PG&E Billing/Usage

[aesculus]

the 2nd screen shot is the energy usage details

The odd thing was that I could not see your second graph last night but I can now.

And @bmah may have nailed it. That second meter throws you into a different pool it appears. Others have reported similar issues with visibility once they had to add the generation meter.

 

[aesculus]

I don't think that is true in CA. The peaker plants are natural gas.

Almost all peaker plants everywhere run on natural gas. But they are not as efficient as normal natural gas power plants used in Calif, hence dirtier.

And I think the real concept is if you use others extra solar capacity during off peak then that is even better. In some cases Calif is exporting extra solar off peak at a loss.

It gets kind of complex quickly.

 

[getakey]

This is a known problem. I don't have any electrical data showing in my Usage Details since June 2018. That's about the time that they straightened out my billing from my April 2018 Powerwall PTO. I would be surprised if anyone on "Paired Storage" billing could see the detail on the Usage Details page. You should still be able to download your usage data using the Green Button.

yes, I can download the data
However, that will be a tedious calculation to know where I stand on NEM charges

 

[getakey]

Almost all peaker plants everywhere run on natural gas. But they are not as efficient as normal natural gas power plants used in Calif, hence dirtier.

And I think the real concept is if you use others extra solar capacity during off peak then that is even better. In some cases Calif is exporting extra solar off peak at a loss.

It gets kind of complex quickly.

Yep - PG&E overbuilt. There are some natural gas plants that were built less than 10 years ago that are shut down. We are probably still paying for those in our rates

 

[miimura]

yes, I can download the data
However, that will be a tedious calculation to know where I stand on NEM charges

There is a table for that on your black and white bill.

 

[aesculus]

There is a table for that on your black and white bill.

Just curious. How does your May and June compare to your 2019 bills since you moved over to EVA2?

 

[getakey]

I got that table in my B&W bill for the PW true up in May. However, I'm not getting that in my monthly bill since.

 

[holeydonut]

There is a table for that on your black and white bill.

View attachment 568069

How did you get your April usage down so much while sheltering in place?

 

[miimura]

I got that table in my B&W bill for the PW true up in May. However, I'm not getting that in my monthly bill since.

My black and white bills are all run from the same report format. Page 2 is always the True-Up History Summary. Obviously, the month after your true-up the table will only consist of two rows, the current month and the totals. The only format difference on my bill is that they fit the Solar Generation Eligible For Credit on the same row instead of making another block below it.

 

[miimura]

How did you get your April usage down so much while sheltering in place?

Isn't it obvious? Almost no EV charging. We don't have any gas cars any more.

 

[getakey]

My black and white bills are all run from the same report format. Page 2 is always the True-Up History Summary. Obviously, the month after your true-up the table will only consist of two rows, the current month and the totals. The only format difference on my bill is that they fit the Solar Generation Eligible For Credit on the same row instead of making another block below it.

does the B&W only come in the mail?
The online pdf image does not have that table

 

[holeydonut]

Isn't it obvious? Almost no EV charging. We don't have any gas cars any more.

I guess it wasn't as obvious to me since I don't have an EV haha. So basically EV charging is over 50% of your monthly household energy use once you get an EV? I oversized my solar array by 20% in anticipation of a future EV... but now I think that's not enough to be net neutral. Oh wells.

I saw my home energy use increase by 20% in April due to running the ACs and it's getting hotter out here in East Bay. And in June I hit 950 kWh... whereby PG&E told me my usage was way too high and sent me some nastygrams to try and reduce my energy usage.

 

[miimura]

does the B&W only come in the mail?
The online pdf image does not have that table

You have to dig into the account details to download it.
In the top bar of the Account Summary web page, pull down the box with your account number and click "My Accounts and Services"
On that page, you will see several Service IDs. Find the one that shows the Current Rate = NEMMT
That Service ID should have a pull down box next to a section labeled Download Detail of Bill. Those are the B&W bills.

Could they hide it any better??? Doubtful.

 

[miimura]

I guess it wasn't as obvious to me since I don't have an EV haha. So basically EV charging is over 50% of your monthly household energy use once you get an EV? I oversized my solar array by 20% in anticipation of a future EV... but now I think that's not enough to be net neutral. Oh wells.

I saw my home energy use increase by 20% in April due to running the ACs and it's getting hotter out here in East Bay. And in June I hit 950 kWh... whereby PG&E told me my usage was way too high and sent me some nastygrams to try and reduce my energy usage.

My EV charging is a large majority of my usage that is not covered by solar generation. My solar is small and does not even cover my household kWh consumption. I also live close to the SF Bay, so I don't even have A/C installed in my house. I built the house with everything pre-plumbed and wired for A/C but never installed the outdoor compressor units. I only wish I had it about 10 days a year.

 

[miimura]

Just curious. How does your May and June compare to your 2019 bills since you moved over to EVA2?

It looks like I will not have any negative bill charges this year due to EV2-A while I did have two months with negative billed amounts on EV-A. The net kWh Year over Year is much closer than I expected. However, we were on vacation for two weeks in June 2019 which explains why that one is so low.

While I'm broadcasting my data, I thought Page 3 from the Mid-June to Mid-July billing period was interesting too. Powerwalls have pushed the vast majority of our grid consumption into Off-Peak. Only 2.1% of the grid consumption happened in Part-Peak and no billable usage during Peak. Also interesting that only 9kWh were exported during Off-Peak during this billing period. Remember, Off-Peak goes all the way to 3pm on EV2, so that's the vast majority of my generation. This means that the Powerwalls and house absorbed all but 9kWh of my solar during those hours.

As an aside, according to Enphase, we actually generated 649.6kWh during this billing period while PG&E estimates that we could have generated 800kWh with the equipment in my PTO docs.

 

[shs1]

Yep - PG&E overbuilt. There are some natural gas plants that were built less than 10 years ago that are shut down. We are probably still paying for those in our rates

From what I understand, PG&E does not make their money off of selling or distributing electricity, but rather from building new plants. So it is not surprising that they overbuilt. The question is why were they given permission to do so, given that the shift to renewables was clear and in progress at that time. Building a large plant that is not needed has a significant environmental impact!

 

[getakey]

From what I understand, PG&E does not make their money off of selling or distributing electricity, but rather from building new plants. So it is not surprising that they overbuilt. The question is why were they given permission to do so, given that the shift to renewables was clear and in progress at that time. Building a large plant that is not needed has a significant environmental impact!

The PUC was complicit

 

[holeydonut]

From what I understand, PG&E does not make their money off of selling or distributing electricity, but rather from building new plants. So it is not surprising that they overbuilt. The question is why were they given permission to do so, given that the shift to renewables was clear and in progress at that time. Building a large plant that is not needed has a significant environmental impact!

Wait what - so PG&E got state and federal investment money (likely with mega profit margins baked in) to construct a bunch of excess capacity. And now they pass the inefficiencies of their BS on customers with what amounts to 3x national average per kWh rates? That seems like they're double-dipping by getting profits making the equipment then getting profits paying off the depreciation of the same equipment?

 

[getakey]

this article is several years old

https://www.latimes.com/projects/la-fi-electricity-capacity/

 

[holeydonut]

this article is several years old

https://www.latimes.com/projects/la-fi-electricity-capacity/

Lolol "These are all issues that people are willing to pay for..."

"are willing" should not be confused with "have no choice because it's a monopoly"