PG&E changes 110% of usage rule to 100%

[dareed1]

When applying for NEM, it is necessary to get approval for the output kW of the PV system. This is typically based on previous usage, and the old rule was to not exceed 110% of the previous. One can also ask for additional capacity based on expectation of higher usage. (E.g, for our house, we asked for 8.16kW which projected to 260% of historical usage, but I claimed that we would install a heat pump and so needed the extra capacity. This was approved.)

For houses without a history, one was able to use the square footage time 3.32. That has been reduced to 3 watts/sq. ft.

https://www.pge.com/snemapply/nemLanding/build?execution=e1s1

 

[holeydonut]

Thanks for sharing. I wish they were more consistent in applying that anticipated future demand thing. Telling them I was going from 0 to 1 EV was not accepted

Snippet from your link...

• The “recent annual usage” calculation has been updated to 100% (i.e., NEM or NEM2 systems should be sized with an estimated annual production no larger than 100% of the Customer’s total previous 12 months of usage (annual usage) and projected future increase.)
• Building size factor has been updated to 3.00 (i.e., 2 watts/ sq ft x 1/1,000 watts x 8,760 hrs/yr x 0.171239 solar capacity factor = 3.00; and Building size (sq ft) X 3.00 = (annual kWh))

 

[sorka]

That totally screws customers who charge their Tesla's at home but DIDN'T over the last year because of Covid.

 

[h2ofun]

That totally screws customers who charge their Tesla's at home but DIDN'T over the last year because of Covid.

Yep, they do not want folks to have solar

 

[charlesj]

Yep, they do not want folks to have solar

Why would they. You are competing with them and they lose money on you or don't make as much.

 

[aesculus]

One can also ask for additional capacity based on expectation of higher usage. (E.g, for our house, we asked for 8.16kW which projected to 260% of historical usage, but I claimed that we would install a heat pump and so needed the extra capacity. This was approved.)

This is Tesla's go to procedure on all solar installs I think. They did it on mine even though I could prove otherwise.

And another issue if you try to use your bills is that if you have existing solar your usage will be reduced by that much so it's not very scientific the way they have it set up. Hence the fudge.

 

[Electrph]

Why would they. You are competing with them and they lose money on you or don't make as much.

but wait i thought they wanted us to conserve energy ?!? i'm so confused

 

[charlesj]

but wait i thought they wanted us to conserve energy ?!? i'm so confused

Me too. Our local water system, CalAm a private company from Germany, pushed to conserve water and ended up raising the cost like crazy.
Then, they wanted and got back pay for not billing those rates earlier.

Now we are trying to buy them out.

 

[Tim-in-CA]

Really don’t understand why these rules are in place. If I want to produce a terawatt of electricity, I should be able to. I can understand if they don’t wanna pay for all that you have your energy production, but pretty frustrating that the monopoly is controlling how much people can put on the homes

 

[sorka]

Really don’t understand why these rules are in place. If I want to produce a terawatt of electricity, I should be able to. I can understand if they don’t wanna pay for all that you have your energy production, but pretty frustrating that the monopoly is controlling how much people can put on the homes

You can generate a terrawatt if you want but then then you'll be under a commercial generation rate and will get paid wholesale for your electricity. You'd be better off starting a co-op.

 

[brian.c]

At what point will PG&E approve or deny the system size? I am in the process and waiting for install date. We oversized in anticipation for an EV, and also so we can run the AC more. Hoping to not have an issue but we are sized almost double last year's bills. We have also been in discussion about pool heat pump, and possibly swapping out some gas appliances for electric. They really should just limit how much energy they will pay you for.

 

[dareed1]

I don't know. We signed our purchase agreement with Tesla on Oct 2, they took care of the AHJ permit (approved Oct 22) and the PG&E NEM application. I signed the actual interconnection agreement on Oct 29, so it evidently had been approved by PG&E by then.

 

[Ampster]

Really don’t understand why these rules are in place. If I want to produce a terawatt of electricity, I should be able to. I can understand if they don’t wanna pay for all that you have your energy production, but pretty frustrating that the monopoly is controlling how much people can put on the homes

It is pretty simple. The utilities do not want to pay retail for energy. You can produce all you want. In most places you can get z building permit for lots of solar on your roof. You just can't send all you want to the grid.

 

[hayhayday]

It looks like they reduce the expected generation per cec kw from 1664 to 1500 which is a 10% decrease so doesnt that cancel the change from 110% prior usage to 100%.
before 4kw system x 1664 = 6656 generation / 110% = 6051 required usage prior year
now 4kw system x 1500 = 6000 generation / 100% = 6000 required usage prior year

 

[h2ofun]

I don't know. We signed our purchase agreement with Tesla on Oct 2, they took care of the AHJ permit (approved Oct 22) and the PG&E NEM application. I signed the actual interconnection agreement on Oct 29, so it evidently had been approved by PG&E by then. View attachment 658823

and that was approved? wow

 

[woferry]

and that was approved? wow

Yeah, mine was basically the same (the plan-to-increase-by being >100% the current usage). I suspect they might be more willing to accept this when the current usage is low, mine was also around 5000 kWh/year. I do intend to add AC, and am sure I'll end up with an EV at some point, so my usage will increase significantly once I make either of those changes, it would suck to have been punished just because I did solar before having a year worth of bills with those other changes first.

 

[h2ofun]

Yeah, mine was basically the same (the plan-to-increase-by being >100% the current usage). I suspect they might be more willing to accept this when the current usage is low, mine was also around 5000 kWh/year. I do intend to add AC, and am sure I'll end up with an EV at some point, so my usage will increase significantly once I make either of those changes, it would suck to have been punished just because I did solar before having a year worth of bills with those other changes first.

seems like it is all a game. Some get one thing, other get a different result.

I know I am just going to go for the brass ring. If nothing extra gets approved, glad I have what I have. But if I can get approved for double, will be a stupid way to spend money, but boy would I keep my house warm next winter.

 

[holeydonut]

I don't know. We signed our purchase agreement with Tesla on Oct 2, they took care of the AHJ permit (approved Oct 22) and the PG&E NEM application. I signed the actual interconnection agreement on Oct 29, so it evidently had been approved by PG&E by then. View attachment 658823

Yeah that is total BS that I had to take 1 panel off of my planned install because "oooooo 113% is > 110% you suck". And you can do that proposal and PG&E's like "high fives all around".

I wasn't even posting about how crappy PG&E was back then... since it was the start of my project and I was an ignorant idiot.

I freaking hate PG&E.

 

[aswami]

What happens to people who want to install hot tubs or pools or extra ACs in the future? Or, who want to buy EVs in the future (i.e., EVERYBODY!)?

It's not like you can easily add additional panels in DIY, plug and play mode!

 

[holeydonut]

What happens to people who want to install hot tubs or pools or extra ACs in the future? Or, who want to buy EVs in the future (i.e., EVERYBODY!)?

It's not like you can easily add additional panels in DIY, plug and play mode!

I was told you need to buy them first, take the energy costs on the chin for 12 months, then get solar last.