P3D crowd: Competing vs. high-performance ICE from a roll?

[Dolemite]

So it's pretty evident that there's not many ICE cars that can take us from a dig - i.e. stopped at a light, etc.

I'd like to hear what others' experiences are toying with others from a roll. This is something I'm less confident about, since I know power decreases with SoC & because the car has only one gear... it could get a little wheezy at higher speeds, albeit it's still effing quick.

Second week I had my P3D- I absolutely vaporized a brand-new BMW M3 at a light (my former dream car & the brand that left me behind). It felt great. Not sure I'd have the same luck from a 70+ mph roll... Anyone have any experiences? Including SoC would be useful.

***Disclaimer***

Street racing is illegal & I fully condone it.

 

[Solmors]

All the videos I've seen that start at a roll of anywhere between 30 and 70 mph the P3D destroys anything put up against it except super cars. The reason is the instant torque and on gearbox vs the ICE car needing to rev up and shift to a lower gear.

Carwow did a video with the P3D+, BMW M3, and RS4 in a drag race from a stand still, and from a 50mph rolling start. Tesla shot off but the BMW eventually caught up at ~130mph.

 

[Dolemite]

All the videos I've seen that start at a roll of anywhere between 30 and 70 mph the P3D destroys anything put up against it except super cars. The reason is the instant torque and on gearbox vs the ICE car needing to rev up and shift to a lower gear.

Carwow did a video with the P3D+, BMW M3, and RS4 in a drag race from a stand still, and from a 50mph rolling start. Tesla shot off but the BMW eventually caught up at ~130mph.

Nice - thanks. Didn't seem to be at 100% SoC, either, and this was before the 5% power bump this year!

 

[Knightshade]

A while back I posted passing times (30-50, 50-70 and 30-70) on various model 3s, and compared em to insanely expensive supercars...the teslas were embarrassingly quicker (and this was before the 2nd power update).... like the NON P AWD beat virtually everything on the list.... and yeah lack of downshift helps a lot...shifting is slow. The P is even quicker still of course.

 

[cOoTeR]

I don't have a lot of roll races under my belt lots of races from a dig though. Here is a 40 roll vs a 650ish hp mustang. He was reluctant to race and thought a roll race would be better. I let him pick the start speed. He still couldn't hook even on drag radials. It's been my experience that people are so worried about losing to an electric car they make some mistakes that cost them the race.

 

[dfwatt]

So it's pretty evident that there's not many ICE cars that can take us from a dig - i.e. stopped at a light, etc.

I'd like to hear what others' experiences are toying with others from a roll. This is something I'm less confident about, since I know power decreases with SoC & because the car has only one gear... it could get a little wheezy at higher speeds, albeit it's still effing quick.

Second week I had my P3D- I absolutely vaporized a brand-new BMW M3 at a light (my former dream car & the brand that left me behind). It felt great. Not sure I'd have the same luck from a 70+ mph roll... Anyone have any experiences? Including SoC would be useful.

***Disclaimer***

Street racing is illegal & I fully condone it.

The lower your initial rolling speed start, the better the car does relative to ICE high performance cars. So if you can get people to agree to a 20 to 30 mile an hour rolling start, almost nothing will catch you up to 70 or 80.

 

[Knightshade]

The lower your initial rolling speed start, the better the car does relative to ICE high performance cars. So if you can get people to agree to a 20 to 30 mile an hour rolling start, almost nothing will catch you up to 70 or 80.

FWIW I'm not aware of any factory-stock production ICE vehicle, ever, that would beat an AWD model 3 from 30-70 using the magazine test methods for this.

And I mean just a regular AWD one...let alone a P.

The P did 30-70 in 2.9 before either 5% power bump.

The AWD non-P did 30-70 in 3.56 before either 5% bump, and 3.21 after the first but before the second (haven't seen 30-70 data post 2nd bump)

For reference, as of 2015 anyway, the quickest ICE vehicle that Car and Driver ever tested 30-70 were running 3.9 seconds. MUCH slower than either Model 3.

To the Extreme: The Quickest, Slowest, Thirstiest, Lightest—and Much More—Cars We Tested This Year

More context-
https://hmg-prod.s3.amazonaws.com/f...rmance-data-and-complete-specs-1532365631.pdf

~$150,000 2018 ZR1 vs ~$300,000 2018 Porsche 911 GT2 RS

The ZR1 takes 4.2 30-70, the GT2 takes 4 flat.

Downshifting is slow

 

[dsgerbc]

Pick the speed/SOC and see how much HP P3D is making and go from there.

You'd still pull a bit on cars with similar HP/weight due to lack of shifts, IF they start in proper gear. If they don't, it'd take them waaaay too long to catch up.

Basically at 70-90mph roll start, you'd be on par with regular V8 Camaros/Mustangs in proper gear.

 

[rad1027]

Correct me if Im wrong, but doesn't the LR AWD accelerate the same as the P3D after 40ish mph? In other words, if the LR AWD and P3D raced from a rolling 40-45 mph and they both accelerate wouldnt it be the same acceleration? Isnt it from the hole 0-60 is where the P3D is faster?

 

[Nocturnal]

So it's pretty evident that there's not many ICE cars that can take us from a dig - i.e. stopped at a light, etc.

I'd like to hear what others' experiences are toying with others from a roll. This is something I'm less confident about, since I know power decreases with SoC & because the car has only one gear... it could get a little wheezy at higher speeds, albeit it's still effing quick.

Second week I had my P3D- I absolutely vaporized a brand-new BMW M3 at a light (my former dream car & the brand that left me behind). It felt great. Not sure I'd have the same luck from a 70+ mph roll... Anyone have any experiences? Including SoC would be useful.

***Disclaimer***

Street racing is illegal & I fully condone it.

I almost bought an M3 right before I was able to order my P3D myself. I loved my 2007 335i but as you know, Teslas are next level.

Nobody ever tries to race me. I'm kinda torn on that TBH. That said, why not focus on where we are strongest? Stop light racing is the most fun anyway. You get that adrenaline rush, the other guy is right there, waiting on that light to turn...bam. That's where it's at.

I'd avoid racing from a 70 roll for several reasons. We aren't as strong from there, and starting your race at 70 means you will be going way to fast very quickly.

 

[Knightshade]

Correct me if Im wrong, but doesn't the LR AWD accelerate the same as the P3D after 40ish mph?

Ok, you're wrong

Pre-5% update (either of em) the AWD did 50-70 in 2.06 seconds... the P did it in 1.7 (based on draggy/vbox info posted here by various folks)

Now- the difference, especially above that, is very very very small (though not non-existent)... which is why 0-60 is (if you compare apples to apples) a little under 1 second apart...and at ~115-117 (end of 1/4 mile) the difference is... almost unchanged (and the trap speeds are damn close too).

 

[rad1027]

Ok, you're wrong

Pre-5% update (either of em) the AWD did 50-70 in 2.06 seconds... the P did it in 1.7 (based on draggy/vbox info posted here by various folks)

Now- the difference, especially above that, is very very very small (though not non-existent)... which is why 0-60 is (if you compare apples to apples) a little under 1 second apart...and at ~115-117 (end of 1/4 mile) the difference is... almost unchanged (and the trap speeds are damn close too).

Thank you for the info!

 

[Dolemite]

Nobody ever tries to race me. I'm kinda torn on that TBH. That said, why not focus on where we are strongest? Stop light racing is the most fun anyway. You get that adrenaline rush, the other guy is right there, waiting on that light to turn...bam. That's where it's at.

I'd avoid racing from a 70 roll for several reasons. We aren't as strong from there, and starting your race at 70 means you will be going way to fast very quickly.

eh... it happens. One time long ago I went up against a Bentley Continental GT convertible on an empty highway in my "tuned" 330i. Started @ 80, thinking a 3-ton luxo barge wouldn't be that much quicker. Good God was I wrong. Learned the hard way what a twin-turbo 6.0L 12-cylinder engine can do at highway speeds... it wasn't even remotely close.

If I had to pin down the specific range I was interested in, I'd say 70 - 110... took a shot on da google & what do you know - see post 517:

M3/M4 vs. Tesla Model 3 Performance

If this guy's running a tuned AA M3, it's probably seriously quick. So it's comforting to know that within that range, the P3D can still hold its own. And that was before the 5% bump!

 

[Miztawizord]

Any start from 0 to 50 - 80 in the performance model is tough to beat for any other production stock car. period. Over 60ish its fair game to any car over 450~hp.

 

[Kilotango74]

eh... it happens. One time long ago I went up against a Bentley Continental GT convertible on an empty highway in my "tuned" 330i. Started @ 80, thinking a 3-ton luxo barge wouldn't be that much quicker. Good God was I wrong. Learned the hard way what a twin-turbo 6.0L 12-cylinder engine can do at highway speeds... it wasn't even remotely close.

If I had to pin down the specific range I was interested in, I'd say 70 - 110... took a shot on da google & what do you know - see post 517:

M3/M4 vs. Tesla Model 3 Performance

If this guy's running a tuned AA M3, it's probably seriously quick. So it's comforting to know that within that range, the P3D can still hold its own. And that was before the 5% bump!

That thread is a great read. Being a BMW owner for years I was a regular on that forum. It’s interesting to see how the perspective of people change from the beginning to the end of that forum. I remember people trash talking Tesla there like there was no tomorrow, now there a lot of converts. There are still those who make ignorant speeches about how they would rather Uber the rest of their lives than drive in a Tesla ( from someone who had self admitted to never having even ridden in one), but for the most part I found it refreshing especially how I wanted a BMW M3 for over 20 years myself.

 

[PhaseWhite]

The lower your initial rolling speed start, the better the car does relative to ICE high performance cars. So if you can get people to agree to a 20 to 30 mile an hour rolling start, almost nothing will catch you up to 70 or 80.

40 is also right about the peak HP in a P3D

 

[ElectroFish]

If I had to pin down the specific range I was interested in, I'd say 70 - 110... took a shot on da google & what do you know - see post 517:

M3/M4 vs. Tesla Model 3 Performance

If this guy's running a tuned AA M3, it's probably seriously quick. So it's comforting to know that within that range, the P3D can still hold its own. And that was before the 5% bump!

Hey thats me With the f80 m3 that raced the Model 3 performance. It was more of a random race and not setup with a beep off or anything . I was on my 93 tune at the time 500whp give or take. Without a beep off its very tough to know when the Model 3 started to go compared to ice cars but either way it jumped ahead and I played catch up. With a 126 trap speed in the 1/4 and a 131 on e85 the outcome is pretty apparent the longer we raced.

Oh yeah and my model 3 gets picked up next friday . Later BMW

 

[Dolemite]

That thread is a great read. Being a BMW owner for years I was a regular on that forum. It’s interesting to see how the perspective of people change from the beginning to the end of that forum. I remember people trash talking Tesla there like there was no tomorrow, now there a lot of converts. There are still those who make ignorant speeches about how they would rather Uber the rest of their lives than drive in a Tesla ( from someone who had self admitted to never having even ridden in one), but for the most part I found it refreshing especially how I wanted a BMW M3 for over 20 years myself.

I'm in the same boat! The M3 was my dream car since I was a little freshman/sophomore douche in high school, when BMW was a small, family-owned company focused on making svelte, understated cars that were great to drive. Today, I feel like they've lost a lot of the DNA that made them great. And now that I can afford one... I picked a Model 3. I admit I did a lot of trash-talking years ago. Then one day I needed a new car... and nothing brand new appealed to me *that much*... and there was a Tesla store on the way home... and I figured what the hell, let's drive one. The rest is history.

Hey thats me With the f80 m3 that raced the Model 3 performance. It was more of a random race and not setup with a beep off or anything . I was on my 93 tune at the time 500whp give or take. Without a beep off its very tough to know when the Model 3 started to go compared to ice cars but either way it jumped ahead and I played catch up. With a 126 trap speed in the 1/4 and a 131 on e85 the outcome is pretty apparent the longer we raced.

Oh yeah and my model 3 gets picked up next friday . Later BMW

Wow! Glad you're here! I won't lie - it's gonna take a bit of getting used to. Personally, I had days where I questioned my decision... mostly because I'm OCD & went through these pointless bouts of FUD. But the other day when I drove my BMW for the first time in weeks, the Tesla finally felt more like "my" car. I'm about 4 months into the ownership and I'm not sure I'd go back... especially as my only car & daily driver. The elegance & simplicity of having electric motors just has so many more benefits over owning long-term high-performance ICE cars. Plus, we get to rotate our tires, which gives me an irrational amount of joy. When you factor this stuff in, the marginal performance edge you might have in a super high-performance ICE car at triple-digit speeds becomes moot.

And yeah it's evident what would've happened. That's why if/when I'm ever in this scenario, I'm declaring a win @ ~110 & giving up.

So many BMW transplants! All the guys at my local SC worked at BMW before.

 

[Jenremoved]

I ran into a Hellcat from 50-90 and I gained slightly at lower speeds and stayed even until he let up. The guy driving it couldn’t believe it.

 

[ElectroFish]

A hellcat with traction was very similar in speed from a roll to my bmw m3. Then again I typically do rolls thats end around 130mph or more. Fore reference my car made 575 whp.

When we getting ludicrous ?