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Plaid 21” rear tire woes - factory defect?

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Wish that I saw this thread earlier. I have the same issue on my 2021 Plaid. I was gradually loosing a little pressure on that tire over a few days, which became adding air every day when I was on a road trip about 300 miles from home. On the trip back, I had to add air midway and panicked thinking I wouldn't make it home. Once home, went straight to the tire store and when he put it up on the rack, I saw this exact same issue on the inside of the driver's side rear tire. Passenger side did not look as bad, and fronts showed uneven wear, but nothing like the rear. Tire store tech claimed a bad factory alignment. I got less than 12,000 miles on this set of tires. Of course, they couldn't find any Pilot Sport 4S tires, and instead installed Pilot Sport All-Season. Hate these tires - they are REALLY noisy, but the car was no longer driveable and I thought these would be close to the OEM tires. Had I known, I might have tried another brand.
 
After seeing what other on this thread have experienced, I wanted to have a close look at the back tires on my 22 MSP so I took off the right rear to have a close look. Sure enough, I'm getting the same wear pattern that everyone else is getting. The car has 5900 miles on it. I'm certain that at this rate the rear tires will be gone at around the 10K point. Image 1690 shows the inside of the tire while 1691 shows the outside of the tire. The outside wear looks normal. The inside wear is very aggressive and no it's not rubbing on anything in the wheel well, I checked thoroughly for this as have others. Since new, the tires have had 36psi in both the rears. Since discovering this wear pattern, I have increased the tire pressure to 46psi (max allowed per the sidewall note is 50psi). It was common for a lot of the Porsche guys to run the Pilot Sports about 4psi low to make the ride a little less harsh. I did this for years in the 911's that I owed with no problems noted on tire wear. (yes I realize the model S is heavier than a 911 so please don't go there). I'm tempted to take the car to an alignment shop to have them check the camber on the rear. Has anyone done this and what have you noticed?

I really don't want to switch out to 19's on the car but if I'm going to have to change out the tires every 10k miles then I might not have a choice. If anyone on here that has experienced this problem and has come up with a definitive solution, please share with the rest of us.
 

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After seeing what other on this thread have experienced, I wanted to have a close look at the back tires on my 22 MSP so I took off the right rear to have a close look. Sure enough, I'm getting the same wear pattern that everyone else is getting. The car has 5900 miles on it. I'm certain that at this rate the rear tires will be gone at around the 10K point. Image 1690 shows the inside of the tire while 1691 shows the outside of the tire. The outside wear looks normal. The inside wear is very aggressive and no it's not rubbing on anything in the wheel well, I checked thoroughly for this as have others. Since new, the tires have had 36psi in both the rears. Since discovering this wear pattern, I have increased the tire pressure to 46psi (max allowed per the sidewall note is 50psi). It was common for a lot of the Porsche guys to run the Pilot Sports about 4psi low to make the ride a little less harsh. I did this for years in the 911's that I owed with no problems noted on tire wear. (yes I realize the model S is heavier than a 911 so please don't go there). I'm tempted to take the car to an alignment shop to have them check the camber on the rear. Has anyone done this and what have you noticed?

I really don't want to switch out to 19's on the car but if I'm going to have to change out the tires every 10k miles then I might not have a choice. If anyone on here that has experienced this problem and has come up with a definitive solution, please share with the rest of us.
Changing rear camber is not possible with OEM suspension links. There are two paths for it - MPP’s currently available dual set of lower links for the rears or N2itive’s yet unreleased upper arm for camber.

I got my camber down to 1.6 on the rears from the 2.X on the OEM links.
 
Adding my pics to this thread even if it's a bit late. I had this issue today and stumbled upon this thread when researching this issue. I made an appointment at the local SC for alignment for what it's worth.
So your alignment was within specifications yet you could have been killed if the tire had blown out due to very peculiar wear/tire delamination.

Very informative pictures.

Thanks.
 
Just got my set of 19 tempest with the Pirelli installed, love the added comfort. Hope that solve that issue.
Funny thing is there were those weird thing in each 21 Michelin tire, anyone knows what this is?View attachment 852175
I thought I heard that Michelin had started putting RFID and/or Bluetooth devices in their tires. (I think the Bluetooth parts was to relay some sound information to the car for sound reduction purposes, but I could be thinking of something else.)
 
I thought I heard that Michelin had started putting RFID and/or Bluetooth devices in their tires. (I think the Bluetooth parts was to relay some sound information to the car for sound reduction purposes, but I could be thinking of something else.)
Cool. Thanks

It's a performance tracker. Not enabled on the Teslas, - at least not yet.

 
My tires also shred on the inner.. Its clear that when one drives under heavy load (I run in sport mode / lowest setting) the car squats and adds a ton of neg camber causing the inner tire to be the main contact point and with 1000hp, it just rips them right up.. From what Im reading it happens around 10k miles (same w me)..

Now Michelin released T2 (Tesla v2) spec Michelin tires instead of the T1's which come on the car for most.. So im wondering if the T2 improved on this issue.

Can anyone who has this issue look on the sidewall and see if its marked T1 or T2? Mine was a T1.
 
I think one of the primary contributors is the wear rating of the tires. I think the OEM pirelli wear ratings on the PZero are 280 or something. With the Michelins PS4 AS, the wear rating is 560.

Folks having the same issue on aftermarket Michelins PS4 AS tires ?
 
Closing in on two weeks now since I filed a formal complaint with Michelin, and still nothing more than a semi-automated reply.

I find this interesting and disappointing.

I'll reach out to them again at the two-week point (Friday) and see where we stand with what very much appears to be a major safety defect in this application of the Michelin Pilot Sport 4S, a problem that's likely going to catch someone unaware when their one of the tires comes apart at high speed, potentially resulting in a major accident.
 
Changing rear camber is not possible with OEM suspension links. There are two paths for it - MPP’s currently available dual set of lower links for the rears or N2itive’s yet unreleased upper arm for camber.

I got my camber down to 1.6 on the rears from the 2.X on the OEM links.
Informative, and also critically important information.

If the rear camber isn't even adjustable on the MS, then there's no "alignment issue" to explain the massive, inner sidewall wear, correct? (Notwithstanding what the Discount Tire reps might say.)

Thus, since I'd posit that less than 3% to 5% of Plaid owners will ever see this thread, the only place left to assign blame for upcoming accidents (from high-speed blowouts) will be Michelin? Or will it be shared with Tesla for their possible failure to the forecast/test probable tire wear patterns with the default "Low" suspension setting at highway speeds (which helps improve range)? (But no one has yet reported a single issue with the OEM/base 19" Pirelli tires on the Plaid so I'm leaning much more toward a Michelin tire defect with these specific Pilot Sport 4S's.)

Here's my thinking as to what may become major legal action(s). We collectively have:

1. An extremely hard to discover failure mode: the inside sidewall of the rear tires, which are visible to the average driver effectively "never."

2. A tire defect that manifests as one or both rear tire sidewall edges wearing until cord is showing, BUT some of which do not "alert" to a potential problem in advance via a slow air leak (or, if they do, the owner just assumes that they've picked up a nail or a screw and just keeps adding air as needed). Even worse: frequent or chronic low pressure use likely exacerbates this latent tire failure mode as the contact patch shifts, there's more sidewall flex, which generates more heat (heat being the enemy of tires), which causes even more sidewall wear, etc.

3. Even at incipient failure, the vast majority of the tire tread appears perfectly normal, thus adding to the "just keep adding air until I have time to deal with this nail/screw/whatever issue later" thinking of the driver.

4. A Model S driver happens to demo the MS's performance potential to a friend and a rear tire comes apart at high speed, initiating a high energy accident as any car can be very difficult for the average driver to control in such conditions.

5. Very bad things result . . . at this point, it sort of feels like the Firestone tire/Ford Explorer fiasco from all those years ago, no?

Just thinking out loud here, but I really wish Michelin would be proactive on this and get all the Pilot Sport "T1" tires off the road STAT.
 
Informative, and also critically important information.

If the rear camber isn't even adjustable on the MS, then there's no "alignment issue" to explain the massive, inner sidewall wear, correct? (Notwithstanding what the Discount Tire reps might say.)

Thus, since I'd posit that less than 3% to 5% of Plaid owners will ever see this thread, the only place left to assign blame for upcoming accidents (from high-speed blowouts) will be Michelin? Or will it be shared with Tesla for their possible failure to the forecast/test probable tire wear patterns with the default "Low" suspension setting at highway speeds (which helps improve range)? (But no one has yet reported a single issue with the OEM/base 19" Pirelli tires on the Plaid so I'm leaning much more toward a Michelin tire defect with these specific Pilot Sport 4S's.)

Here's my thinking as to what may become major legal action(s). We collectively have:

1. An extremely hard to discover failure mode: the inside sidewall of the rear tires, which are visible to the average driver effectively "never."

2. A tire defect that manifests as one or both rear tire sidewall edges wearing until cord is showing, BUT some of which do not "alert" to a potential problem in advance via a slow air leak (or, if they do, the owner just assumes that they've picked up a nail or a screw and just keeps adding air as needed). Even worse: frequent or chronic low pressure use likely exacerbates this latent tire failure mode as the contact patch shifts, there's more sidewall flex, which generates more heat (heat being the enemy of tires), which causes even more sidewall wear, etc.

3. Even at incipient failure, the vast majority of the tire tread appears perfectly normal, thus adding to the "just keep adding air until I have time to deal with this nail/screw/whatever issue later" thinking of the driver.

4. A Model S driver happens to demo the MS's performance potential to a friend and a rear tire comes apart at high speed, initiating a high energy accident as any car can be very difficult for the average driver to control in such conditions.

5. Very bad things result . . . at this point, it sort of feels like the Firestone tire/Ford Explorer fiasco from all those years ago, no?

Just thinking out loud here, but I really wish Michelin would be proactive on this and get all the Pilot Sport "T1" tires off the road STAT.
If Michelin were to test these tires at a more neutral camber, the tires may not exhibit any issues. How is it Michelin’s fault that the camber on the tesla causes if.
 
Im still curious if the T2 version of the Michelin tires solved this.. I thought the Neg camber was adjustable? Perhaps im wrong.. Mine from the factory was -1.7 which is actually the perfect setting, gives the best contact patch for curves.. more than that the rear end turns into an Ice skate.. this is from years of testing different alignments on cars.. I was quite happy w factory rear camber..but with the squat and 1000hp, the inner rear needs to be beefed up..

I did an inspection on my new version T2 tires yesterday and there is a little more wear on the inside (about 3k miles in so far).. so im curious what will happen in the future.. will keep an eye on it..

Again if anyone is having this issue, look on the outside of your factory tires and report if its a T1 or T2 marked tire..

I think the Michelin tires wear rating is around 300.. I absolultley love the Michelin 4S tires for performance and wet traction, so I wont change to another brand.. Also the Michelin Tesla spec (T1 / T2) are designed to handle the heavy load rating this car requires and high pressure ratings (40psi cold is recommended.. I run 43, never dipped below and check often).. I dont know if aftermarket, non tesla spec tires are safe for this car based on the excessive weight requirements..

I once did 165mph with 36psi cold and the rear end became extremely unstable, the tires were warping and vibrating under speed and I had to shut it down immediatley..felt as if I was going to spin off the road.. With 40psi this issue resolved but I run 43 cold now to give additional stiffness to the sidewalls.. So you may not notice an aftermarket tire underperforming until you hit very high speeds when the load ratings show themselves or it was just an underdeflated issue.. eitherway, make sure you always keep your pressures up if you do high speed runs
 
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Wish that I saw this thread earlier. I have the same issue on my 2021 Plaid. I was gradually loosing a little pressure on that tire over a few days, which became adding air every day when I was on a road trip about 300 miles from home. On the trip back, I had to add air midway and panicked thinking I wouldn't make it home. Once home, went straight to the tire store and when he put it up on the rack, I saw this exact same issue on the inside of the driver's side rear tire. Passenger side did not look as bad, and fronts showed uneven wear, but nothing like the rear. Tire store tech claimed a bad factory alignment. I got less than 12,000 miles on this set of tires. Of course, they couldn't find any Pilot Sport 4S tires, and instead installed Pilot Sport All-Season. Hate these tires - they are REALLY noisy, but the car was no longer driveable and I thought these would be close to the OEM tires. Had I known, I might have tried another brand.
You literally described my experience on my 2021 Plaid. I made it to about 13K before the driver's side rear tire started splitting on the inside seam. After keeping it inflated for about 2 weeks, the tire rapidly lost air pressure about 45 mins away from home. Had to stop at every gas station along the way (Connecticut thankfully mandates all gas stations to provide free air pumps). Tire wouldn't hold any air by the time I made it home... currently sitting flat in the driveway but will be taking to a local tire shop to fix tomorrow while I raise a support ticket to Tesla (based on what I've seen from others, I'm not crossing any fingers).

Sucks that these tires can no longer be sourced - what a **** mess
 
I wonder with aftermarket wheels if you change the offsets (for example ET of 35 or smaller so that the tires stick out more) that this inner tire wear would be improved?
I’m at 12k miles on aftermarket 20” rims with a reduced offset (more flush to fenders) and Michelin PS4 AS tires and I have none of these issues.

however As someone else here noted, no one with the OEM 19” wheels has this problem either.

y’all can either fight this with Tesla / Michelin / Pirelli and bounce between them … or just go get new rims and enjoy the rest of the car. Also so many more tire choices in the 19 or 20 wheel size.