sgblank
Member
Just an FYI, I got a formal 'OK'D by Jerome" quote for a P85 to P85+ retrofit from the Palo Alto service center
$23,968
$23,968
-
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Performance Plus Package now available as option or retrofit
- Thread starter Lyon
- Start date
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- Driving Dynamics Model S
sgblank
Member
simplesolar
Member
just pay the $21.12 for the P85+ badge and you're all set. :tongue: You can probably skip the $9,000 in wheels, tires and TPMS and achieve 95% of the result
dennis
Model S Plaid
Not sure I agree. You need the additional grip of the PS2s to achieve balanced handling with the stiffer bushings. Ask @lolachampcar - he is the expert in this area.
lolachampcar
Well-Known Member
Guess what I learned......
I purchased a set of P+ rear lower a-arms from my wife's (early Sept. delivery S85 on coil springs). When they showed up (ordered using my ViN), they were the exact same part number as those on my Feb. delivery P85 and some take offs I had that were donated by a Sig conversion to factory P+. I checked with parts and they told me there was only one part number! I confirmed that, like the sub-frame bushings before, Tesla has moved to all production using the stiffer bushings in the rear lower a-arms.
I find this very interesting for two reasons. First, I've been raving about my the way my wife's S85 feels. Sure, the coil spring ride height is way to high for my tastes but, by in large, the car feels much better than my first P85 and as good as my P+ but without the head snatch. I attributed this all to the coil springs. I was wrong.
Second, I tried an experiment on my P+ when I did the upper camber links using ball bearings instead of pressing the P+ bushings out of the original upper links. I could feel absolutely no difference in the back of the car. Sure, the P+ kit also does the torque and toe links but they carry less load than the upper link in most cases. This told me that, but a large margin, the RCA bushings were the controlling factor with feel in the rear of MS. My wife's car confirms this.
I think it is fantastic that Tesla is constantly improving things. Sure, it takes a little effort trying to stay up with them so you can make informed decisions on possible MS modifications but that is just part of the game. They simply produce a better car each day.
I am still pursuing trying coil springs on my P+ but I do not expect as much gain as originally anticipated. That's ok. The air suspension dampers are much stiffer in compression and rebound (see shock dyno plots in modification thread) which, when combined with coil springs at P+ ride height, should provided for an interesting experiment. With luck, we will see.
One last comment.....
I am now certain the very best possible value would be achieved by buying a P85 and making the following changes-
Pull the dampers and lower the lower perch landing clip on the damper housing to set the car at a more desirable ride height. I'll have a set of those dampers done here in the near future should anyone like to test this theory (still working on my wife to get her to let me lower her car).
Alternatively, get some standard air dampers from a P+ conversion and use these with the desired ride height as they will offer increased damping (still to be tested).
Buy the car with 19s and then go buy some low weight 20"s with some Super Sports. This will allow a choice in appearance combined with reduced unsprung weight and rotational inertia all at much less than Tesla's $1500 per wheel. Better value. Better tire cost. Better tire performance. Still have spare 19s for winter.
The above should provided a better feel than the P+ at a lower price point. Given that Tesla is using the new LCAs on all cars and assuming my theory on the LCAs being the controlling factor for feel in the rear, there really is no need for staggered tire widths to balance the above set up. Of course, when you order your wheels and tires yourself you can pick whatever set up you like.
My 2 cents worth.
I purchased a set of P+ rear lower a-arms from my wife's (early Sept. delivery S85 on coil springs). When they showed up (ordered using my ViN), they were the exact same part number as those on my Feb. delivery P85 and some take offs I had that were donated by a Sig conversion to factory P+. I checked with parts and they told me there was only one part number! I confirmed that, like the sub-frame bushings before, Tesla has moved to all production using the stiffer bushings in the rear lower a-arms.
I find this very interesting for two reasons. First, I've been raving about my the way my wife's S85 feels. Sure, the coil spring ride height is way to high for my tastes but, by in large, the car feels much better than my first P85 and as good as my P+ but without the head snatch. I attributed this all to the coil springs. I was wrong.
Second, I tried an experiment on my P+ when I did the upper camber links using ball bearings instead of pressing the P+ bushings out of the original upper links. I could feel absolutely no difference in the back of the car. Sure, the P+ kit also does the torque and toe links but they carry less load than the upper link in most cases. This told me that, but a large margin, the RCA bushings were the controlling factor with feel in the rear of MS. My wife's car confirms this.
I think it is fantastic that Tesla is constantly improving things. Sure, it takes a little effort trying to stay up with them so you can make informed decisions on possible MS modifications but that is just part of the game. They simply produce a better car each day.
I am still pursuing trying coil springs on my P+ but I do not expect as much gain as originally anticipated. That's ok. The air suspension dampers are much stiffer in compression and rebound (see shock dyno plots in modification thread) which, when combined with coil springs at P+ ride height, should provided for an interesting experiment. With luck, we will see.
One last comment.....
I am now certain the very best possible value would be achieved by buying a P85 and making the following changes-
Pull the dampers and lower the lower perch landing clip on the damper housing to set the car at a more desirable ride height. I'll have a set of those dampers done here in the near future should anyone like to test this theory (still working on my wife to get her to let me lower her car).
Alternatively, get some standard air dampers from a P+ conversion and use these with the desired ride height as they will offer increased damping (still to be tested).
Buy the car with 19s and then go buy some low weight 20"s with some Super Sports. This will allow a choice in appearance combined with reduced unsprung weight and rotational inertia all at much less than Tesla's $1500 per wheel. Better value. Better tire cost. Better tire performance. Still have spare 19s for winter.
The above should provided a better feel than the P+ at a lower price point. Given that Tesla is using the new LCAs on all cars and assuming my theory on the LCAs being the controlling factor for feel in the rear, there really is no need for staggered tire widths to balance the above set up. Of course, when you order your wheels and tires yourself you can pick whatever set up you like.
My 2 cents worth.
Hi Sgblank, thanks for the awesome post on the quote. You mentioned earlier that later vins (I presume at least later than P06xxx) have the new "rear subframe assembly". And if so, that you would not need to pay for it. Is this correct? Also, if you don't mind, who was your service advisor? If you can't mention it here, can you PM me? I want to speak to him in regards to the full upgrade and find out more information.
Thanks again for your insight!!
P.S. What are you deciding on doing?
Thanks again for your insight!!
P.S. What are you deciding on doing?
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