Panasonic v LG Batteries

[Matt125]

Are there that many long trips you would make when you wouldn't pass several superchargers anyway? An extra 20 miles (theoretical, in any event) doesn't add up to much extra time on a supercharger.

I know what you mean, but a higher capacity also gives me more at the bottom of the battery and potentially could improve my charging speed.

I'm going to be paying a lot of money for the car and would hate to think I've been short changed compared to what others can get.

 

[HenryT]

I know what you mean, but a higher capacity also gives me more at the bottom of the battery and potentially could improve my charging speed.

I'm going to be paying a lot of money for the car and would hate to think I've been short changed compared to what others can get.

I think you might be overthinking it Matt. You are talking about what amounts to around a 5% difference in the battery capacity. As you will have seen with your current car, there are so many other factors that can make a bigger than 5% difference in your economy / efficiency on a given journey anyway, that in the bigger picture the extra 5% will make next to no difference. Turn off the AC, drive 5 mph slower, get closer to the truck in front, etc, etc.

There is every probability anyway that some time while you have your new car Musk will change the range calculations again and you will get a higher imaginary range anyway.

Either way, enjoy your new car when you get it.

 

[Matt125]

I think you might be overthinking it Matt. You are talking about what amounts to around a 5% difference in the battery capacity. As you will have seen with your current car, there are so many other factors that can make a bigger than 5% difference in your economy / efficiency on a given journey anyway, that in the bigger picture the extra 5% will make next to no difference. Turn off the AC, drive 5 mph slower, get closer to the truck in front, etc, etc.

There is every probability anyway that some time while you have your new car Musk will change the range calculations again and you will get a higher imaginary range anyway.

Either way, enjoy your new car when you get it.

Agreed. I've been reading too many exciting articles about the Panasonic pack and the new LG packs being put into the MIC Model Y and I'm losing my head a little! I'm still hoping for the newer pack but it isn't a must.

 

[HenryT]

Agreed. I've been reading too many exciting articles about the Panasonic pack and the new LG packs being put into the MIC Model Y and I'm losing my head a little! I'm still hoping for the newer pack but it isn't a must.

Don't forget, you're missing out on the 46/80 batteries too, and the Model Y isn't out yet, and the made in Berlin cars will probably be better....

(Just some of the thoughts I had too, while waiting for mine)

 

[Matt125]

Don't forget, you're missing out on the 46/80 batteries too, and the Model Y isn't out yet, and the made in Berlin cars will probably be better....

(Just some of the thoughts I had too, while waiting for mine)

Yeah, I've made my peace with that I'm losing my current car in September and I don't fancy waiting 6 months to a year without a Tesla just for the sake of the bigger batteries - which will be prioritised for the Y anyway!

I also know that the Model 3 seems to hold its value despite the 2021 refresh so the one I'm getting in September should be holding its value too. In a couple of years, if Tesla do another big refresh I can hopefully swap my car for a newer one. As is always the case with tech, you pick the carousel horse to jump onto, knowing that the next horse after will always be better in some way - but you've still got to jump on!

 

[DrJFoster]

The UK Tesla website says 360 miles. The Norwegian Tesla website, obviously shows in kms, but when converting to miles it comes out at 380.

Ev Database says the Model 3 variant with the Panasonic battery is not available in the UK.

I've spent the past 2 years driving a 2019 Model 3 SR+ and I've recently put in an order for a Model 3 LR of my own very own, estimated delivery September. I dearly want it to be the Panasonic battery as 20 miles extra range makes a big difference for long trips when you're not near a charger.

To add more detail/colour/confusion (delete as appropriate), there are more details here than ev database, and E3LD doesn't seem to appear anywhere in Teslas configuration unlike the model codes and battery codes.

Tesla Model 3 Ultimate Buyers Guide

Tesla Model 3 Ultimate Buyers Guide covering everything you need to know.

tesla-info.com

At the end of the day. you don't have a choice other than to buy or not buy, I don't think waiting is going to change things. The LFP battery in the SR+ was originally a problem when it came to cold weather charging and most of that got sorted out in software, and the the M3P with the BT42 battery (as used in the european LR cars) had a lot of reported cold weather performance issues too. I think you just have to trust if there's an issue, they'll find a way around it in time.

 

[Kenners]

I thought the larger 82kwh Panasonic batteries were in the Performance (being new battery at the time with higher energy density and not being built at the volumes needed to put in all the cars being made) and the old Panasonic 75kwh or 72kwh was put in the LR refresh from Fremont (the refresh sans heated steering wheel) before they started shipping the MIC ones shortly afterwards. And the MIC cars are the 72/5kwh LG packs, which people complain about.

Would love to know if I am wrong about the LR refresh from Fremont being the 75kwh-ish Panasonic, as if it’s software locked I can charge it to higher level without killing my the battery.

I always thought the P60 S was a good deal as you could just charge to 100% rather than paying to unlock to 75 and charging to 80%! (I might be wrong about that too!)

 

[TonioRoffo]

I'm pretty confused after reading all the Pana/LG battery threads.

I'm in Belgium, Europe - if I order a M3LR today - will I get the 82kW Pana Battery? The LR shows as 614KM (381 Miles) - so I would think, yes?
The MYLR seems to get the "bad" LG chemistry.

 

[ItsNotAboutTheMoney]

I thought the larger 82kwh Panasonic batteries were in the Performance (being new battery at the time with higher energy density and not being built at the volumes needed to put in all the cars being made) and the old Panasonic 75kwh or 72kwh was put in the LR refresh from Fremont (the refresh sans heated steering wheel) before they started shipping the MIC ones shortly afterwards. And the MIC cars are the 72/5kwh LG packs, which people complain about.

Would love to know if I am wrong about the LR refresh from Fremont being the 75kwh-ish Panasonic, as if it’s software locked I can charge it to higher level without killing my the battery.

I always thought the P60 S was a good deal as you could just charge to 100% rather than paying to unlock to 75 and charging to 80%! (I might be wrong about that too!)

If it's LG or nothing, I think it's better to choose nothing for as long as possible. The battery with LG cells charges slowly. Either they eventually increase charging rates or its a turkey that's only being used because Panasonic can't produce enough cells. LFP at least has other benefits.

 

[GeorgeSymonds]

I'm pretty confused after reading all the Pana/LG battery threads.

I'm in Belgium, Europe - if I order a M3LR today - will I get the 82kW Pana Battery? The LR shows as 614KM (381 Miles) - so I would think, yes?
The MYLR seems to get the "bad" LG chemistry.

China built LR cars have been getting the 75kwh LG batteries, Fremont built cars are getting the 82kwh panosonic battery, depends where your car gets made.

 

[TonioRoffo]

China built LR cars have been getting the 75kwh LG batteries, Fremont built cars are getting the 82kwh panosonic battery, depends where your car gets made.

Thanks - I'm not sure where the Belgian M3LR's are made, that's my problem. I'll check with Tesla locally.

 

[Matt125]

Thanks - I'm not sure where the Belgian M3LR's are made, that's my problem. I'll check with Tesla locally.

They are made in China just like the cars going to the rest of Europe. It'll be the LG battery. I picked up a new Model 3 LR a few weeks ago and I am yet to properly test the charging speed.

 

[MrT3]

I'm pretty confused after reading all the Pana/LG battery threads.

I'm in Belgium, Europe - if I order a M3LR today - will I get the 82kW Pana Battery? The LR shows as 614KM (381 Miles) - so I would think, yes?
The MYLR seems to get the "bad" LG chemistry.

If the vehicle comes from China then it won't be a Panasonic battery. Rumours are there is a new LG battery (~82 kWh) for this quarter which will be fitted to mainland Europe vehicles - certainly if you have ordered a vehicle with 614KM range then you will either get a US made vehicle (highly unlikely) or a MiC vehicle with the new battery.

 

[Anxio]

Having driven the MIC LR for almost 5 months now (and since I started the original thread) I thought you might like to know my personal experience. I would say the MIC car is noticeably better than my previous USA made vehicle. It just feels screwed together better. And as far as the battery is concerned, well my max range is probably 340. Make of that what you will. What I would say and accepting we are not in winter yet, but I have seen zero battery degradation. In fact my max displayed range has increased. That didn’t happen with my previous car which showed a steady decline over the first year.

 

[Peter 224]

Having driven the MIC LR for almost 5 months now (and since I started the original thread) I thought you might like to know my personal experience. I would say the MIC car is noticeably better than my previous USA made vehicle. It just feels screwed together better. And as far as the battery is concerned, well my max range is probably 340. Make of that what you will. What I would say and accepting we are not in winter yet, but I have seen zero battery degradation. In fact my max displayed range has increased. That didn’t happen with my previous car which showed a steady decline over the first year.

MIC M3 LR built in early April 2021 and now with 4000 miles.
I charge to 85%, mostly at home.

Today I used up some of the free Supercharging (thanks Neil) and arrived at Tesla Supercharger Amesbury with 6% battery, Oops!
Connecting it the initial charge was at just over 200kwh ( that is 500 amps at 400v) and adding 1000 miles/hour, but slowed and reached 85% after 40 mins. The car showed 297 miles range, so based on 100% that would be 349 miles.

I don't believe that suggests the LG batteries are an issue.

 

[JaseW]

Do we have any idea if Q4 LR will have the 82kWh battery?

 

[Paige111]

I’m due to swap my 69 MP3- for a LR next month (company car) and so dipped back on to the forums. There I stumbled across the Tesla motor club thread which had a long (69 page) thread on the subject of Panasonic V LG batteries. If I understand the gist of that thread, and I admit I only skim read it, Tesla are no longer using LG batteries in Europe as of Q2 (except to the UK). I got the distinct impression that this was due to some shortcomings in the LG battery. In particular slower charge speeds and a lower capacity (75Kwh v 82Kwh). There appeared to be some relief expressed on that forum that Tesla had dropped the LG across Europe and an expectation that in due course the LR would as a consequence of the larger capacity of the Panasonic battery be given a larger EPA/WLTP rating. I was just surprised how little attention this subject seems to have attracted from UK customers. It felt a bit like we were getting the cast offs if I’m honest.

On a slight tangent. Has anyone with a newish LR model 3 seen the 100% SOC that matched the EPA rating 353 miles ?

that was my only request upon the entire ordering process - the 82KWH battery in my 3LR21 - the 2020 model had the 75kwh battery, even the Y did, thats reason I chose the 3LR. I asked x 100 for 82KWH battery, & SA assured I had it, the mobile tech said it was 74KWH battery, the SA said he was wrong, get a diagnostic @ service location. I called the service - he said I had the 65kwh CATL battery, the service location manager said they couldn’t tell me my battery size, yet he was going on how he had a 82KWH battery in his Y(ordered in July) & 82kw batteries were being put into SR, yet the LR can have any battery. Even though they said they couldn’t say battery size (said its proprietary info??) they said my battery warranty is 100K/8yrs - that is a SR battery warranty, the LR is suppose to be 120K/8yrs. The 82kwh was suppose to be in the LR21, not the SR & I doubt the Y in July. ?) it was assigned to the 3LR 1st. I paid $70k for a car w/poor battery. How can they charge the same price for the lucky person to have 82KWH battery & the unlucky person to have the poor battery. The low end battery doesnt have the same milaege, needs more charges & takes > 50 min in charge 150mls, it has higher dedegration, milaege doubles. The tesla support are useless, why isn’t the the batteries transparent to the customers ? I emphasized the 82kwh battery, was assured I got it, now I find out its a low end, prob nonstandard battery. Also my old software isn’t updateable - stuck on 2021.11.103, I wasnt able to get the beta FSD offer d/t being stuck on old software, even though I paid $10k for it. If I got a nonstandard, low end battery in my tesla, maybe nonstandard chips - its prob the reason my software isn’t updatable. Tesla should be able to help, resolve issue, but they wont even acknowledge the issue. The tesla support said theyve never heard of the 82KWH battery, how can they even work for Tesla if they dont know what they are selling. They need to resolve my battery issue & maybe put it on the tesla site customers might get the low end battery, or give customers a choice , like they did w/the LFP in SR customers. Battery size is more important than color or wheel choices. I didnt get the correct car I ordered, they need to correct it. I only get approx 240 usable miles- nowhere near 354ml. I think I read in the UK - they have to be transparent w/battery size to customers, maybe there isn’t as many issues because they know battery size, if they dont have to reveal battery size to US customers - we prob are getting the cast offs. Maybe employees get first dibs on the 82KWH battery.

 

[CaptFish2003]

^^^ I can’t make sense of this post! Clearly upset customer who got the wrong battery, model, make?????

 

[GeorgeSymonds]

Do we have any idea if Q4 LR will have the 82kWh battery?

The same question was asked about 6 posts back.

Up until now, MIC LR have had the LG 74/5 kWh battery. The odd new inventory car from China seen so far this quarter is the same including M3 and MY. Will it change at some point? Almost certainly, but nobody knows when. There have been some MIC LR inventory cars spotted going to Australia with a bigger battery so it’s possible, but the Tesla spec sheet for the uk is still the smaller battery,

 

[Adopado]

that was my only request upon the entire ordering process - the 82KWH battery in my 3LR21 - the 2020 model had the 75kwh battery, even the Y did, thats reason I chose the 3LR. I asked x 100 for 82KWH battery, & SA assured I had it, the mobile tech said it was 74KWH battery, the SA said he was wrong, get a diagnostic @ service location. I called the service - he said I had the 65kwh CATL battery, the service location manager said they couldn’t tell me my battery size, yet he was going on how he had a 82KWH battery in his Y(ordered in July) & 82kw batteries were being put into SR, yet the LR can have any battery. Even though they said they couldn’t say battery size (said its proprietary info??) they said my battery warranty is 100K/8yrs - that is a SR battery warranty, the LR is suppose to be 120K/8yrs. The 82kwh was suppose to be in the LR21, not the SR & I doubt the Y in July. ?) it was assigned to the 3LR 1st. I paid $70k for a car w/poor battery. How can they charge the same price for the lucky person to have 82KWH battery & the unlucky person to have the poor battery. The low end battery doesnt have the same milaege, needs more charges & takes > 50 min in charge 150mls, it has higher dedegration, milaege doubles. The tesla support are useless, why isn’t the the batteries transparent to the customers ? I emphasized the 82kwh battery, was assured I got it, now I find out its a low end, prob nonstandard battery. Also my old software isn’t updateable - stuck on 2021.11.103, I wasnt able to get the beta FSD offer d/t being stuck on old software, even though I paid $10k for it. If I got a nonstandard, low end battery in my tesla, maybe nonstandard chips - its prob the reason my software isn’t updatable. Tesla should be able to help, resolve issue, but they wont even acknowledge the issue. The tesla support said theyve never heard of the 82KWH battery, how can they even work for Tesla if they dont know what they are selling. They need to resolve my battery issue & maybe put it on the tesla site customers might get the low end battery, or give customers a choice , like they did w/the LFP in SR customers. Battery size is more important than color or wheel choices. I didnt get the correct car I ordered, they need to correct it. I only get approx 240 usable miles- nowhere near 354ml. I think I read in the UK - they have to be transparent w/battery size to customers, maybe there isn’t as many issues because they know battery size, if they dont have to reveal battery size to US customers - we prob are getting the cast offs. Maybe employees get first dibs on the 82KWH battery.

So many assumptions from all concerned ... that's including yourself!