Even if the car loses 10 miles/day, that comes out to about 25 cents/day at 0.10/kWh. Less than a dollar per day at high California rates. Yes Tesla should improve on that, and I’m sure they will just as Model S vampire drain was improved over the years, but is it really something to get all worked up about?
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Phantom / Vampire Drain on Model 3
- Thread starter bartlettpsj
- Start date
Daniel in SD
(supervised)
Well some people are seeing 20 miles a day and electricity in San Diego in the second tier (>350kWh a month or so) is 47.5 cents a kWh (starting next year). That works out to $867 a year. Not nothing.
I'm glad I have solar. haha
WileyTheMan
Peanut Gallery Member
Daniel in SD
(supervised)
So when I got home from work I actually clicked Power Off. Car was NOT clanking and whirring like it normally does. I left over night. In 14 hours lost 5 miles. So it is STILL looking like an average of 8 miles a day vampire loss. One important thing is that when I got to the car in the morning it woke up immediately and clearly not deep sleeping -- usually there is a 1-2 second delay when it's sleeping. So the issue is clearly the fact that car doesn't sleep. Only time I remember it really deep sleeping and getting 1 milk drain was after I did a 2 button/brake pedal reset. I will wait a couple of weeks, then get in touch with the service center.
I drive 36 miles a day round trip, so losing about 20% every day is not acceptable. Or if it is then the consumption figures need so revision.
I drive 36 miles a day round trip, so losing about 20% every day is not acceptable. Or if it is then the consumption figures need so revision.
So I reported this to Tesla as 8-10 each day is too much and I ran out of patience. Took a while to get thorough, but eventually and they routed me to next level down the support chain. Tesla support guy from Hawaii called me, looked at my logs. He has asked me to set to % remaining (rather than miles) and keep a record over the weekend and he'll called me Monday to see what the drain was. Actually I already keep a detailed record of everything! I lost 6 miles over night and predict it will probably be another 4-6 before the day is out.
I asked about the sleeping, and whether my car was sleeping. He casually mentioned there have been 1400 sleep events. Sounds a lot for a 6 week old car that is usually driven two or three times a day.
Can we actually get to look at our own logs?
I'll report what Tesla tell me Monday.
I asked about the sleeping, and whether my car was sleeping. He casually mentioned there have been 1400 sleep events. Sounds a lot for a 6 week old car that is usually driven two or three times a day.
Can we actually get to look at our own logs?
I'll report what Tesla tell me Monday.
SageBrush
REJECT Fascism
Waking up every 45 minutes on average
Can Tesla calculate what fraction of the day the car is awake and a typical power draw when not sleeping ?
I went to the service station today, and had a couple recordings of the "banging and whirrs", and was told it is the compressor turning on and off, along with the fan, cooling the battery.
They said they could look at it some more, or I could monitor it some more and have them look at it again if it continues or gets worse. It has been hot in Phoenix, (107 high one day, and probably 5 -10 degrees warmer in my not AC'd garage) and my garage is even hotter, so I guess that is what it could be. I am using the app, "Tezlab" that sends me an email everyday showing the past week of phantom losses, and it is averaging 17 miles per day.
I wish I had pressed them more about it happening every 1-2 minutes, it just seems like that is excessive on and off. I will do that if it continues some more in 1-2 weeks.
I would be very interested what bartlettpsj was told at his service center visit.
They said they could look at it some more, or I could monitor it some more and have them look at it again if it continues or gets worse. It has been hot in Phoenix, (107 high one day, and probably 5 -10 degrees warmer in my not AC'd garage) and my garage is even hotter, so I guess that is what it could be. I am using the app, "Tezlab" that sends me an email everyday showing the past week of phantom losses, and it is averaging 17 miles per day.
I wish I had pressed them more about it happening every 1-2 minutes, it just seems like that is excessive on and off. I will do that if it continues some more in 1-2 weeks.
I would be very interested what bartlettpsj was told at his service center visit.
I'm using Tezlab too. But I cant help but to think its contributing to the issue.
In their FAQ, they say they use your phone for location and to figure out if you're moving or not. If you are moving, then they poll the car to get the car's status (Parked or Driving). So if I'm walking around work all day, I feel as though it is polling the car constantly.
I noticed that since I started using Tezlab, every time I open the Tesla app, I connect to my car and the status updates immediately. Prior to using Tezlab, if I didnt check for a few hours or so, it would always take a bit waking up.
When I first got my car, on 14.7, there was a period of 2 days where I didnt drive the car. During those 2 days, I was losing about 5 miles over a 24 hour period. I'm on 18.1 now and started using Tezlab on Tuesday, but I'm seeing something more like 10-15 miles.
In their FAQ, they say they use your phone for location and to figure out if you're moving or not. If you are moving, then they poll the car to get the car's status (Parked or Driving). So if I'm walking around work all day, I feel as though it is polling the car constantly.
I noticed that since I started using Tezlab, every time I open the Tesla app, I connect to my car and the status updates immediately. Prior to using Tezlab, if I didnt check for a few hours or so, it would always take a bit waking up.
When I first got my car, on 14.7, there was a period of 2 days where I didnt drive the car. During those 2 days, I was losing about 5 miles over a 24 hour period. I'm on 18.1 now and started using Tezlab on Tuesday, but I'm seeing something more like 10-15 miles.
I haven't used Tezlab but with TeslaFi you can get minute-by-minute status so you can see when it sleeps and how much range is lost during a given sleep/idle session. It won't keep your car awake - it has intelligence to back off the polling to allow it to go to sleep and the polling during sleep (to see if it's still sleeping) doesn't wake up the car.
Here's what it recorded for me yesterday where my Model 3 spent the day in an airport parking lot. It woke up for 3+ hours in the afternoon on its own but otherwise slept the whole day. I assume that wake up was Tesla's doing - to download software or upload autopilot data.
Here's what it recorded for me yesterday where my Model 3 spent the day in an airport parking lot. It woke up for 3+ hours in the afternoon on its own but otherwise slept the whole day. I assume that wake up was Tesla's doing - to download software or upload autopilot data.
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This is where I think trying to diagnose the problem is hard (weather, hardware, software, battery SOC, etc...) all seem irrelevant because it seems relatively random because of how and when Tesla is interacting with the car. My assumption is that in the early stages they are collecting a ton of data and this will likely trend down over time. Hence at this point, it is what it is.
Ok - so I spent a few sessions with Tesla and they were monitoring my battery. It has now reduced to about 5mi a day from 10mi a day, and they also provided lots of useful information, which I shall share with you. Maybe it will help with you too...
1- The banging and whirring is something to do with the brakes and is powered by the 12v battery so don't worry about that.
2- The car at around 26/27C - 78/80F, will turn on the HVAC to protect the battery. So if it's hot in your garage this may be happening - even overnight. Surprisingly, here in SD my garage overnight is much hotter than the house. I think he mentioned internal cabin temperature!
3- We ran through a procedure called balancing the battery. The battery pack is split into (at least) 2. This seemed to make a difference. So set the charge limit to 70 or 80%, then fully charge and then just leave for 1-2 hours, so that it works out and tops both batteries to be the same. Personally I supercharged to 80% then immediately went to a charge point and left in there for 2 hours. I think home charging would be better as charge point tries to be too smart and stop.
4- Logs are pulled by Tesla in off hours - probably 5am because my car wakes, according to Tesla, every day at 5am.
5- They kept insisting 1.5-2% is normal/acceptable for Vampire drain --- I don't think it is.
6- Turn off your bluetooth whenever you are in the house -- it stops the car from waking up when you walk past whilst car in garage.
7- I try to park at work where it is cooler. Not in direct sunlight. So the internal cabin temperature doesn't get too high.
1- The banging and whirring is something to do with the brakes and is powered by the 12v battery so don't worry about that.
2- The car at around 26/27C - 78/80F, will turn on the HVAC to protect the battery. So if it's hot in your garage this may be happening - even overnight. Surprisingly, here in SD my garage overnight is much hotter than the house. I think he mentioned internal cabin temperature!
3- We ran through a procedure called balancing the battery. The battery pack is split into (at least) 2. This seemed to make a difference. So set the charge limit to 70 or 80%, then fully charge and then just leave for 1-2 hours, so that it works out and tops both batteries to be the same. Personally I supercharged to 80% then immediately went to a charge point and left in there for 2 hours. I think home charging would be better as charge point tries to be too smart and stop.
4- Logs are pulled by Tesla in off hours - probably 5am because my car wakes, according to Tesla, every day at 5am.
5- They kept insisting 1.5-2% is normal/acceptable for Vampire drain --- I don't think it is.
6- Turn off your bluetooth whenever you are in the house -- it stops the car from waking up when you walk past whilst car in garage.
7- I try to park at work where it is cooler. Not in direct sunlight. So the internal cabin temperature doesn't get too high.
Even more weirdness today - I got Vampire GAIN.
I left car with 251 miles and then 8 hours later, when I finished work it had 253.
But I have also noticed every time I park, even for 15-20 minutes, I return and I have lost another mile.
Beats me - all I know is the vampire is eating 15%+ of my battery either all night or when I do lots of short trips.
I can only guess the Miles remaining Tesla gives out are a rough estimate - and also guess that my car doesn't do 310 mile per charge even if I drive like a granny, unless I drive like a granny on a single run of 310 miles (which is like - never!).
I left car with 251 miles and then 8 hours later, when I finished work it had 253.
But I have also noticed every time I park, even for 15-20 minutes, I return and I have lost another mile.
Beats me - all I know is the vampire is eating 15%+ of my battery either all night or when I do lots of short trips.
I can only guess the Miles remaining Tesla gives out are a rough estimate - and also guess that my car doesn't do 310 mile per charge even if I drive like a granny, unless I drive like a granny on a single run of 310 miles (which is like - never!).
Can you explain your procedure for balancing the battery? I am not understanding based on your description.
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Just set limit on charge screen - eg 70% - charge up to this and then just leave car plugged in charging for a couple more hours.
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