efficient that idle-position for throttle pedal, and I have to look at Dash to achieve that, but that's a subjective opinion).

You can't select R above (I think) 5 MPH, and likewise R-to-D

And if you fancy pushing P then you have to push-and-hold for the "emergency brake"

 

[ewoodrick]

Hi, I would love to get your thoughts on the option of turning regen braking off. I know the cars have settings for normal and low, but there seems to be no option for zero regen braking at the moment.

The Background to this is that I test drove an e golf and very much enjoyed the option to turn it off entirely. The car free wheeled with hardly any resistance and if the road was flat, you could glide for a considerable distance and only lose 5-10mph. If the road was in any way downhill then you would either maintain your speed/go quicker. once you arrived at a junction, the initial braking (pedal) was regen, therefore it felt like I was not using as much battery as I was free wheeling, and still gaining energy when braking through regen through the brake pedal.

Does anyone know whether this actually increases or decreases expected range, and it would be great to hear people’s thoughts on this feature and whether it is even possible in the Tesla.

Turn it off and you will lose 20-30% of your range.

It takes a few hours to get used to, but after that when you go back to other cars, you really want them to have an equivalent

 

[MrBadger]

It takes a few hours to get used to

erm, about 5 minutes, probably less although a little longer to perfect. Its just such a natural way to drive.

 

[Joelly]

Exactly. On that stretch where the op can coast for a mile, if he puts it in cruise control, the car will effectively hold the throttle in the neutral position for him, thus enabling him to basically "coast" with using the pedal. It may blip up or down slightly, but that would be negligible.

There you go OP....you now have the solution to your problem.

Thanks. That was the advise from tesla salesperson, however it seemed like it might not be worth turning it on for such a small stretch.

 

[Joelly]

LR is quite a price premium ... always has been - same with 75/100 Model-S or X (although they also came with higher trim levels too ...)

Justification of LR on Range, alone, makes it look expensive. I value my time, and a lot of my journeys are business, so I have been able to persuade myself that time-saved is worth the increase in price, over lifetime of vehicle. But if you are exploring the country for leisure that justification may be more difficult? perhaps you can manage just using better planning so that you can always destination-charge whilst you are exploring on foot

I'm moving from Model-S 90 to a Raven LR. Currently I am out of range (and Supercharge) about 2 days a month. I chose the 90 over the 75 on the basis of how much time it would save me:
the days when the extra range would mean not needing to charge at all;
avoiding a detour to a closer-Supercharger by being able to reach a more distant one on route;
on days when I do charge I need fewer top-up-miles and stop for less time;
LR charges faster than SR (lower charging voltage on 75 and pro-rata for battery size).
the journeys were I would need to charge into Taper on a 75 but not on a 90 (my car takes 5 minutes for each 10% from 10%-70%, but 9 minutes to 80% and 15 minutes to 90%.)

The Raven is going to reduce my Supercharging to a couple of times a year ... perhaps no bad thing as the Stalls are more frequently occupied since Model-3 arrival. So bigger battery also gives more chance of avoiding all-stalls-full with a SR.

Thanks for the thoughts on that. For me it works out about £100 a month more expensive, that will also mean less home charging and less supercharging so I will recoup some of that back. I am probably going to attempt no home charger for the time being so there are also some cost savings by going with the LR.

 

[Joelly]

We have a friend who had an early Golf-e on longish term trial, and a 45 mile each way trip mostly motorway had her needing to stop to charge on way back for fear of not getting home. Don't know how she drove, what mode or what SoC when she left home, but 90 mile round trip was outside her comfort zone.

That’s Interesting. Not sure whether it was because it was a weekend test drive, but I was very comfortable draining the battery and arriving home with 5 miles on the clock. I knew I was in distance of home and it forced eco mode + so there was literally nothing I could do to reduce miles. It was a good car, but it seems to me unless you can get it on business rates through salary sacrifice, it’s not a particularly good option.

 

[WannabeOwner]

I am probably going to attempt no home charger for the time being so there are also some cost savings by going with the LR.

Where will you charge?

Key benefit of home charging is come-home-plug-in instead of the weekly? 5-10 minutes on a smelly petrol forecourt and queuing to pay (and queuing for pump if using Supermarket fuel).

But on top of the OLEV grant you might need £500 for installation (less the additional Scottish grants)

 

[Joelly]

Where will you charge?

Key benefit of home charging is come-home-plug-in instead of the weekly? 5-10 minutes on a smelly petrol forecourt and queuing to pay (and queuing for pump if using Supermarket fuel).

But on top of the OLEV grant you might need £500 for installation (less the additional Scottish grants)

I can charge at work for 90% of my charging . It would be when I take a week off that it might be more difficult, but even if I topped up for 10 hours a night at home, more
Likely 12, should top up a good chunk.

 

[SVMike]

In the real world regen saves energy and increases range.

Well, yes and no.

It would be a better statement to say that regen loses energy, just not as much as friction brakes. So this assumes that you want to slow down. If you don't want to slow down, why would you want to lose energy?
Regen loses energy because you lose energy when charging the battery and you lose energy when using energy from the battery and using the motor to turn the wheels. I don't know how much net energy is captured in regen, but 50% would probably be good. Of course friction brakes recover nothing.
But if you are driving on a very gentle downhill it would be best to not do any regen at all...it is just difficult and a bit tiring to try and drive with a tiny bit of throttle for long periods.

I've driven 4 different Prius models, including the plug-in and also a Nissan Leaf. In a Prius plugin I was able to drive almost 100 miles using no gas with a battery that only has a 14 mile range by smart use of regen and neutral coasting.

In 2012, as a new Prius Plugin owner I got asked to be in a market research study where I got to drive 8 different EVs and PHEVs. After it was over it was revealed that VW was the sponsor. They were testing out their recuperation (regen) paddles where you could dynamically adjust the regen from low to high depending on the driving situation.
This seems like a good idea to me.
The Tesla M3 is a great car but there are some things that could be improved.

 

[SVMike]

Basically, is this “concern” (it’s extremely minor) just not a concern at all and I have nothing to worry about? Any input from anyone who has driven an EV with a zero regen option and driven a Tesla would be perfect but any input would be appreciated.

I replied in a previous post. In the Prius (including the Prius plugin) you can easily shift to neutral and get great mpg or range on the small kwh battery. But your speed, the road slope and traffic all have to be right to do this.

 

[WannabeOwner]

I can charge at work for 90% of my charging

Perfect

I don't know how much net energy is captured in regen, but 50% would probably be good

I think that is pessimistic. I have often seen it (round trip : regen-and-back-to-wheels) quoted as 70-80% efficient.

 

[MrBadger]

I can charge at work for 90% of my charging .

Now, yes, but in future? I don't think it will be long before the number of EV's will overload many company EV point facilities. Where I use to work, we had 6 charge points, and cars were needed to be rotated during the day. That was circumstances where 7kW could do a decent fill in a couple of hours. But for times when having to be hooked up for longer are needed, that rotation becomes more limiting, so say you need 3 hours (@7kW is about 90 miles), plus dwell time (only needs someone to be in an hours meeting, or just antisocial), you have suddenly turned a stall that could handle 3 or 4 cars a day, to one that might be able to do less than 2 a day at charge levels people are requiring.

 

[SVMike]

I think that is pessimistic. I have often seen it (round trip : regen-and-back-to-wheels) quoted as 70-80% efficient.

Doubtful that it is that high, but that is probably the "peak" number in any case.

There are 4 main places where energy is lost if you exclude wiring losses.
First, the kinetic energy goes through the motor (acting as a generator), then you charge the battery, then you discharge the battery, then you go through the motor back to the wheels. If each conversion is 90% efficient the net effect is 64% efficient assuming optimal battery temperature. In reality I've seen reports that the Model 3 motors are "up to" 93% efficient. Look at any motor efficiency vs speed graph and you'll see numbers as low as 70-80% at low speeds.

I've measured charging from a ChargePoint at about 85% efficient...peak. This is different than the car charging itself, of course.
But you can see that at the low end all 4 numbers could be ~80%, thus a 36% round trip.

So, yes, the number could vary between 40% and 70% and the overall number is an integration over time of this.

 

[Joelly]

Now, yes, but in future? I don't think it will be long before the number of EV's will overload many company EV point facilities. Where I use to work, we had 6 charge points, and cars were needed to be rotated during the day. That was circumstances where 7kW could do a decent fill in a couple of hours. But for times when having to be hooked up for longer are needed, that rotation becomes more limiting, so say you need 3 hours (@7kW is about 90 miles), plus dwell time (only needs someone to be in an hours meeting, or just antisocial), you have suddenly turned a stall that could handle 3 or 4 cars a day, to one that might be able to do less than 2 a day at charge levels people are requiring.

I have been reassured by the fleet manager that A BEV will get priority and B they are likely to introduce more chargers. I think we have upwards of 16 and about 2 BEV’s at current. There is space for probably another 10-20.
im comfortable with this and if it changes over time then it changes over time and I have to pay a bit towards electricity.