Don't know if it's been discussed, but TOU-C pricing in the off season is basically the same price all day long (23c off peak, 25c peak pricing under baseline). As a result, Tesla doesn't bother discharging/charging the PW, which is probably great for their longevity with less cycles used. Basically, the PW price arbitrage only applies to peak season (6/1 - 9/30).
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PG&E TOU pricing useless in winter?
- Thread starter Zorg
- Start date
Thanks for the reminder. My solar does not generate much this time of year, 7-8 kWh/day. I have been kind of bummed about it and avoiding checking my bill. But thanks to your message I checked and the rates on my ETOU-B plan are low this time of year. 0.093/kWh off-peak, 0.11215/kWh peak (4-9 PM M-F, excluding holidays).
So while why I still want to use solar and the Powerwall when feasible, there is a lower financial penalty for letting the PW charge to a higher state and pulling from the grid even during the peak. And since this time of year it takes days of good sun to recharge the Powerwall, I can keep the Powerwall reserve higher in case of a long outage.
Tesla needs to make a more easy/logical interface to charge the Powerwalls using the grid in December and January. These overcast days are the pits. I'm basically getting zero solar and the peak time energy consumption from PG&E makes me want to barf.
It's not like the spirit of the federal ITC would be broken if someone charges their batteries in the worst Winter months. They're simply doing their part to load-shift energy consumption away from peak time.
It's not like the spirit of the federal ITC would be broken if someone charges their batteries in the worst Winter months. They're simply doing their part to load-shift energy consumption away from peak time.
I only got 7 KWH TODAY. My batteries have not fully recharged for a while now. Glad I am still connected to PGE since I LOVE having my house 70 degrees!! First winter in 33 years I am not having to wear long underwear everyday
I don't know this for sure, but I assume the load during peak is much lower outside of summer. At least my closeness of the rates and 70% lower peak prices would seem to indicate this.
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long underwear at home? I don't think I ever even wore long underwear on the slope with a blizzard at 2 below zero. But I envy your whopping 7 kWh today, I only got 4 kWh and had to throw everything from solar to the PWs while depending to PGE to power the house, it is a cold day too but thank heaven for HVAC.Tesla app automatically stops load shifting when the delta in prices is less than 10%. That makes sense since the round trip losses are about 10%. When I first had solar installed in 2014, off peak was around 13c a KWh. It's almost doubled in 7 years. At those prices, solar is a no brainer. Today, a Tesla 8.5KW + 1 PW will cost 22K after incentives. That works out to about 10c a KWh over 20 years
ucmndd
Well-Known Member
Timely discussion, I also generated a whopping 6.6 kWh today, socked in thick fog for the last few days. That and some other curiosities had me look up the current EV-A tariff that took effect Dec 1 and I was shocked (pun intended) at how expensive things have become.
$0.566 peak in summer and the off-peak rate is now nearly $0.15. Makes you wanna barf indeed…
$0.566 peak in summer and the off-peak rate is now nearly $0.15. Makes you wanna barf indeed…
I don't expect anyone in this household to deal with "peak time" behavior modification. This means they're cooking, doing the laundry, and running the dishwasher whenever. But it also means I am using peak time energy from PG&E (sad).
I feel like using overnight energy from Diablo, wind, and hydro imports to charge batteries is better than the peak time NG that is still used in the winter months.
I'm waiting for PG&E to advise not turning on the Christmas Tree lights to save energy.
skepticcyclist
Member
Since the overwhelming majority of people in CA have have gas for these appliances, behavior modification doesn't make much difference in utility prices anyway
ucmndd
Well-Known Member
I very much doubt the “overwhelming majority” of Californians have gas ovens, cooktops, and clothes dryers.
Water heater, sure…
All of that is gas in my house. Of course, central heat is the largest energy consumer among all of those. Also gas.
ucmndd
Well-Known Member
From what I can glean through some quick research gas vs. electric stoves are about 50/50. Anecdotally for me clothes dryers seem to be about the same. Lots and lots of non-single-family electric-only housing units in the state, particularly down south where you can get away with electric heat…
charlesj
Active Member
Well, I do have gas dryer and cooktop with electric oven that we try not to use too often so we have a toaster oven, toaster, and that new air cooker for two people now.
Yep, not a very good day here either, 5.2 kWh. Maybe Tuesday if forecast is good.
skepticcyclist
Member
Actually they do. I know we tend to think that what we have or are familiar with is the norm, but it is something like 60%+ have gas for all major appliances and around 80% have gas for at least one. In my neighborhood alone, there is not a single house with major electric appliances. The only 220v breakers were for AC (which was optional at build). Theses 1970-80 built houses don't even have 220 outlets any where in the house
skepticcyclist
Member
And that is the norm in this state. The majority of houses were built pre 1990 and many don't even have 220v outlets for electric appliances
Merrill
Merrill
I have a question for everyone about what you do in winter when your solar is not generating much kW. I have my system on time based and run off the PW from 4 to 9, it usually consumes about 20% of my PW. With no sun I can run for 3 days then I would hit my 30% reserve. My question is do you change your setting or just let it hit your reserve.
Enter the actual $/KWh in your custom TOU plan. If difference is small, Tesla stops the PW load shifting.
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