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Phantom braking is the biggest issue with AutoPilot.

WilliamG

Active Member
Apr 20, 2019
4,116
5,753
Seattle, WA
Disclaminer: HW3 Model 3 owner on 2019.32.2.

So yesterday I took a trip from Seattle WA to Shelton, WA. I used AutoPilot in both directions for around 95% of the trip, and it was *almost* amazing. It's around 90 miles each way.

Two things stood in the way of this awesomeness, and they're issues that have been here for what feels like FAR too long:

1.) Merging-lane veering. Like clockwork, on a wide merge lane the car will veer to the right, and then back to the left, trying to center itself. Since I had a friend behind me in her Model 3, - also on AutoPilot, it was pretty funny to see her car make the same maneuver in my rear-view mirror. As a driver I expect it and am in control - but as a passenger it's NOT fun to experience.

2.) Phantom braking. This is getting to be a bit of a joke. On several occasions on the trip the car made lunging/braking/lunging motions, like it wasn't sure what it was doing - even without any cars in front of me, and clear lane markings. On one occasion it determined an overpass meant slowing to ~50mph from 65mph was necessary, and on the way home a large concrete wall to my left caused a pretty aggressive braking maneuver for absolutely no reason. Again, as a driver who understands these limitations - it's not the end of the world (though it could be if someone was driving too close behind), but as a passenger this can be quite distressing/frustrating.

Anyway, it's a real shame these issues still exist, and there doesn't appear to have been any improvements (in my car anyway) in the 4.5 months I've had it.
 
Jul 28, 2019
490
470
Brandon, Manitoba
The thing that bothers me is the wrong speed limits. In a 50 km/h zone, it displays 100 km/h in one direction and 50 km/h in the other. Same road separated by a boulevard.
Other times in town it displays 80 km/h and the limit is 50 km/h. Have to spin that steering wheel toggle a lot. Really scary taking an off ramp @ 50 km/h when I would slow to 30 km/h although it does take it rather nicely.
Who do I report the poor map speeds to?
Also, has anyone else noticed that Navigation tries to take you 4 - 10 km or more out of the way?
 

WilliamG

Active Member
Apr 20, 2019
4,116
5,753
Seattle, WA
The thing that bothers me is the wrong speed limits. In a 50 km/h zone, it displays 100 km/h in one direction and 50 km/h in the other. Same road separated by a boulevard.
Other times in town it displays 80 km/h and the limit is 50 km/h. Have to spin that steering wheel toggle a lot. Really scary taking an off ramp @ 50 km/h when I would slow to 30 km/h although it does take it rather nicely.
Who do I report the poor map speeds to?
Also, has anyone else noticed that Navigation tries to take you 4 - 10 km or more out of the way?

Different issue. That's just mapping data incorrect.
 
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WilliamG

Active Member
Apr 20, 2019
4,116
5,753
Seattle, WA
Tacoma must have been fun (if you were brave enough to have it on there) :eek:

Yeah it was very dicey through Tacoma. And some of the mapping is incorrect due to the construction, which was another issue. :D

It just takes some time to understand when it is likely to phantom brake. Just be ready to tap the accelerator to cancel braking and move on.

Comments like this make me insane. There's no possible way to know exactly when it's going to. Sometimes it does it and other times it doesn't. If I'm going to have to hover my foot above the accelerator pedal at all times, what's the damn point?
 

ladysbff

Member
Jul 26, 2019
349
616
Traveling the universe
NOAP or AP. Doesn't make a difference in terms of phantom braking, no?

Idk in my experience NOA is worse than AP because of the failed lane changes. If you thought the merging-lane veering was bad, try using NOA and having multiple failed lane changes. It makes Teslas and their drivers look insane! I used to use NOA frequently but one of the updates ruined it for me.

And I am totally guilty of hovering my foot on the acceleration to cover for phantom braking when it happens. Just love TACC and lane keeping too much to quit AP.

Also, TMC needs a plug-in so you can @me next time lol :D:D
 
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jdcollins5

Member
Aug 14, 2018
784
566
Wilmington, NC
Comments like this make me insane. There's no possible way to know exactly when it's going to. Sometimes it does it and other times it doesn't. If I'm going to have to hover my foot above the accelerator pedal at all times, what's the damn point?

How often does this really happen? Very seldom to me. I usually have my foot resting on the console just above the pedal so no big deal. It is just part of paying attention and being ready to take over.

If this is too much trouble then turn the damn thing off.
 

WilliamG

Active Member
Apr 20, 2019
4,116
5,753
Seattle, WA
How often does this really happen? Very seldom to me. I usually have my foot resting on the console just above the pedal so no big deal. It is just part of paying attention and being ready to take over.

If this is too much trouble then turn the damn thing off.

It doesn't happen ALL the time, sure. It happens enough that I'm super apprehensive during the drive. I mean, how often do you crash your car that you feel you need great insurance? Probably not often. But... without great insurance I bet you'd feel antsy...

And it's really nothing to do with paying attention so much as being startled - and again, as a passenger it's really, really not comfortable.
 

ChadS

Last tank of gas: March 2009
Jul 16, 2009
3,365
2,780
Redmond, WA
My wife and I took a 6,500-mile trip at the end of June, and used autopilot most of the way. AP was a great help on the trip and I'm glad we have it; but the OP's two points (merge-lane veering and phantom braking) were indeed both prevalent and annoying.

However, both of our cars got firmware updates around late July, and while the merge-lane veering is still very much there, the phantom braking seems much reduced for us. Still sometimes there (and still annoying) though.
 
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bhzmark

Active Member
Jul 21, 2013
3,669
6,210
Shouldn't have to learn how to manually overcome Auto Pilot deficiencies.

Yes you should. It's quite easy for most. Just like old fashioned cruise control was useful for those who figured out you had to brake so it wouldn't rear end cars in front of you. AP solves that and staying in most well marked lanes, but you have to pay attention to deal with other situations.

Some will not have the ability to do so. Maybe you are in that group.

Comments like this make me insane. There's no possible way to know exactly when it's going to. Sometimes it does it and other times it doesn't. If I'm going to have to hover my foot above the accelerator pedal at all times, what's the damn point?

Seems easy to me. I love to delegate the micro adjustments to accel and steering and pay attention to other things such road conditions that AP will need me take over. But I guess some just dont get it.
 

jdcollins5

Member
Aug 14, 2018
784
566
Wilmington, NC
It doesn't happen ALL the time, sure. It happens enough that I'm super apprehensive during the drive. I mean, how often do you crash your car that you feel you need great insurance? Probably not often. But... without great insurance I bet you'd feel antsy...

And it's really nothing to do with paying attention so much as being startled - and again, as a passenger it's really, really not comfortable.

Once again just turn it off.
 
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aronth5

Long Time Follower
Supporting Member
May 8, 2010
2,838
1,893
Boston Suburb
Drove 3 hours on NoA yesterday in highways near Boston. Works reasonably well until there is lots of traffic especially entering the highway. Hoping that V10 will address some of these.
  1. I don't experience phantom braking very often but as the OP said it still happens and is dangerous
  2. Changing lanes when I'm within a mile of the exit. I always end up canceling the lane change.
  3. Merging-lane veering. This has decreased significantly for me in the last year. Still happens but not as often and not as aggressively
  4. In general If in the middle or high speed lane it works well. It's when your in the right hand lane with a lot of traffic that it struggles with. I generally have to take over when cars are exiting and entering the highway.
  5. Excessive speed when exiting the highway. We have lots of exits close to each other in greater Boston this is especially a pain.
  6. Secondary roads with the 5 MPH limit over the posted speed limit. I understand why Tesla has to do this but it reduces how much I use it.
 

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