Performance Model 3 Snow Tires/Rims

[hoang51]

Anyone tried similar and had any issues? Anyone compared efficiency to the 20" OEM for the 3P?

Anyone get Tesla to sub a 19" OEM rim for the model 3P 20" OEM?

To give an update with regards to my setup that you quoted, the efficiency compared to the stock 20" wheels set wasn't astronomical. I would say negligible gains during the cold season. Reduced maybe 20 Wh/mi on average with the tires and the rim design I picked when spring came around where I knew consistent numbers I can compare between the PS4 & AS 3+.. I remember that it's a struggle to make it over 100 miles on a single full charge up to 90% SOC on both tires. Probably due to the fact that I have to run the heater a lot due to having a child in the back seat for comfort.

The 20" wheels are specially designed for the bigger brakes and rotors whereas the 19" wheels are not. So last I checked in 2018, they're not interchangeable. The 19" runs need a lip design to accommodate the mounting change.

Edit: got a PM from you, so I'll answer it here in case anybody else would like some additional information. As for rim protection, I won't be relying on the abnormal sizing to protect the rim in case of a curb rash. I basically reminded my self to avoid making tight turns and take the time to make wider turns to avoid curb rashes to the rims. Better to rely on rim protection to avoid curb rashes. Rimblade and the likes should give reasonable protection. I looked into then before, but decided against them for the time being.

Currently, I'm pleased with the tires & rims. They're very similar to the PS4. If I had to keep one set of tires and wheels, it wouldn't be the stock 20" wheels. 19" wheels set looked more unique and would last longer due to higher wear rating on the AS 3+.

The tires do not rub or interfere with anything I can tell. Clearance is about the same. Definitely recommend these tires for lite snow handling that the PS4 aren't rated for.

 

[hoang51]

To be honest, I wouldn't worry so much about going under 40F for a little bit as long as there is NO snow. Especially if you were driving while doing so as the the warmth of driving will definitely keep it fine. I wouldn't park it for long periods at that temperature though although I inadvertently did it on mine for a little bit.

To add to this, definitely do not expect the PS4 tires to perform at it's best and offer good handling. The rubber on the wheels become stiffer as the temperature dives lower. They can get you from point A to point B, but definitely not worth driving in the snow.

By my own experience in northern VA with the PS4 tires, not worth the mental stress trying to avoid hitting other cars on the snowy road or even braking in time (regenerative brakes are of no use, it'll cause the car to slide). The PS4 failed to keep good traction when I drove through slushy ice/snow during a snow fall and temperature was around 36 degrees or so. The snow barely stuck to the roads in most part. But the least traveled roads however, had some very minor snow accumulation that normally wouldn't be a problem even with a crappy all season tires on.

 

[sveurkin]

I remember that it's a struggle to make it over 100 miles on a single full charge up to 90% SOC on both tires. Probably due to the fact that I have to run the heater a lot due to having a child in the back seat for comfort.

I expected heaters to reduce range. But 100 miles being a struggle is a surprise. In what conditions? Outside temp? Heavy snow? Elevation gain?

 

[hoang51]

I expected heaters to reduce range. But 100 miles being a struggle is a surprise. In what conditions? Outside temp? Heavy snow? Elevation gain?

The way I operate my car is different from many of those who operate theirs now. I have free unlimited Supercharging. I don't charge my car at home. So that's why I deplete my car's battery from 80-90% down to 10-20% and charge it back up. If you use it like most people who charge it at home, you'll get more than 100 miles range by having the heater run while the car is plugged in to charge prior to use. Starting up the heater consumes a lot of power when starting to use compared to a heater that is going to just maintain the temperature from plugged in while on the go. Outside temperature during my times was around 30-40 degrees F. I think I was getting about close to 400 Wh/mi in the city when expected 250 Wh/mi during warmer temperatures (70-80 degrees F). Just keep in mind that I have a baby to keep comfortable. Otherwise, I would've cut down on the heater use to extend my range. The good thing is that I don't drive very far around where I live and I can manage the Supercharging time issue.

 

[sveurkin]

The way I operate my car is different from many of those who operate theirs now. I have free unlimited Supercharging. I don't charge my car at home. So that's why I deplete my car's battery from 80-90% down to 10-20% and charge it back up. If you use it like most people who charge it at home, you'll get more than 100 miles range by having the heater run while the car is plugged in to charge prior to use. Starting up the heater consumes a lot of power when starting to use compared to a heater that is going to just maintain the temperature from plugged in while on the go. Outside temperature during my times was around 30-40 degrees F. I think I was getting about close to 400 Wh/mi in the city when expected 250 Wh/mi during warmer temperatures (70-80 degrees F). Just keep in mind that I have a baby to keep comfortable. Otherwise, I would've cut down on the heater use to extend my range. The good thing is that I don't drive very far around where I live and I can manage the Supercharging time issue.

Ah, thanks for the clarification. I do plan to generally start most trips with the battery and interior at a comfortable temperature before I start. Also thinking of a few blankets in the car for winter travel so we can keep the interior a bit cooler. Heat loss is generally the square of the temperature difference, so even 5-10 degrees less difference can make a large difference.

 

[pizzam]

I was wondering if anyone runs skinnier winter tires? I usually run skinnier tires than stock so that they cut through the snow better. 215-50-18 are a perfect match to the stock size. It is a weird size and there are very limited tires that are available, but it seems like a more ideal snow tire size.

 

[GregD60]

Actual stupidity. 38 pages of discussion and not one person actually bothered to question the warning label and testvthe damn tires in freezing temperatures. No, they do not crack as claimed on the warming label. Not only that, but I only managed to find one video on YouTube of a guy who succeeded cracking the thread on the summer tires by beating them up all winter long. One guy managed to do it.

Any other ideas you’d like to take on faith, without proof?

The tire manufacturer has tested the tires in freezing temperatures and the engineers for the tire company have determined what is a safe temperature limit for the tire 100% of the time. If the tire company said their summer tire is okay for freezing weather, there'd be somebody out there who would leave their car outside some night at minus twenty degrees Fahrenheit, then hop in the car the next morning and drive off, virtually guaranteeing tire failure. For a tire manufacturer to say their tire is safe in a condition where they know there is a chance, no matter how slight, of tire damage or failure is just a good way to ensure a lawsuit.

Yes, you can probably get away with using something like a Michelin 4S for most of the winter in most places without the tire physically self destructing on you, but the performance is poor compared to a performance winter tire, and you are taking a risk of tire damage or failure due to temperature. It's your choice. Personally, I choose to use a performance winter tire, but then I also have a lot more severe winter weather to deal with than you.

 

[escpethewrmhle]

Actual stupidity. 38 pages of discussion and not one person actually bothered to question the warning label and testvthe damn tires in freezing temperatures. No, they do not crack as claimed on the warming label. Not only that, but I only managed to find one video on YouTube of a guy who succeeded cracking the thread on the summer tires by beating them up all winter long. One guy managed to do it.

Any other ideas you’d like to take on faith, without proof?

I live in Canada, I have used Pilot Super Sports (predecessor to P4S) in winter in past cars. This is stupid, and anyone doing what you're suggesting is stupid and asking to crash.

I have seen the tires crack. I have drifted my Mitsubishi Evolution across an intersection on bare pavement on a cold -15c (-5f) morning. My R35 GT-R could move forwards and backwards on them but nothing stopped it from moving side to side laterally while moving in the snow. It was outright dangerous if it was slushy and I was only moving it from bay to bay in the yard at my shop.

 

[HugoBoss]

I live in Canada, I have used Pilot Super Sports (predecessor to P4S) in winter in past cars. This is stupid, and anyone doing what you're suggesting is stupid and asking to crash.

I have seen the tires crack. I have drifted my Mitsubishi Evolution across an intersection on bare pavement on a cold -15c (-5f) morning. My R35 GT-R could move forwards and backwards on them but nothing stopped it from moving side to side laterally while moving in the snow. It was outright dangerous if it was slushy and I was only moving it from bay to bay in the yard at my shop.

This is absolutely right, it's so stupid and dangerous. Go on Subaru forums and you'll read stories of guys using summer tires in the winter "cause it's Awd"

Dumbest thing you can do, dont play with your lives

 

[KenC]

I was wondering if anyone runs skinnier winter tires? I usually run skinnier tires than stock so that they cut through the snow better. 215-50-18 are a perfect match to the stock size. It is a weird size and there are very limited tires that are available, but it seems like a more ideal snow tire size.

Running a smaller wheel and/or narrower tires is a fairly common approach for Winter tires, as long as your load rating is the same. There are two approaches to snow tires: one, in the far North is to run wide tires at lower pressures, so they float on the packed snow, only for those who drive on packed snow all Winter. Two, everywhere else, the idea is to run narrower tires to cut thru any snow/slush better. Also a smaller footprint puts more pounds/square inch on the ground, to help traction. Not to mention having the higher sidewalls doesn't hurt in uncertain ground conditions.

 

[afadeev]

Running a smaller wheel and/or narrower tires is a fairly common approach for Winter tires, as long as your load rating is the same. There are two approaches to snow tires: one, in the far North is to run wide tires at lower pressures, so they float on the packed snow, only for those who drive on packed snow all Winter.

True.
Also, on "always snow and ice covered roads", studded winter tires are really the ticket.
Alas, metal studs are terrible on plowed roads (for both traction and the road surface), and are thus illegal on public roads in many states.

Two, everywhere else, the idea is to run narrower tires to cut thru any snow/slush better. Also a smaller footprint puts more pounds/square inch on the ground, to help traction. Not to mention having the higher sidewalls doesn't hurt in uncertain ground conditions.

Agree on the motivation, but not the explanation. Changing the width of the tire does help it cut through the snow to the firm asphalt below, especially when the tire starts spinning.

However, changing the tire width has NO impact on the contact patch surface area (pounds/inch^2).
The contact patch's surface area always stays constant, as long as the car's weight and tire pressures stay the same. That's physics.
The contact patch's shape does change (static - while parked, and dynamic - under lateral loads), and the narrower tire produces longer and narrower contact patch.

HTH,
a

 

[afadeev]

#2. Clarification most wheels from TireRack will require a hubcentric ring... not spacers. I have worked with TireRack to iron out their hubcentric ring issue...and can confirm they fit/work perfectly now.

Can you please clarify what part # from TR is the TM3P hubcentric ring?

I am definitely going with 18" wheels + winter tires for my TM3P, and currently strongly prefer Tesla's 18" Aero wheels to partially offset winter mileage handicap.

My working assumption is that 3-5mm 70.5mm bore spacer would even out the surface area between the hub and the "lip":
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B...ailpage_o06_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1#customerReviews

Can anyone confirm successful fitment of 18" Aero wheels with spacers onto TM3-Performance cars?

TIA,
a

 

[N54TT]

Can you please clarify what part # from TR is the TM3P hubcentric ring?

I am definitely going with 18" wheels + winter tires for my TM3P, and currently strongly prefer Tesla's 18" Aero wheels to partially offset winter mileage handicap.

My working assumption is that 3-5mm 70.5mm bore spacer would even out the surface area between the hub and the "lip":
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B...ailpage_o06_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1#customerReviews

Can anyone confirm successful fitment of 18" Aero wheels with spacers onto TM3-Performance cars?

TIA,
a

I don’t have a part number. The order of the replacement springs just said MM 79.5-64.1 TESLA 3 SPORT. I believe the clearance issues with the 18” aero is with the inner barrels of the wheels and the brake caliper. Spacers won’t solve this issue.
If going aftermarket. Unless the hubs are 79.5 these tire rack rings won’t work.

 

[Goodtohave]

I have been a rear wheel drive BMW guy for years and have run studded tires, recently using factory studs which are so much quieter then when added later...With the windows closed you can’t even here them.

On my Leaf I didn’t run studs as I was worried about the noise as the leaf was not as well insulated for sound as the BMW is but for the tesla I really want to run studs, hopefully I won’t regret it.

As far as narrower I am considering it but as it is the tires are nearly flush with the rims and easy to scratch parking so I worry a narrower tire will make it worse.

 

[afadeev]

I don’t have a part number. The order of the replacement springs just said MM 79.5-64.1 TESLA 3 SPORT.

TR is closed for the labor day weekend. Based on multiple sets of wheels and tires I had bought from them over the years, they tend to source large batches of wide bore wheels, then adapt them to various applications via hub-centric spacers. I am not a fan of that approach, as it makes perfect balancing harder to attain.

Looks like yours were 79.5mm bore wheels, and they adopted them down to Tesla's 64.1mm bore.

I believe the clearance issues with the 18” aero is with the inner barrels of the wheels and the brake caliper. Spacers won’t solve this issue.

Of course not, but I am not sure that inner wheel barrel diameter is an issue.
Other 18" wheels clear TM3-Performance calipers, so I don't see why OEM Tesla wheels should not. Would need to test fit to confirm.

If someone knows that 18"T Aero wheel barrells have funky wrinkles that interfere with Performance calipers, please do speak up!

Tesla itself is of no help with this inquiry, as could be expected.

a

 

[N54TT]

TR is closed for the labor day weekend. Based on multiple sets of wheels and tires I had bought from them over the years, they tend to source large batches of wide bore wheels, then adapt them to various applications via hub-centric spacers. I am not a fan of that approach, as it makes perfect balancing harder to attain.

Looks like yours were 79.5mm bore wheels, and they adopted them down to Tesla's 64.1mm bore.




Of course not, but I am not sure that inner wheel barrel diameter is an issue.
Other 18" wheels clear TM3-Performance calipers, so I don't see why OEM Tesla wheels should not. Would need to test fit to confirm.

If someone knows that 18"T Aero wheel barrells have funky wrinkles that interfere with Performance calipers, please do speak up!

Tesla itself is of no help with this inquiry, as could be expected.

a

That’s exactly how the flow one race spec wheels are. But nothing wrong with hub centric rings. They’re my winter beater set and are cheap. I do prefer Hub centric as well...which is what my VSForged summer set is.

The aero’s clear the front performance calipers. It’s the rear that’s the issue. If it were simply a spacer to help clear....there would be plenty of aero’s on P3D+’s around. Here’s a post of someone trying it.

Confirmed: Performance Red Brakes DO NOT fit 18" aero wheels

 

[escpethewrmhle]

I have been a rear wheel drive BMW guy for years and have run studded tires, recently using factory studs which are so much quieter then when added later...With the windows closed you can’t even here them.

On my Leaf I didn’t run studs as I was worried about the noise as the leaf was not as well insulated for sound as the BMW is but for the tesla I really want to run studs, hopefully I won’t regret it.

As far as narrower I am considering it but as it is the tires are nearly flush with the rims and easy to scratch parking so I worry a narrower tire will make it worse.

Studs are arguably a waste of time and money. They’re only good on ice otherwise they’re worse in slush and and snow and on concrete they wear down pretty rapidly to where they don’t do much anyway.

 

[afadeev]

That’s exactly how the flow one race spec wheels are. But nothing wrong with hub centric rings. They’re my winter beater set and are cheap. I do prefer Hub centric as well...which is what my VSForged summer set is.

The aero’s clear the front performance calipers. It’s the rear that’s the issue. If it were simply a spacer to help clear....there would be plenty of aero’s on P3D+’s around. Here’s a post of someone trying it.

Confirmed: Performance Red Brakes DO NOT fit 18" aero wheels

Thank you for the information and the link.
Weird that Tesla found a way to install bigger rear calipers than the front, but it is what it is.


a

 

[jackbowers]

Just curious, has anyone been driving year-round on Tesla's 20" winter tires (Pirelli Sotozeros)? Just put these on my Model 3 and they seem to grip surprisingly well on dry pavement. With a W speed rating I don't imagine they can be damaged by heat, but I am wondering about treadwear.

 

[Warbird]

Just curious, has anyone been driving year-round on Tesla's 20" winter tires (Pirelli Sotozeros)? Just put these on my Model 3 and they seem to grip surprisingly well on dry pavement. With a W speed rating I don't imagine they can be damaged by heat, but I am wondering about treadwear.

Ahh..Hmm...Winter Tires are not for the summer. They may "grip" well, but its a very gushy grip...kind of like driving on an eraser. The open cell rubber is designed to grab ice. It is very soft and will wear faster in warm temperatures. You will only get 15-20K miles out of them when used in cold temps, which equates to three or four "winter" seasons. Why would you drive on winter tires when its not yet winter?