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Planning a trip. Confused as to why multiple charging stops.

Gellie

Member
May 27, 2021
132
67
NJ
Planning a trip from NJ to Pittsburg. Trip is roughly ~380 miles. If my YLR gets ~320 miles on a full charge, why does Tesla's trip planner want me to make 2 charging stops? And show upon arrival I will have ~10 miles of charge?
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cpa

Active Member
May 17, 2014
3,271
4,467
Central Valley
The planning assumes you will be leaving at your current state of charge. It is possible that the planner will only require one stop if you leave with close to 100%. (Your picture does not include your current state of charge upon departure.)

It is about 80 miles further to Bellefonte. Apple Maps says it is about 230 miles from Short Hills to Bellefonte. Bellefonte to Pgh is about 145 miles. I did not figure whether toll roads are shorter/faster/better.
 

Gellie

Member
May 27, 2021
132
67
NJ
Because the car actually gets around 225 to 250 miles on a full charge at highway speeds (depending on the speed), and when you stop to charge you don't want to charge to a high state of charge because the more full the battery is the slower it charges.

Keith
Thanks. Is that why the charging times are so short? So the 320 miles us combined street/highway?
 

cpa

Active Member
May 17, 2014
3,271
4,467
Central Valley
Thanks. Is that why the charging times are so short? So the 320 miles us combined street/highway?

In essence, to go from 15% to 60% takes a heckuva lot less time than to go from 35% to 80%. So, the navigation assumes that optimum combined drive/charge time will require stopping when the battery is ~15%, then charge long enough to reach the next sensible Supercharger with again, ~15%.

You can tinker around with your route charging itinerary by starting off from home with 20%, 40%, 60%, 95% states of charge. It is entirely possible that if you leave home, you might make three stops enroute (I don't know that part of the country at all) if you leave home with 20%. It may say to drive 30 miles, charge for 20 minutes, drive 140 miles, charge for 15 minutes, drive 120 miles and charge one last time.

Your Model Y will likely charge at 200+ kW at version 3 Superchargers when your state of charge is at 20% or lower. At version 2 Superchargers, you'll probably start out at 145kW. Those speeds can add roughly 35-45 kWh in as little as a quarter hour. If your wh/mile is around 325, you'll add between 110 and 140 miles of "range", enough to make another Supercharger comfortably.

:)
 
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AquaY

Member
Supporting Member
May 30, 2021
485
1,568
Long Island NY
Thanks. Is that why the charging times are so short? So the 320 miles us combined street/highway?
Besides the slow charge when you have already a high charge I think there's also the recognition that most people hate to wait.
They'd rather stop more for a shorter duration.
I make a round trip from NY to PA of 186 miles each leg.( So 372 miles total)
I charge at home to 80-85% before I leave and stop on the way back at a very nice Super Charger in Rockaway NJ

As to specifically how the range that is posted is calculated I'll leave to others better versed than I.

My rule of thumb is I always discount the range given by at least 20% for my own peace of mind
I like to keep my battery between the recommended 20-90% and only charge to 100% when i need it for a trip. For this trip I do not need it.
 

miracj

2021 Model Y LR AWD
Jul 15, 2021
60
48
Waltham, MA
In addition to the fact that two short charging sessions total time takes less time than 1 longer session, there are other considerations you should make.

Some Supercharger stations charge faster than others, so you may want to skip a charger and use the Type 3 Supercharger (250 kW) instead of a Type 2 Supercharger (150 kW). And one supercharger location may have better amenities you might use, like bathrooms, shopping,, casual dinner etc. If you were planning to be at a Supercharger location longer, that might be the place to do more charge.

You probably don't want to roll into a Supercharger with less than 10% charge (about 30 miles), nor leave with more than 90%, but anywhere between those values are OK. Just minimize the time you spend outside 20% to 80% if possible.

Also bad weather or headwinds or climbing a mountain can reduce your charge usage, so you need to take that into account as well.
 

jcanoe

Active Member
Oct 2, 2020
3,873
3,954
Maryland
Thanks. Is that why the charging times are so short? So the 320 miles us combined street/highway?
Yes, the 326 mile number is the EPA estimated combined city/highway range estimate. This number is only useful for comparing different vehicles, in the case of Tesla vehicles only with other Tesla vehicles. (To approximate the EPA test you would have to drive no faster than 45 MPH without the use of any heat or air conditioning. That's just not the way most EV drivers roll.)

The Tesla trip planner won't steer you wrong. Another useful trip planner is A Better Route Planner (ABRP). You can use ABRP on the web or on your phone. ABRP lets you adjust different variables and observe the impact of changes in things such as speed, wind, road conditions and temperature on charging requirements.
 
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jcanoe

Active Member
Oct 2, 2020
3,873
3,954
Maryland
Thanks for all the response! Pre arrival, how can I tell how many mile I left (roughly) upon destination?
That is one of the things that ABRP does so well. You can specify your departure state of charge (SOC), your desired minimum Supercharger stop SOC and your final destination desired SOC.

A Better Routeplanner
 
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srlawren

Active Member
Aug 3, 2020
1,136
773
Vancouver, BC, Canada, Eh?
Some Supercharger stations charge faster than others, so you may want to skip a charger and use the Type 3 Supercharger (250 kW) instead of a Type 2 Supercharger (150 kW).

@miracj the difference between v2 and v3 in reality really isn't that different (assuming you aren't sharing an A/B stall pair at a V2 SC). The 150 vs 250 is only the peak and you're only getting that peak rate for a very short time under very specific conditions (SoC, preconditioned, etc.) and the rest of the session is very similar between the two.

Here's an example comparison done on a Model 3 which charges similarly/identically to MY:

 

Fourdoor

Active Member
May 31, 2016
1,128
1,033
United States
@miracj the difference between v2 and v3 in reality really isn't that different (assuming you aren't sharing an A/B stall pair at a V2 SC). The 150 vs 250 is only the peak and you're only getting that peak rate for a very short time under very specific conditions (SoC, preconditioned, etc.) and the rest of the session is very similar between the two.

Here's an example comparison done on a Model 3 which charges similarly/identically to MY:

I pointed out in a different thread that the main advantage of V3 is not sharing cabinets, so no matter how busy the Supercharger is, you still get max performance out of the charger... I have only had to share a V2 once, and lucky for me someone left 5 min after I pulled in and I switched to a non-shared cabinet, but for that 5 min I was horrified at how slow I was charging :)

Using his data, if you pull into a V2 supercharger at 10% it will take you 12 min to gain 100 miles of range based on his 70 mph range test efficiency, or 9 min on a V3 supercharger. To gain 200 miles of range would take 30 min on V2 and 20 min on V3.

To gain 100 miles of range if you pull in to the supercharger at 30% SOC would be 16 min on the V2 and 13 min on V3, to gain 200 miles of range would take 48 min on V2 and 43 min on V3. This illustrates how important the starting and ending SOC’s are.

Personally, if I am not doing a “speed run” ( anything 800 miles or less in a day is not a speed run) it is more restful to do a medium length charging stop, they are more relaxing than a 10 min “splash and dash” where I barley have time to take a restroom break. Arriving with 20% and charging up to 80% is not out of the question if I want to walk around for a bit or have a meal. At the speeds I drive this would give me 150 miles range rather than the 200 miles you would get at 70 mph. You are forced to take breaks this long (or longer) when driving a Chevy Bolt… but with the MY I find myself falling into the ICE car mindset, and taking minimal breaks and moving on as fast as I can… you can cover 1000+ miles in a day pretty easy this way but it is not nearly as relaxing. Traveling with my wife I am more likely to do long stops, but if I ever do a solo trip it will be much faster than the same trip would be with my wife.

Later,

Keith

PS: When doing a speed run, with splash and dash charging sessions is when I REALLY miss having restroom facilities right at the chargers rather than them being a 5 or 10 min walk away... especially when traveling with my wife. If I was traveling with a wife and a couple kids and at a station without restrooms right there at the charger (very rare where I live) I can't imagine getting in and out of a charger in less than 20 min no matter how fast it charges.
 
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miracj

2021 Model Y LR AWD
Jul 15, 2021
60
48
Waltham, MA
PS: When doing a speed run, with splash and dash charging sessions is when I REALLY miss having restroom facilities right at the chargers rather than them being a 5 or 10 min walk away... especially when traveling with my wife. If I was traveling with a wife and a couple kids and at a station without restrooms right there at the charger (very rare where I live) I can't imagine getting in and out of a charger in less than 20 min no matter how fast it charges.
For doing a speed charge with others, you should drop them off at the bathrooms. You then go plug-in, and while charging, you walk to the bathrooms. In the meantime, they walk back to the car while you are doing your business, and pick you up outside. That runs a little faster as each person only walks one way.

But the best is to figure what stops you can use that the bathrooms are nearby, the other things you can do while charging (checking emails, etc), and the amount of time you need to rest up and relax as a stress brake.
 

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