Welcome to Tesla Motors Club
Discuss Tesla's Model S, Model 3, Model X, Model Y, Cybertruck, Roadster and More.
Register

Perhaps a third battery charge display option is needed

mike123abc

Member
Aug 20, 2018
406
808
Norman, OK
A third battery charge display would be nice.

Right now you have a choice between "distance" and "percentage" for the battery indicator.

Perhaps after a few thousand miles on the car a third option could appear. A distance based on current driving pattern.

So, you would have "EPA distance" based on the health of the battery and consumption pattern assumed for the EPA, "Percentage" as usual, and now a "Calculated distance" based on past history of the car, perhaps over the last 5000 miles or so.

The calculated distance would probably be much more accurate for most people. Right now I have mine on percentage since I know how far I can go based on that, and do the math. I would much prefer a full charge to say 255 on my LR AWD since that is about what I get.

Perhaps it could even take into account temperature. If it was really fancy there would be an "i" next to it that you could touch to have more information come up like "15% less calculated range due to freezing temperatures" or something. After all this is a computer we are dealing with, why is it the driver's job to figure out all this, when the car already knows?
 
  • Like
Reactions: RScottyL

gecko10x

Member
Jan 22, 2018
265
163
WV
I agree it would be nice to have the option or addition to display one of the estimated ranges from the Energy Graph. Average over last 30 would probably be sufficient. But I would want both I think... EPA and estimated.
 

TimothyHW3

Active Member
Jun 2, 2019
1,032
567
Germany
Tesla already has everything you need built into the energy tab. You can view your consumption and you can also view the Trip. If you navigate yourself with the Tesla nav, the trip meter will take speed and elevation into consideration. Not sure if they take temperature into that, but the fact it is so accurate tells me they probably do.

Seriously, if it works almost flawlessly with the limited speed data Tesla has in Europe, with the almost standard driving habbits in the US and amazing data, I think it is 65-75mph I guess it will be even more accurate. One time I was driving up and down and Tesla's Trip prediction predicted not only the % to a 1% error, but they also knew when exactly I will be at what elevation and how much Regen will I gain, at the exact point in the trip diagram.

Also, what you are suggesting doesn't make sense, because even then you will not know how many miles you have since there might be phantom drain the car doesn't know about. KIA does what you want on their EVs and believe me, it is the dumbest thing!

In addition you have the consumption on the trip, which you can reset anyway you like. And the concept of range is pretty simple. You take the battery capacity of around 73 available, substract 10% as you don't wanna go below 10%, so you have 65-66kWh usable. Then you divide that by the consumption you see under energy or trip (assume 24.5kWh/100 miles)- this gives you the miles left. Simple!

Tesla has you covered, you just need to read what it tells you.
 

TimothyHW3

Active Member
Jun 2, 2019
1,032
567
Germany
Instead of pushing disagree - which part of the information Tesla provides, and I listed, is not enough for you to make an informative decision?

Like I said, KIA does that and is the dumbest thing ever - they don't have trip diagram, they don't predict elevation, don't factor in speed. They just look at the last consumption across X miles and base the range off of that - something what you want.

You can't read battery degradation from this info, because that number is not conclusive, you don't have ANY real prediction for your next trip(what if drive at a different speed or elevation) so basically this info is useless, trust me. Also, Tesla has this in their energy tab kind of layed out if you want to dig it out.

So just curious what the advantage would be?
 

Rocky_H

Well-Known Member
Feb 19, 2015
6,406
7,557
Boise, ID
Perhaps after a few thousand miles on the car a third option could appear. A distance based on current driving pattern.

So, you would have "EPA distance" based on the health of the battery and consumption pattern assumed for the EPA, "Percentage" as usual, and now a "Calculated distance" based on past history of the car, perhaps over the last 5000 miles or so.
Yeah--that is what is in the energy app on the touch screen. It is a projected remaining distance, calculated from your past driving over the last 5, 15, or 30 miles. This is what you are asking for. It already exists. Going too far back, like this 5,000 miles doesn't make very much sense, because that gets you into other seasons of the year, and projected summer range is going to be wildly different from winter range, so you want it more recently, like in the past several hours, which the 30 miles kind of covers for recent conditions of how much heating or cooling you are using today.
 
  • Like
Reactions: jjrandorin

mike123abc

Member
Aug 20, 2018
406
808
Norman, OK
Tesla already has everything you need built into the energy tab. You can view your consumption and you can also view the Trip. If you navigate yourself with the Tesla nav, the trip meter will take speed and elevation into consideration. Not sure if they take temperature into that, but the fact it is so accurate tells me they probably do.

I use the energy graph all the time since the current battery indicator is pretty much useless.

Maybe 5000 miles is a bit long for history, but 30 miles in the graph is a bit short, maybe 100 miles. I do not need to graph electricity on short trips, I only care when I am driving hundreds of miles and need to pay attention.

Perhaps better stated - use the energy graph number on the indicator. That way you do not need to cover your whole map screen with an energy graph.

And as stated above both the estimated range and % at the same time would be nice too...
 

SomeJoe7777

Marginally-Known Member
Mar 28, 2015
2,177
5,645
Houston, TX
One particularly useful number I'd like to see is a "buffer" number of miles displayed on the energy graph. I currently calculate this in my head while driving on a road trip, but it would be more convenient to show it.

It's calculated by taking the number of predicted miles left available in the battery (this number is shown on the right of the energy graph, and is based on the current consumption over the current energy graph display) minus the number of miles left to get to my destination.

For example, if I'm driving on the latter part of the road trip, and the energy graph shows that based on my past 30 miles of consumption that I have 90 miles left in the battery (shown on the right), and I have 75 miles to go to my destination, then that means I should have a buffer of (90 - 75) = 15 miles in the battery for safety. As I drive, my consumption might go up or down, and the buffer value will correspondingly change. As I hit rain, for example, the buffer value starts to drop because the consumption goes up. If I get uncomfortable with the buffer value, I can slow down.

Essentially, this is a miles representation of the final state of the battery as shown on the energy graph's battery prediction line at the end of the trip, but is more accurate and can therefore help you make micro adjustments to your driving.
 

Rocky_H

Well-Known Member
Feb 19, 2015
6,406
7,557
Boise, ID
One particularly useful number I'd like to see is a "buffer" number of miles displayed on the energy graph. I currently calculate this in my head while driving on a road trip, but it would be more convenient to show it.

It's calculated by taking the number of predicted miles left available in the battery (this number is shown on the right of the energy graph, and is based on the current consumption over the current energy graph display) minus the number of miles left to get to my destination.

For example, if I'm driving on the latter part of the road trip, and the energy graph shows that based on my past 30 miles of consumption that I have 90 miles left in the battery (shown on the right), and I have 75 miles to go to my destination, then that means I should have a buffer of (90 - 75) = 15 miles in the battery for safety. As I drive, my consumption might go up or down, and the buffer value will correspondingly change. As I hit rain, for example, the buffer value starts to drop because the consumption goes up. If I get uncomfortable with the buffer value, I can slow down.

Essentially, this is a miles representation of the final state of the battery as shown on the energy graph's battery prediction line at the end of the trip, but is more accurate and can therefore help you make micro adjustments to your driving.
Ummmm, this already exists and is displayed in two places on the car's screens:
(1) You refer to the Energy app showing you an estimated projection. In the Model S and X, there are two tabs to that Energy app. Doesn't the Model 3 have this too? The second tab says "Trips". And when you have a route plotted in navigation, it will show a graph of the amount of battery energy declining all along your destination, with a buffer % remaining at arrival there on the right side. That is exactly what you just asked for.

(2) And in the navigation view itself, it displays that buffer remaining % at the bottom of the directions in the Nav window. However, caveat: In Version 9, they F#&@ed this up royally, and I have sent them a message to un-break it. The % remaining will only show when you are in the "whole trip" map view. If you switch it to either of the zoomed in views of "North up" or "Forward up", it hides that % number, which is really stupid.
 

SigNC

Active Member
Aug 23, 2017
1,519
1,358
NC
I'd jus tlike the battery screen to display more details about the battery itself. There's tons of real estate to use for an "advanced" view of the battery if tesla would do it. Temp, heating or cooling status, etc.
 

Potatoee

Member
Jul 21, 2018
31
19
Reading
Honestly anything could be calculated. To avoid the debate what to display, it would be nice to have a selectable "running average" predictor. The owner can then select what to display via driving configuration. Examples would be things like: miles to go based on current driving, miles to go based on ratings, etc. Simply have whatever is selected as a number right beneath the batter indicator and not force the driver to go to the energy/consumption submenus nor have nav enabled.
 

SomeJoe7777

Marginally-Known Member
Mar 28, 2015
2,177
5,645
Houston, TX
Ummmm, this already exists and is displayed in two places on the car's screens:
(1) You refer to the Energy app showing you an estimated projection. In the Model S and X, there are two tabs to that Energy app. Doesn't the Model 3 have this too? The second tab says "Trips". And when you have a route plotted in navigation, it will show a graph of the amount of battery energy declining all along your destination, with a buffer % remaining at arrival there on the right side. That is exactly what you just asked for.

(2) And in the navigation view itself, it displays that buffer remaining % at the bottom of the directions in the Nav window. However, caveat: In Version 9, they F#&@ed this up royally, and I have sent them a message to un-break it. The % remaining will only show when you are in the "whole trip" map view. If you switch it to either of the zoomed in views of "North up" or "Forward up", it hides that % number, which is really stupid.

Those both display battery %, not remaining miles. Also, those values are calculated based on the Nav's energy estimate for the remaining route, without taking into account items like rain or wind that may temporarily increase your energy consumption. Those items are (roughly) reflected in the previous 30 miles consumption graph which the predicted miles remaining is calculated off of. This is why it's more accurate than looking at the battery % remaining on the Trips tab or Nav directions window.
 

ZOMGVTEK

Member
May 19, 2015
559
434
'Merica
They should just ditch the rated miles. Show percent/kWH remaining, and estimated range based on recent consumption. The rated miles display appears to cause a lot of problems.
 

Rocky_H

Well-Known Member
Feb 19, 2015
6,406
7,557
Boise, ID
Those both display battery %, not remaining miles.
Ah, well yes. There isn't a way to change those units.

Also, those values are calculated based on the Nav's energy estimate for the remaining route, without taking into account items like rain or wind that may temporarily increase your energy consumption.
That's not true. You seem to think it is calculated once at the start and then stays unchanged for the next 2-3 hours of driving, despite big changes in rain or wind drastically changing your energy usage as you drive. That is not at all how that works. That remaining % number is continually updated several times per minute the whole time you are driving! So if it starts raining heavily or a big headwind picks up, you will definitely see that remaining % start dropping rapidly in the next couple of minutes as the car notices the current energy use going up much higher and re-projects that out over the rest of the trip.

Those items are (roughly) reflected in the previous 30 miles consumption graph which the predicted miles remaining is calculated off of. This is why it's more accurate than looking at the battery % remaining on the Trips tab or Nav directions window.
They are included in both. So neither is more accurate in that respect.
 

SomeJoe7777

Marginally-Known Member
Mar 28, 2015
2,177
5,645
Houston, TX
That's not true. You seem to think it is calculated once at the start and then stays unchanged for the next 2-3 hours of driving, despite big changes in rain or wind drastically changing your energy usage as you drive. That is not at all how that works. That remaining % number is continually updated several times per minute the whole time you are driving! So if it starts raining heavily or a big headwind picks up, you will definitely see that remaining % start dropping rapidly in the next couple of minutes as the car notices the current energy use going up much higher and re-projects that out over the rest of the trip.

I am well aware that it's not calculated once at the start of the drive and is then unchanged. I am well aware that it updates the final battery level in both of those places. But that update is still not consumption based, it's only based on the Nav's estimate of the trip and the current battery state.

Example: I plot a trip with my starting battery at 80%, and it predicts that I will complete the trip with 20% of battery left. I start driving. Exactly halfway through the trip distance, by the original prediction line, I should be at 50% battery. (Let's assume that on this trip the line is linear -- it isn't always so, due to elevation changes and speed changes, but for the purposes of this discussion let's assume that it is).

OK, so the car originally predicted I should have used 30% of the battery at the halfway point, for a total of (80-30 = 50%) battery remaining. But, due to heavy consumption (for any reason -- rain, wind, etc.), I actually used 35% of the battery so I'm now actually at 45%, not 50%. The extra consumption caused me to use an extra 5% of the battery.

If you go look at the prediction line, it's updated to show that the new prediction is that I will arrive at the destination with 5% less battery than originally predicted, thus 15% remaining, not 20%. But that's inaccurate. The heavier consumption is still not figured into the prediction -- only the fact that I'm starting from this point with 5% less battery. What's really going to happen is that due to heavier consumption, I'm going to use an extra 5% battery on the 2nd half of the trip just like I did on the 1st half, so I'm really going to arrive with 10% battery, not 15%.

You can prove this to yourself by doing this: At the halfway point of the trip, cancel the Nav, then start it again to the same destination. The new prediction will still be what the Nav would predict for a "nominal" drive, not taking into account the past increased consumption. In this example, at the halfway point, it originally has updated the final battery level to 15%, I cancel the trip, start it again, and the final predicted battery level is still 15%, not 10% as it would be if it considered that I'm going through heavier consumption.

The bottom line is that the Nav predictions do not take into account past consumption -- they only predict based on the elevation changes, speed changes, and route (i.e. anything that can be derived from the map).
 

Rocky_H

Well-Known Member
Feb 19, 2015
6,406
7,557
Boise, ID
Maybe we are talking past each other with terminology a little bit.

You can prove this to yourself by doing this: At the halfway point of the trip, cancel the Nav, then start it again to the same destination. The new prediction will still be what the Nav would predict for a "nominal" drive, not taking into account the past increased consumption. In this example, at the halfway point, it originally has updated the final battery level to 15%, I cancel the trip, start it again, and the final predicted battery level is still 15%, not 10% as it would be if it considered that I'm going through heavier consumption.
With this, where you are talking about canceling Nav and starting it again, you want it to internally be looking at the recent past usage to create that initial estimate. And you are right, that it does not do that. It's using more of internal default levels to begin with But...

But that update is still not consumption based, it's only based on the Nav's estimate of the trip and the current battery state.
This is still not true. It is not using past consumption from before you started the Nav route, but it is updating based on the current consumption. As you say, you can prove this to yourself by doing this: while you are navigating and driving, turn the heat on HI. Within a couple of minutes, you will see the energy display show your remaining % at arrival start falling very rapidly. It is recalculating with your new much higher present energy consumption projected out over the rest of the drive.
 

About Us

Formed in 2006, Tesla Motors Club (TMC) was the first independent online Tesla community. Today it remains the largest and most dynamic community of Tesla enthusiasts. Learn more.

Do you value your experience at TMC? Consider becoming a Supporting Member of Tesla Motors Club. As a thank you for your contribution, you'll get nearly no ads in the Community and Groups sections. Additional perks are available depending on the level of contribution. Please visit the Account Upgrades page for more details.


SUPPORT TMC
Top