P100D Brakes

[jdk325]

Question to the group - I purchased a new MX P100D in September. I have had a MS and an M3 in the past. The brakes in the P100D seem like they are no better (actually worse IMO) than both the MS and M3. Are they actually supposed to be higher quality brakes on the Performance models or is the only difference over the standard brakes just that the calipers are painted red?

 

[saniflash]

Question to the group - I purchased a new MX P100D in September. I have had a MS and an M3 in the past. The brakes in the P100D seem like they are no better (actually worse IMO) than both the MS and M3. Are they actually supposed to be higher quality brakes on the Performance models or is the only difference over the standard brakes just that the calipers are painted red?

pretty sure it's only the color of the calipers.

 

[Yinn]

There have been some brake changes over the years, on the MX as well as the MS. This is info specific to the MX.

The fronts are the same, regardless of P or not and just a color difference
FR BRAKE CALIPER ASSY M12 LH: Part # 1027621-00-C
FR BRAKE CALIPER ASSY M12 LH - RED: Part #1027621-01-C

Originally, the main difference in the brakes was just the color. P and non-P cars used Brembo calipers and Rassini rotors.
RR BRAKE CALIPER ASSY M12 LH: Part # 1027643-00-A
RR BRAKE CALIPER ASSY M12 LH - RED: Part # 1027643-01-B

Somewhere along the way, the move was made to move to a Mando rear brake setup. The Mando brakes did not come in red, so these were for non-P's only. The cutoff was supposed to be 11/22/2016 as indicated by the Tesla Shop for the Red Brake Upgrade but the reality is that the Brembo's were used for a bit after that.
RR BRAKE CALIPER ASSY LH - MANDO: Part # 1078541-00-B

The visual difference in whether you have a Brembo setup or a Mando setup is the emergency brake caliper. A Brembo setup will have a second caliper. A Mando setup will not. The second parking brake caliper on the Brembo is also in grey, not in red like the main caliper.

So if you have a new P100D, then yes you have an upgraded brake system in the rear over a new non-P car. Your calipers, rotors, pads are all different and upgraded parts. But compared to my 2017 MX75D, you just have red paint.

Now for some more interesting things. Compared to your MS and M3, the MX is a much heavier car. They may have an overall smaller brake system; but there's less to stop. This weight might also attribute to your subjective braking feel, but objectively, the numbers don't seem right. The stopping numbers on the 2016 models came in from 106-113ft from 60mph to 0. They varied based on 20"s or 22" wheels and associated tires; but in 2016 they all used the Brembo's. For comparison sake, Motor Trend published a list of "20 Best 60 to 0 distances recorded by Motor Trend" in 2015. #16-20 on that list came in tied at 101 ft (Audi R8, RS5, RS7, Shelby GT500); and the same folks tested the Model X and got 106 ft with a P90D on 22" wheels and tires.

Then in 2018, CR tested the Model 3 (didn't specify sport or not) Prior to upgrade it stopped in 152ft and stated it was "25 feet longer than Tesla's own Model X SUVs" Which implies the MX now stops in 127ft (didn't specify P or not) It also went on to say that the TM3 with the updated software now stops at 133ft; which would still be 6 ft further than the implied MX distance.

I'm not sure if this helps you or not...

 

[DCGOO]

There have been some brake changes over the years, on the MX as well as the MS. This is info specific to the MX.

Somewhere along the way, the move was made to move to a Mando rear brake setup. The Mando brakes did not come in red, so these were for non-P's only. The cutoff was supposed to be 11/22/2016 as indicated by the Tesla Shop for the Red Brake Upgrade but the reality is that the Brembo's were used for a bit after that.

The visual difference in whether you have a Brembo setup or a Mando setup is the emergency brake caliper. A Brembo setup will have a second caliper. A Mando setup will not. The second parking brake caliper on the Brembo is also in grey, not in red like the main caliper.

But didn't they do this to ALL models? IOW, there is still no difference between the P and non-P of the same vintage. After all, the cars weigh roughly the same and both have to be able to stop. Brakes are (should be) designed for worst case requirements.

 

[Yinn]

But didn't they do this to ALL models?

Yes, I was trying to convey that with my first sentence. The cutoffs occured at different times though, I have a MX that was built after my MS and the MS has the Mando whereas the MX has Brembos. I think I saw Brembo's on non-P MXs into Q2 of 2017.

IOW, there is still no difference between the P and non-P of the same vintage. After all, the cars weigh roughly the same and both have to be able to stop. Brakes are (should be) designed for worst case requirements.

There's about a 500lb difference between the MX P100D (5531lbs) and the MX 75D (5072lbs). That's not a ton (literally!) but it's still some heft; about a 9% difference overall. Given that the rears only do about 25-30% of the braking, the actual effects and differences between the two calipers are probably very minimal; and the cost savings is probably the driver to move to Mando.

But there is a difference still. The Sport Brakes on the Model3 have different part numbers. The red brakes on the P100Ds on the MS and MX are still different (in the rears) than the non-P ones as of today. Back then, there was no difference. Today there is.

 

[BigMskiman]

Question to the group - I purchased a new MX P100D in September. I have had a MS and an M3 in the past. The brakes in the P100D seem like they are no better (actually worse IMO) than both the MS and M3. Are they actually supposed to be higher quality brakes on the Performance models or is the only difference over the standard brakes just that the calipers are painted red?

What do you mean by worse, just the xxxft from 60mph to 0? Or does you car pull to side during braking or something else......?

 

[Anzir]

Brakes? What are those? I rarely use mine in my P100D with the regen but it seems that regen is less aggressive in V9.

I'm assuming the difference is mainly due to difference in size/weight of the vehicles.