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Pathetic TMC...

Discussion in 'Site Feedback' started by jeffro01, Jul 10, 2018.

  1. jeffro01

    jeffro01 Active Member

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    #1 jeffro01, Jul 10, 2018
    Last edited: Jul 10, 2018
    I've been around here for awhile and can't recall a single time I've ever heard of, or seen, posts deleted... That was until today...

    upload_2018-7-10_13-44-10.png

    Now that's what TMC represents? Openly deleting posts some random moderator doesn't agree with?

    Jeff
     
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  2. bmah

    bmah Moderator, Model S / Model X Forums

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    First, I don’t know the specifics of this particular message or why it was deleted. (Very few TMC moderators have privileges over the entire set of forums, and I’m pretty sure this wasn’t in one of “my” areas.)

    We actually do delete posts for a number of reasons, the most notable recent is spam on the boards. Other might be duplicate posts, excessive cross-posting, or clear mistakes. In general we prefer to move posts to quarantine threads rather than deleting them outright. Writing a post that a moderator disagrees with is not, by itself, grounds for being deleted. People write all kinds of things in forums I moderate that I totally disagree with, but as long as they follow the forum rules, their posts remain.

    You’ve been on TMC for years (longer than I have in fact). I personally wouldn’t take a single post getting deleted as conclusive evidence of a change against years of precedent. And we haven’t had any changes in moderating policy in the short time I’ve been involved with moderating.

    In the best case, whichever moderator deleted your post (who was, again, not me) might reach out to you to explain further.

    Bruce.
     
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  3. jeffro01

    jeffro01 Active Member

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    Thank you for the thoughtful response. I'm still not sure what I said that would have caused a post to get deleted...

    Jeff
     
  4. P85_DA

    P85_DA Supporting Member

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  5. jeffro01

    jeffro01 Active Member

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    I have no idea... I'm not sure which post was deleted as I made several in that thread so I'm not quite sure...

    Jeff
     
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  6. Dr. J

    Dr. J Member

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    Wow, and *I* was the guy talking about underwear! ;)
     
  7. jeffro01

    jeffro01 Active Member

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    Okay so I figured it out...

    'bro1999' made an obnoxious post as that user often does and I commented that perhaps they were banning the wrong people insinuating that I think (and I really do think this actually) that 'bro1999' should be banned...

    That's the post that got canned... Still not sure why... I made another comment the other day that someone complained about which I think setup this situation today... To that same poster 'bro1999' I said something to the affect the other day "where on the doll did Elon/Tesla touch you?"...

    It all fits now, I still think it's absurd but at least I figured it out...

    Jeff
     
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  8. TaoJones

    TaoJones Beyond Driven

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    Odd that those posts weren't simply moved to the legendary Snippiness thread. There are worse posts there, certainly.

    One of the most glaring opportunities for improvement at TMC, and it won't change anytime soon, is achieving consistency in moderation. To say that it has been... not moderate... would be kind. Mysteriously, the forums at tesla.com (to which every Tesla owner and non-owner have access) do just fine with virtually no visible moderation.

    Cloning Bruce and that Audubon fellow a dozen times would be a good start. No offense intended to the originals who consistently manage to do a fine job despite the oncoming teeming hordes and GUM (Great Unwashed Masses), but there are only so many hours in the day and it's not like membership is going to shrink. It may well increase tenfold perhaps. Which only underscores the point - heavyhanded and inconsistent moderation simply perpetuates negative activity. It ain't rocket science.
     
  9. AudubonB

    AudubonB Mild-mannered Moderator Lord Vetinari*

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    Both ggr and I are crushingly overworked in the Investors’ Sector; most of the needless work coming from thoughtless posts. There have been a goodly number of warnings recently to the tune of “...any more such and posts will be summarily deleted”. If any member is surprised to read a post of his or hers is gone, that suggests he or she hasn’t been reading Mod posts.

    Which is a very, very unsmart idea.

    Removing a post from one location into its appropriate place is not a ten-second ....or even a three-minute... task (except to Snippiness, which usually takes about a minute). A post must really really be of considerable merit in order to get such kid glove treatment. And other than my very own coruscatingly brilliant missives, few of them rise to that level.


    Remember: Tyrant!
     
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  10. T34ME

    T34ME Active Member

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    Who is @bro1999 ? I don't see any posts from them! ;)
     
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  11. scaesare

    scaesare Well-Known Member

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    The "doll post" was good for a nice chuckle, by the way... well played sir.
     
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  12. ⚡️ELECTROMAN⚡️

    ⚡️ELECTROMAN⚡️ Fritterer and waster of hours in an off hand wayer

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    I’m surprised they haven’t deleted this thread yet. I’m not a fan of how moderated this forum is, but I still get a lot out of it, so I stick around even though I can’t speak my mind.
     
  13. bmah

    bmah Moderator, Model S / Model X Forums

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    My personal opinion only...I have also seen that in general the admins and other mods don’t talk very much about behind-the-scenes stuff so it’s possible I’m violating some unwritten rule but here we go:

    I agree that we could be more consistent in moderating. As a new moderator it’s hard to learn what’s “normal” because each moderator only has moderating privileges / visibility into selected parts of the forums. In fact I don’t even know who all of the other moderators are. The “obvious” solution to this, giving all moderators privileges everywhere, probably doesn’t scale very well (because all of us would get inundated with moderation / reports for all the forums). It also might not be something the site admins want to do.

    Also, we have different styles. Some moderators do their work silently (@efusco is the main moderator on the Model S forum but you might not know it). Others prefer to be more visible (I fall into this camp, and so does @ecarfan). As a result there might be (is, actually) a bunch of moderator work going on that most people don’t see. Some forums seem to have an intrinsic need for more strict moderation (such as the Investors forums, which I stay out of).

    Oh yes, I’m glad @jeffro01 that you’re satisfied (at least partially anyways) with my answer. You’ll forgive me if I don’t run off to read the thread... regardless of who wrote it, “touch the doll” tells me more than I want to know. :p

    Bruce.
     
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  14. jaguar36

    jaguar36 Active Member

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    So obviously I didn't delete your post, but I did report it. It was clearly a personal insult without much other substance. I would have expected that it got moved to snippiness, but deleting doesn't seem unreasonable either.
     
  15. jeffro01

    jeffro01 Active Member

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    While you certainly have the right to your own opinion and I completely support that right, I still don't see what was so personally insulting about the comment. People are way to sensitive these days and for obvious and well publicized reasons. I appreciate your willingness to speak up and I do see where you're coming from even if I don't agree with it.

    There is a small, but highly vocal, group of posters here now that insist on posting negative reactions to anything and everything Tesla/Elon does. I get sick and tired of it so I jab back when I can...

    Jeff
     
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  16. SSedan

    SSedan Member

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    I have been on both ends of moderation on other forums, on one forum I called a guy out for grossly miss stating his qualifications based on some questions he was asking, a Moderator quoted me and agreed, another Moderator comes along and gives me an infraction for said post and then gets even more bent out of shape when I pointed out one of his peers quoted and agreed with me........................................... We are all individuals and wont act the same as one another.

    On the other hand I am a moderator on another forum, spam is about the only way to be banned there and they gave us a "one touch ban and clean up" few clicks and all someone's posts are deleted and the IP banned. Abusive posters are rare and called out quickly and seem to go away on their own, I have never had to do anything more than send a friendly PM asking someone to clean up the language a bit..

    I can also see a simple misunderstanding happening too, the traffic volume here is great enough a moderator could confuse a mildly abrasive post that would be overlooked as a rare occurrence from a generally good member of the community with someone more troublesome. A good member can probably get away with an occasional abrasive post, but if that is all someone else makes their posts will begin to disappear.
     
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  17. S4WRXTTCS

    S4WRXTTCS Active Member

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    There was a point where the deleting/moving/etc got so bad that I didn't feel like it was worthwhile to contribute.

    I haven't seen that for awhile. In fact I haven't really seen a contentious thread in awhile.

    Heck I haven't even seen a discussion on the whole SpaceX/Thailand.

    On Arstechnica there was like 4 different articles where each one had hundreds of comments.

    On this site there is a single thread within SpaceX that has a few comments.

    What happened?

    On the Elon Musk thread no one has posted since June 30th.

    Really? Even the "Have we all been played by Tesla" has barely gotten to 9 pages and it's at a time where you'd think a fair number of reservation owners would be a bit irked to say the least.

    I think the OP should consider himself lucky that he actually found a thread with a pulse, and something happened.
     
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  18. anticitizen13.7

    anticitizen13.7 Not posting at TMC after 9/17/2018

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    The unfortunate reality is that there are several highly toxic people at TMC who continually troll and are allowed to behave badly on a long-term basis without consequence. One of them has already been mentioned previously in this thread.

    The terms of service state: "We also ask that you maintain a level of objectivity and be aware of your own biases. Don’t try to state opinions as fact and be careful to distinguish between the two."

    Absurdly, previously mentioned forum member has rarely if ever maintained any objectivity. In fact, they go out of their way to denigrate anything to do with Tesla, promote competing product from another company, and even have a signature that is basically a personal attack on another TMC member.

    Why is this kind of behavior permitted?

    Since Q1 of this year, TMC has become pretty awful. I'd say that at times, it has rivaled NASIOC's (North American Subaru Impreza Owners Club) worst periods, and for anyone who knows anything about auto communities, that's about as bad as it can get.

    In 2017, I asked the TMC admins what kind of site they wanted to run. In 2018, I'm sorry to say that the outcome is a cesspool that rivals Reddit.
     
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  19. anticitizen13.7

    anticitizen13.7 Not posting at TMC after 9/17/2018

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    #19 anticitizen13.7, Jul 17, 2018
    Last edited: Jul 17, 2018
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  20. wdolson

    wdolson Supporting Member

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    I found this thread after someone asked bro1999 to answer a question in another thread and someone else said he was banned. It looks like all of his posts were deleted. I remember him posting quite a bit in the Chevy Bolt thread. He was an early adopter and often defended it when he thought others had bad things to say about it.

    I don't recall him saying anything that controversial, but he must have hit someone's third rail. Though I don't always remember people who can contribute good information and sometimes cross the line unless it's pretty extreme. (I do remember someone on another forum who could be very informative when sober, but a total jerk when drunk and you never knew what you were going to get from one day to the next.)
     

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