Pan Am Games HOV lane issues with the Tesla Model S

[Doug_G]

It's pretty clear that the HOV lanes aren't really about congestion. Or that the decision on who can use it isn't based on anything rational.

California used to allow hybrids to use the car pool lane. When that expired and they only allowed plug-ins in the car pool lane, and interesting thing happened - the average commute time for everyone went up. It was better for traffic flow to have the hybrids in the car pool lane, because there were fewer cars in the other lanes.

Takeaway from this "experiment" is that if you want to reduce congestion, it's probably best to just open the HOV lane to all traffic, thus increasing the number of lanes available.

 

[mrElbe]

Exactly, eliminate the underused HOV lanes and let everybody get from point A to point B as fast as possible and get off the road. Voila! less congestion.

 

[Judge Advocate]

It's pretty clear that the HOV lanes aren't really about congestion. Or that the decision on who can use it isn't based on anything rational.

California used to allow hybrids to use the car pool lane. When that expired and they only allowed plug-ins in the car pool lane, and interesting thing happened - the average commute time for everyone went up. It was better for traffic flow to have the hybrids in the car pool lane, because there were fewer cars in the other lanes.

Takeaway from this "experiment" is that if you want to reduce congestion, it's probably best to just open the HOV lane to all traffic, thus increasing the number of lanes available.

I agree wholeheartedly.
Try telling this to the city councillor morons in Vancouver who insist on the HOV lane on the Trans Canada Hwy through Burnaby and Coguitlam. Mind you, the hwy has widened to between 4 and five lanes now but still, the roads there aren't wide enough generally to warrant an HOV lane. They need to remove it completely and allow full traffic on all the lanes to facilitate traffic.
One side note though, something Toronto should adopt, is that they do allow motorcycles on the HOV lane. Good incentive for people to use a bike to work instead of a gas guzzler.

 

[mknox]

Takeaway from this "experiment" is that if you want to reduce congestion, it's probably best to just open the HOV lane to all traffic, thus increasing the number of lanes available.

This is exactly right. The intent was to reduce the number of cars on the road by having drivers double or triple up. But letting single occupant EVs or Hybrids use the HOV lanes goes counter to this as does considering passengers such as kids or other vehicle occupants who would otherwise not be driving a car of their own. It's probably better to think of them as "priority lanes" awarded to whomever the government feels charitable towards, at the expense of all other drivers.

 

[Judge Advocate]

Electric cars and Pan Am HOV Lane confusion!

From what I've just read and researched, all electric cars will be permitted on ALL the HOV lanes for the next 6 weeks for the Games.
I heard stories that we will only be allowed on so called "provincial" highways such as the 400 series and QEW but according to the government sites i checked into, ALL HOV lanes will be accessible to the Tesla Model s vehicles.
Even though I will be working the Pan am Games anyway and will have a pass regardless of vehicle, it will be interesting to see the "looks" i get from motorists when it will be just me probably driving in the HOV lanes. i will certainly be taking advantage of the lanes in question regardless.
Thank you Ontario for allowing us electric vehicle owners to use the HOV lanes. I have to say though that hybrid vehicles should not be permitted. My opinion. At highway speeds, won't hybrid cars be operating on gasoline anyway?

 

[mknox]

Green Plate vehicles will only be allowed on provincially controlled highways (401, 404, QEW) and not the Gardiner or DVP.

Hybrid cars are not issued Green Plates, only Plug-In Hybrids or BEVs. They could be driving on battery power or gas power depending on the battery's state of charge at the time.

Curious to know what other government sites are saying Tesla Model S will be allowed in all HOV lanes???

 

[Judge Advocate]

Curious to know what other government sites are saying Tesla Model S will be allowed in all HOV lanes???[/QUOTE]

I'm referring to electric cars in General. Sorry about the confusion. I googled HOV lane usage during Pan am Games and electric cars.
None of the sites I saw mentioned only provincial highways. Everyone of them said all HOV lanes, that i could see.

 

[Chrisizzle]

From what I've just read and researched, all electric cars will be permitted on ALL the HOV lanes for the next 6 weeks for the Games.
I heard stories that we will only be allowed on so called "provincial" highways such as the 400 series and QEW but according to the government sites i checked into, ALL HOV lanes will be accessible to the Tesla Model s vehicles.

1) I'd be curious to know what government sites you looked at because Toronto and Ontario say no dice.
- Toronto: Temporary High Occupancy Vehicle (HOV) Lanes - Getting Around - 2015 Pan Am and Parapan Am Games | City of Toronto

- Ontario: Pan Am/Parapan Am Games: transit, driving and traffic routes | Ontario.ca

2) I would suggest you edit your original post with the correct information. Otherwise, you will be responsible for causing the only confusion.

 

[Tammingm]

It would be handy if there were a list of highways with HOV lanes that are NOT solo driver Green Plate accessible through the Games.

 

[mknox]

It would be handy if there were a list of highways with HOV lanes that are NOT solo driver Green Plate accessible through the Games.

That list is much longer. The only roads that you can drive a Green Plate vehicle on solo are the provincial highways (400-series and QEW). The Gardiner and DVP, for example, are city expressways and not included.

 

[sagaboy]

Article says that EV with green plates can. Http://t.co/RM54RqDFSm

 

[wayner]

I don't see why this will be confusing - we have had HOV lanes for years on many 400 series highways, like the 404, 403 and QEW, and green plates have always been allowed in those lanes. That was supposed to expire tomorrow but it has been extended for at least one more year.

By the way, I am loving the HOV lanes on my drive in from Scarborough. It saved me several minutes this morning.

 

[mknox]

Article says that EV with green plates can. Http://t.co/RM54RqDFSm

That article is wrong. It says (somewhat correctly) that taxis and limos can use highways only (should say provincial highways) but incorrectly suggests EVs can use the lanes without the provincial highway caveat. Best to refer to official sources and not general media articles. Or you could carry a copy of the article with you and see if it will get you out of a ticket :wink:

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I don't see why this will be confusing - we have had HOV lanes for years on many 400 series highways, like the 404, 403 and QEW, and green plates have always been allowed in those lanes.

The confusion, I believe, comes from the fact that temporary lanes specifically for the games are opening up on 400-series highways (allowed) and also on city expressways (not allowed). There are also HOV lanes (permanent and temporary) on city surface streets and these are not allowed at any time.

There should be signage like this showing when Green Plates are allowed, but there won't be signage where Green Plates are not allowed:

 

[e4chan]

Glad I saw this thread. I went down DVP this morning and a police officer shook his head. I rolled down my window and said, I believe Green Plates are allowed . He left me alone....phew! He looked confused as well though....so not all officers know the official rule.

 

[Judge Advocate]

Glad I saw this thread. I went down DVP this morning and a police officer shook his head. I rolled down my window and said, I believe Green Plates are allowed . He left me alone....phew! He looked confused as well though....so not all officers know the official rule.

So as you can see, there is mass confusion over this.
Looks like it will take one of us to get pulled over on the DVP or Gardiner to see what the real law about this is. Hopefully it won't be me. LOL!
I've called the service Ontario people and they say ALL hOV lanes on all the highways SHOULD be ok but I got the impression she wasn't sure either so it looks like a hit and miss scenario.
As one other poster said, even the cops are confused. I would say, go for it on the DVP etc and tell the policeman, should he pull you over, "Sorry Occifer, I was told that we can use the HOV lanes here because i drive an electric car," and see what he says. My guess is, you will be fine and he will wish you on your merry way.

 

[wayner]

As one other poster said, even the cops are confused. I would say, go for it on the DVP etc and tell the policeman, should he pull you over, "Sorry Occifer, I was told that we can use the HOV lanes here because i drive an electric car," and see what he says. My guess is, you will be fine and he will wish you on your merry way.

There have been several posts here in the past about green plate drivers being pulled over and ticketed on the HOV lanes prior to the PanAm games. I have printed off the amendment to the HTA and put it in my glove compartment as over the next two months I expect to be pulled over by a police officer who does not know the rules.

 

[mknox]

I've called the service Ontario people and they say ALL hOV lanes on all the highways SHOULD be ok but I got the impression she wasn't sure either so it looks like a hit and miss scenario.

Technically, that is correct as long as you remember that the Gardiner and DVP are not (provincial) "highways". They are City controlled expressways.

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I have printed off the amendment to the HTA and put it in my glove compartment as over the next two months I expect to be pulled over by a police officer who does not know the rules.

A good idea and I have done the same. Remember that in addition to the fine, there are 3 demerit points if you get caught in an HOV lane that you shouldn't be in.

 

[wayner]

Technically, that is correct as long as you remember that the Gardiner and DVP are not (provincial) "highways". They are City controlled expressways.

Aren't some city streets technically Provincial "King's Highways? Like Yonge is Hwy 11, Lakeshore is Hwy 2, Bloor is Hwy 5, etc. Or did the province give up to the control of them to the cities at some time in the past?

 

[e4chan]

There have been several posts here in the past about green plate drivers being pulled over and ticketed on the HOV lanes prior to the PanAm games. I have printed off the amendment to the HTA and put it in my glove compartment as over the next two months I expect to be pulled over by a police officer who does not know the rules.

Can you share the link? Sorry...what is HTA?

Thanks!

 

[mknox]

Aren't some city streets technically Provincial "King's Highways? Like Yonge is Hwy 11, Lakeshore is Hwy 2, Bloor is Hwy 5, etc. Or did the province give up to the control of them to the cities at some time in the past?

Yes, I was wondering if someone was going to call me on that! Technically it's provincial "400-series" highways which includes the QEW.

Some provincial highways were "downloaded" to the municipalities. The one that always makes me laugh is the former provincial Hwy 7 through the Woodbridge area. The town named it "Highway 7". There are sections of that road that still are under provincial control as Hwy 7.

After the City of Toronto amalgamation, the section of the QEW between Hwy 427 and the Humber River in the former Etobicoke was downloaded to the city and it is now technically part of the Gardiner Expressway.

Lots of weird stuff like this now.

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Can you share the link? Sorry...what is HTA?!

This link may be helpful. Also, this page about the Pan Am Games temporary lanes.

EDIT: This page also has some useful information.