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P90D without ludicrous

Discussion in 'Model S' started by Niclas, Sep 2, 2015.

  1. Niclas

    Niclas Member

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    So what do you get with a P90D without the L option?
    -does the 90 battery include the smart fuse and inconel contactors?
    -will it be possible to retrofit Ludicrous as software update only later on?
    -will the P90D have exactly the same performance as P85D?
     
  2. sorka

    sorka Active Member

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    The performance should be identical to the P85D. The other questions are all excellent and I don't think anyone knows the answer.
     
  3. taurusking

    taurusking Member

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    Good question to Tesla sales about upgrading to L ..when you need it
     
  4. Niclas

    Niclas Member

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    Tesla sales rep usually have no clue.
     
  5. WestCoastP85D

    WestCoastP85D Member

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    #5 WestCoastP85D, Sep 2, 2015
    Last edited: Sep 2, 2015
    I asked this:

    1) Yes, you get the connector, but not the fuse.

    2) No aftermarket Luda is offered at this time except for Pre-Luda delivered P85D models. (Maybe later??)

    3) Yes, it's a P85D w/ Insane Mode (0-60 in 3.1 sec) with longer range and the P90D badges.

    Insane mode is pretty awesome, and after learning about the "battery warming" requirement for Luda, I am less excited about Luda (but still likely to get it... unless too much time passes)
     
  6. sorka

    sorka Active Member

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    And just a minor clarification on performance. A P85D and and a P90D that both start out at the same charge level, let's just say 100% and both drive x miles....let's just say 100. The P90D will have a higher SOC% than the P85D after both drive the same mileage. The voltage drop should be less on the P90D and therefore it should be able to pull a few KW more than the P85D.

    So in reality, the P90D should slightly better performance that than the P85D if both start at the same SOC and drive the same distance.
     
  7. Niclas

    Niclas Member

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    So, what do you all think?
    i currently own P85. Considering upgrading to P90D without ludacris.
    Is the bump in performance worth it? I think P85 performance is good enough but wheels spin all the time...
     
  8. dsm363

    dsm363 Roadster + Sig Model S

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    You'll notice the better low end acceleration for sure but the P85 isn't bad off the line either. I'd more consider the newer car only if it has other features you want and don't have (folding mirrors, parking sensors, autopilot hardware...etc and the extra acceleration is just a nice bonus). Otherwise waiting a little longer until any cool features from the Model X or even 100kWh battery pack make it into the Model S might be worth it.

    Are you on all season tires? If so, I almost never get wheel spin with the summer tires Tesla sells for the 21" rims. Others have had good luck with the Michelin AS/3 all season tires with decent traction.
     
  9. Niclas

    Niclas Member

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    Reasons to get new P90D would be:
    NG seats
    AWD with better traction
    AP
    slightly longer range
    insane launches

    cons:
    is it really faster in daily driving?
    torque-steering feel
    smaller frunk
     
  10. Pete90D

    Pete90D Fan of Red Lights

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    While we're still figuring out the G force issue, I got 2.810s (1ft rollout) without battery warming on. So it's faster, and you have more power above 30 and it is noticeable.
     
  11. Andyw2100

    Andyw2100 Well-Known Member

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    Well, to be accurate, no aftermarket Luda is offered at this time period. No service centers have any information about the upgrades yet, roughly seven weeks after Musk's announcement about them.
     
  12. thegruf

    thegruf Member

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    @nicklas - that is the point. Higher performance at speds >30mph.
    Improved overtaking on the highway.
    You will only ever be aware of the difference 0-30mph on a stopwatch.

    and according to Pete90D - an actual owner! - it is indeed noticeable.

    Only you can value it though.
     
  13. electrish

    electrish I Sing the Body Electric

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    #13 electrish, Sep 2, 2015
    Last edited: Sep 2, 2015
    Pete, I really appreciate you posting all this information on your P90D and I apologize if you have already shared this anywhere; I just have not been able to find it anywhere. I asked in another thread and was shot down.

    What I and I bet a lot of other P85D owners considering the ludicrous upgrade are interested in is how the battery preconditioning factors into your car's performance.
    I, for one, do not want to constantly have to pre-heat my battery to have the extra performance available. As you allude to here, that may not be necessary.

    Can you share any performance numbers or point me to where you posted them, comparing 0-60 and 30-whatever, with or without battery preconditioning?

    Thank you very much!
     
  14. ArtInCT

    ArtInCT Always Learning

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    Electrish:

    You make a very good point. In Addition, since you are in a Northern state with potentially colder weather than we get here in CT, the MAX POWER preconditioning issue is one that will in all likelihood a consideration for us in the Cold Weather when the battery pack is cold soaked.

    Pete90D is in Cali so his environment is near ideal temperature-wise, unless he is up in the mountains.

    When I test drove the P85D's in the past, they were quite fast. I shall have to test drive a P90D ludicrous to see if without MAX POWER the $10 difference is worth it.
     
  15. Pete90D

    Pete90D Fan of Red Lights

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    Sorry if I derailed this conversation. It wasn't intentional.

    I haven't driven a P85D for a while, but in addition to my opinion sorka and TEG noticed a difference above 30 so I think I'm right.

    No need to apologize, there's a lot of information and most of it is unknown right now other than trial and error. I hope I wasn't the one that shot you down, I've tried to answer every question asked.

    Without preconditioning I feel there is a difference from the P85D. As I said above it has been a couple months since I've driven one, but I do not remember it being nearly as intense. I also don't remember feeling like the blood in my head was rushing to the base of my skull, which I have felt a couple times. Maybe I'm not feeling well at the time, I don't know, but it has given me headaches. So you shouldn't need to precondition for more power. I do feel there's probably going to be some update that makes better use of these changes. Not based on any information I have, but just that I don't see a big enough difference for it to make sense. I also asked a tech today when I stopped by the Palo Alto SC and he said he knew nothing about the option.

    I've tried to find a difference in power with the "Max Battery Power" option, and I haven't really noticed one. I haven't analyzed a ton of data, but it might squeeze a little more out. As far as 0-60 times I didn't see a big difference, but at the same time it has been hard to find the exact runs where it was on and wasn't on. When I get the PerformanceBox and I can see real time what the 0-60 was I might be able to see a difference.

    Here's the performance data I have so far
    P90D Performance/Power Data

    I enjoy all Model S models I've driven, but I notice a massive difference from the P85+ I played around with a little. The wheels definitely spun a lot, felt laggy at lights, didn't have the pull of the PXXD. It's obvious what I chose, but personally felt the extra cost was worth it.

    Not in the mountains. It's 75F and sunny right now, like most of the Apr-Oct weather.
     
  16. Rafik

    Rafik Member

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    Thanks for all the info you've put forth Pete. You took hours out of your own time to put all this together and it's definitely appreciated.
     
  17. electrish

    electrish I Sing the Body Electric

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    Thanks for sharing all your test data. I will be waiting for this information and hope you won't get constant nose bleeds while doing your test runs.

    To be honest with you, I am a bit disappointed, since when I ordered my P85D, Tesla announced that no major upgrades would be made to the platform for another year, if I remember correctly. People will probably say that I should have known better, but I consider the P90D with ludicrous mode a major upgrade! So I will wait for your and other people's testing data, before I make the decision on whether to take the plunge to upgrade or not. A big factor is also the "labor costs", which were probably downplayed by Elon, as another post states that it will most likely take the better part of one day to perform the upgrade on our P85Ds.
     
  18. Pete90D

    Pete90D Fan of Red Lights

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    Just so you know, I think most people didn't know about the change. I called my DS within 30min of the announcement and she said they had just found out about it so she couldn't have relayed it to me. I had even asked about the upgrade of the P85D and she called around and others didn't hear that was even possible. It probably should have been planned a little better, but at least they had the system ready for new purchases at the time of announcement.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Thanks! I'm thrilled it has been helpful
     
  19. Andyw2100

    Andyw2100 Well-Known Member

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    Actually there should be no difference whatsoever between a P85D, a P90D, and a P90D with Ludicrous 0-30, as all are limited by traction to 30 mph, as per Musk.



    We also don't know for sure that P85Ds upgraded to Ludicrous Mode will include that battery preconditioning mode. They may, but they may not. That could be a feature unique to P90Ds built with Ludicrous Mode originally.
     
  20. Pete90D

    Pete90D Fan of Red Lights

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    I'd like it if this was something that could be changed by a technician. If I put 295s in the rear I'd like to be able to improve the 0-30.
     

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