P85D is a good value (versus Audi RS7, BMW M6 GC, and Mercedes CLS63 AMG)

[commasign]

I'm not really a car guy and would never have considered buying a $100,000+ car prior to stumbling upon the world of EVs and Tesla specifically. After spending $110k on my P85 last year, and now $125k on my P85D, people thought I was crazy. "You can buy a nice BMW or Mercedes for a lot less than that!" Well, turns out that's not really true. To get a BMW or Mercedes with the same level of performance and functionality as a P85D, you're going to spend about the same amount of money. Not to mention these cars only get 9-10MPG when driven hard. Bottomline is the P85D is expensive, but so is an Audi, BMW, and Mercedes. See prices and specs:

2014 Audi RS7 vs. 2014 BMW M6 Gran Coupe, 2014 Mercedes-Benz CLS63 AMG S-model Comparison Tests - Page 5 - Car and Driver

 

[SmartElectric]

Lots of interesting numbers in that page link, but the thing that surprised me was 10 mpg estimated efficiency with only a 21g tank is 210 miles of range. That reminds me of my 1996 Camaro Z28, which when driven hard went through two tanks of gas on my weekend cottage runs, ouch!

I agree, the P85D is "good value", as Ferris Bueller says
So Choice - YouTube

 

[TwoBit]

@SmartElectric that 10 mpg was for high performance driving. The Audi RS7 gets at least double that and approaches 30 mpg on highway driving. That same kind of driving would equate to a Tesla being driven with a halved range itself.

 

[TwoBit]

The Tesla compares to those others only in power and with its nice display. It is significantly weaker in terms of interior construction quality, audio system quality, seating comfort, ride/suspension quality, and general features. Source: I have an Audi A7 and Tesla P85. I should add that the Tesla also has great storage, though my A7 is pretty good for that too.

 

[commasign]

Yep. Maybe 250 miles range if driven conservatively which is... drumroll please... the same range as the P85D! So really the only advantage of one of these ICE grand coupes is 5 minute fill-ups, but the Tesla more than makes up for that with cheap overnight home charging and free 60 minute fill-ups on road trips.

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The Tesla compares to those others only in power and with its nice display. It is significantly weaker in terms of interior construction quality, audio system quality, seating comfort, ride/suspension quality, and general features. Source: I have an Audi A7 and Tesla P85. I should add that the Tesla also has great storage, though my A7 is pretty good for that too.

Not disagreeing since I've never even sat in an Audi, but the P85D has the Next Generation seats (rumored to be made by Recaro), and the Performance Plus sport suspension.

 

[amped_p85d]

Yep. Maybe 250 miles range if driven conservatively which is... drumroll please... the same range as the P85D! So really the only advantage of one of these ICE grand coupes is 5 minute fill-ups, but the Tesla more than makes up for that with cheap overnight home charging and free 60 minute fill-ups on road trips.

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Not disagreeing since I've never even sat in an Audi, but the P85D has the Next Generation seats (rumored to be made by Recaro), and the Performance Plus sport suspension.

FWIW, On the factory tour before I picked up my P85D, they mentioned that the seats were made by an Australian company, who had an office in Fremont near the plant. Not sure if those were the performance seats or regular seats.

As for the other points, I think $30K cars have better audio / multimedia and camera systems than my Tesla, but I'm hopeful that with a future OTA I'll at least have parity.

 

[commasign]

I double checked my monroney sticker. It's definitely Recaro.

 

[EarlyAdopter]

The Tesla compares to those others only in power and with its nice display. It is significantly weaker in terms of interior construction quality, audio system quality, seating comfort, ride/suspension quality, and general features. Source: I have an Audi A7 and Tesla P85. I should add that the Tesla also has great storage, though my A7 is pretty good for that too.

On the P85 I would agree with these points. On the P85D I would not.

With a black alcantera headliner, alcantera insert on the dash, yacht floor, next gen sports seats by Recaro, improved upgraded audio (it's significantly better in my P85D than my P85), and overall build quality improvements in newer cars, I think Tesla has closed the gap with Audi.

 

[RAW84]

Ehh, outside of the screen (and possibly the seats, which I'll judge when I get them) I have to say the interior of my P85D is underwhelming. Definitely not on the level of flagship luxury cars.

I didn't get the premium interior package, tho.

 

[Gizmotoy]

On the P85 I would agree with these points. On the P85D I would not.

With a black alcantera headliner, alcantera insert on the dash, yacht floor, next gen sports seats by Recaro, improved upgraded audio (it's significantly better in my P85D than my P85), and overall build quality improvements in newer cars, I think Tesla has closed the gap with Audi.

Good to hear, though I'm skeptical. I'm sure the seats are improved, but many of the materials are the same or similar. I think Tesla struck the right balance, but the upper-level Audis still have a much nicer interior. Even with alcantara, it doesn't yet bridge the gap. I don't think any of this would make me lean towards the Audi, but it is something they can still improve. I cross-shopped the S7 (the RS wasn't out yet), but still think the Model S is the clear winner. I'd be first in line to pay for the next generation seats if they ever wrap them in a textile retrofit.

That's funny about the upgraded audio. I got downright thrashed months ago when I said they've been making audio improvements, even after noting how I'd personally compared cars of several ages side-by-side and after having seen revision numbers of audio components change (look at the sub, for example, mine's revision 3). Glad they're still improving it, but it's been going on for a long time now.

 

[sjd]

On the P85 I would agree with these points. On the P85D I would not.

With a black alcantera headliner, alcantera insert on the dash, yacht floor, next gen sports seats by Recaro, improved upgraded audio (it's significantly better in my P85D than my P85), and overall build quality improvements in newer cars, I think Tesla has closed the gap with Audi.

Not to mention Audi has been making interiors a lot longer than Tesla. They'll close the gap even more in the future.

 

[commasign]

I think Tesla can add more leather to different pieces of the interior that are currently plastic. And maybe the pieces could be more pillow-like plush. But I hope they never go the route of a gazillion protruding trim pieces, buttons, switches, and spinning multidirectional dials with 15 layer deep menus. The 17" touchscreen is revolutionary.

 

[RAW84]

I think Tesla can add more leather to different pieces of the interior that are currently plastic. And maybe the pieces could be more pillow-like plush. But I hope they never go the route of a gazillion protruding trim pieces, buttons, switches, and spinning multidirectional dials with 15 layer deep menus. The 17" touchscreen is revolutionary.

agreed 100%.
I drove a Porsche Panamera recently and was put aback by the amount of buttons. Felt like I was going back in time when the thought was more buttons = better

What feels lacking to me is when I look at stuff like the rear view mirror and visors, center console (or lack there of) and lighting (although I will reiterate that I did not get premium interior....I wanted the lighting, which I was willing to pay $1k for, but I wasn't willing to pay extra $4.5k for that and extra leather in random places...I was upset they added the lighting to the premium interior package)

 

[Victory]

@SmartElectric that 10 mpg was for high performance driving. The Audi RS7 gets at least double that and approaches 30 mpg on highway driving. That same kind of driving would equate to a Tesla being driven with a halved range itself.

I agree with this. I consistently drive at 80-85 on the freeway and I get about 60-70% of the RR. Going 70 miles takes about 100-110 of RR so I only really get <200 miles from 90% charge on my s85

 

[Canuck]

I think Tesla can add more leather to different pieces of the interior that are currently plastic. And maybe the pieces could be more pillow-like plush.

Please Tesla never go "plush" and never make anything as god-awful ugly as the Audi RS7 interior...

 

[commasign]

Please Tesla never go "plush" and never make anything as god-awful ugly as the Audi RS7 interior...

View attachment 68198

Is that from the latest Aliens movie?

 

[AnxietyRanger]

The Tesla compares to those others only in power and with its nice display. It is significantly weaker in terms of interior construction quality, audio system quality, seating comfort, ride/suspension quality, and general features. Source: I have an Audi A7 and Tesla P85. I should add that the Tesla also has great storage, though my A7 is pretty good for that too.

Personally I would already opine P85 with premium interior has nothing to be ashamed of compared to even the likes of A8/BMW 7/S Class and I, too, say this from personal experience and those are above the A7. The P85D also seems a small step forward, so even better still. The fit and finish is already excellent and the spartan, very modern look a breath of fresh air. Plus the 17" screen and dash makes the German counterparts look ancient. Tesla's air suspension certainly is better and smarter than Audi's, too.

Where Tesla does, admittedly, lack are interior convenience features, especially in the back (think of massaging seats, rear-seat entertainment etc.), driver aids and cameras (although autopilot is a big step forward and Tesla has the best rear camera in the industry) and a premium customization experience that the Germans have nailed down to an art (at least a mainstream-available one, we have seen Tesla offering some service to U.S. celebs). Of course, long wheelbase would be important for some markets and market segments as well.

No matter, I'm not going back to ancient ICEs clad in some extra leather and a few rotary knobs more, even if they rub my behind and show me Jersey Shore on TV while rumbling along. Also, I'm thinking Model X will already be a major step up and then even those lackings will be "close enough" to almost anyone. It will be like the iPhone in 2007-2009, sure, it still missed a few features older smartphones had, but it was already the perfect storm in the making. The competitors just look old and clunky in comparison.

I wrote a few words about the latest Audi MMI vs. Tesla some time ago here on TMC. I just don't think there is any comparison - and that's to Tesla's favor, even if Audi might have a few features more here and there.

Not to object to your opinion, just to offer that they are already so close that other German owners can feel differently than yourself.

 

[sjd]

Its not a nice as the quilted interiors of the S8 but I like it and its certainly a long way from ugly.

 

[commasign]

Where Tesla does, admittedly, lack are interior convenience features, especially in the back (think of massaging seats, rear-seat entertainment etc.), driver aids and cameras (although autopilot is a big step forward and Tesla has the best rear camera in the industry) and a premium customization experience that the Germans have nailed down to an art (at least a mainstream-available one, we have seen Tesla offering some service to U.S. celebs). Of course, long wheelbase would be important for some markets and market segments as well.

Agreed. My personal wish list has gotten shorter with the P85D vs the P85. It's now down to just:

ventilated seats
heads up display
rear cup holders!!!
360 degree camera/parking assist
rear camera guidelines

 

[AnxietyRanger]

Agreed. My personal wish list has gotten shorter with the P85D vs the P85. It's now down to just:

ventilated seats
heads up display
rear cup holders!!!
360 degree camera/parking assist
rear camera guidelines

A good list, I would add night vision. Either of Tesla's screens would make a great display for that.

Tesla, we don't need flag poles or a rear-seat fridge, at least not as a first priority. Maybe later.