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Discussion in 'Model S: User Interface' started by brianman, Dec 1, 2012.
I guess I have a reason to hope my car is delivered with old firmware, after all!
Just killed 2 hours playing with this new information. Didn't change anything (except finally made my rims black like they were suppose to be but came programmed as silver.)
mod note: Edited with OP's permission. b.
I know I do not have the right to post this, but I will anyway.
The screens behind this password are behind a password for a reason. These diagnostic screens contain information that is not meant to be public. These screens are accessible in the car to help our technicians help our customers. They contain information about the car and its systems.
I won't go into all the reasons why I would prefer these screens not be posted here, or anywhere else for that matter, but if anyone reading this owns or works at a business that has information that is not meant for public display, then they will understand my request. If you work at a company with a client list, you would prefer that your client list not be published on the web. If you use any type of proprietary software or hardware, you would prefer not to have the code published on the web. If you have a new technology that you are fighting very hard to bring to market, you'd prefer that all the workings behind your new technology not be published on the web.
I could go on and on, but I will not. I will simply say that what is behind this password is not meant for public display. It is there to allow us to help our customers as quickly and efficiently as possible, and I would respectfully ask that the screens and content of the screens not be posted openly anywhere.
Thanks for your consideration.
You have every right and expectation that the access code information be kept as company information. Unfortunately, curiosity is very powerful. I hope everyone respects your wishes and keeps Tesla proprietary information secret.
I have been in the situation of trying to assist those who have "peeked at", just opened" or "might have changed" proprietary settings on their networks or computers. The technician has no baseline starting point when modifications to expected settings are existing. Anyway, if you want a Service Ranger to get to the problem and fix it quickly my recommendation is to leave the password protected service diagnostic/service data alone...
Sorry if my post started the forum down an apparently uncomfortable road. Wasn't intended. I happened to run across what looked like an interesting place to explore (and perhaps an easter egg) and opted to share out the discovery. You might note that I (and a few others that I talked to privately) were conspicuously shy in following up on the thread. In part it's for the reasons you call out -- some things are best not posted. I even considered asking the mods to close the thread (but leave it alive) so that it just fades from the "new posts" lists and so forth.
I do have one piece of feedback though.
The reason I came across the prompt is because I went looking for two things:
(1) Tire pressure readings.
(2) A way to force the latest update to download.
Please consider including both of these in the future UI.
Regarding #2, I'm fine with having to take a ride to the Tesla store and/or service center to have them tap some magic incantation to begin the download if that's necessary.
As an example, I called the store near me as well as 6 (closed) service centers this weekend trying to make progress on getting the update. Weekend is when I have time to explore the updates and make sure my car is performing well, and that the driver is attuned to the changes. Having little control over the timing of the download is very frustrating.
I realize Tesla is under no obligation to make the download available to all users at the same time, nor is there any prohibition of doing phased rollouts, batches, etc. Nonetheless, if you want delighted customers, it seems like it's very easy to do better here.
Not allowing owners to see the diagnostic information is just nonsense.
I own the factory diagnostic tool for every car I've owned so far, and have full read and write access to all the ECMs. Not having this access in the Model S is another item on my long list of reasons not to get it.
It could be that it's just not diagnostics behind this screen, but also configurable options/settings that actually change the driving dynamics thereby having impact on safety etc. where it could also become a big legal problem for Tesla if someone tweaked these and the car somehow behaved in a way not intended an caused an accident, etc. Who's fault is that? The user's? Tesla's? Joint responsability?
I for one would like access to any and all diagnostic info there is, including tire pressure sensors, detailed battery diagnostic info, energy read-outs/charts etc. etc.
I agree with this I don't need to be able to change settings but I would prefer to be able to look at diag info. Maybe a good solution would be to have a generic pass code that gives a read only access. This code wouldn't have to be widely distributed just to people that are really interested in it.
So say a person that doesn't care to look at it accidently finds the spot for the code they see it and ignore it with out any "scary" data. Myself or other members on this forum will see this and really want to know what is behind that screen, we could easily ask a ranger or another Tesla employee and they can give us a read only code that is impossible to cause any harm.
For me this would be an acceptable level of access that I would not even attempt to figure out a different code whereas with no access I am a bit more curious and prone to dig into it more.
read only please...
I definitely think an advanced read-only mode with items like tire pressure for each tire, battery temp (like the Roadster) would be nice.
That kind of stuff should just be on an advanced user screen. No need to have it locked behind a code.
I agree, that's what I meant to say. It could simply be in the settings or maybe a separate app that contains the information they are willing to share.
Agreed. I don't want to change anything, just see what the numbers are. Tire pressure is particularly important to me. The various temperatures and such are interesting and may help me drive better.
Just proves this car is truly different!
Never mind service access and hidden interfaces, maybe there is certain readout information that could be presented in a skinned 'app' in the future; no doubt functions will be added in updates. Certainly non-revealing info like TPMS, coolant temps, battery readout as a percentage would be nice without the risk of over interpretation. As an owner, the correct analogy is a 'systems monitor' overview capability like a PC or iPhone with just the right amount of info for self-help. But to continue the iPhone analogy, I don't demand to see signal strength in db's to diagnose a dropped call...
Well I was gonna reply to your defragger comment but you pulled it. OT ramble quashed!
Hey, this worked. The car was delivered with the new firmware. I knew Tesla would read that! ;-)
Everyone always says you shouldn't choose an obvious password....
And ummm, didn't you used to work for a computer company? :wink: (Oh man, I just blew my chance of getting any updates with that joke but I still couldn't resist!)
I understand and respect your request, as a user, an erstwhile programmer, and a business owner. I would never do such a thing in the first place. However, there will always be some people out there (a) whose curiosity got the better of them, (b) who changed something but won't admit it, (c) who want that information for unethical reasons, (d) who are or may be in competition with you and seek intelligence, and so on. You will never be able to rely on the good faith of everyone out there.
Therefore you really have no choice but to employ the best security you can to well-and-truly LOCK people out of those screens. I suggest that, at a minimum, you need to combine a Ranger's individual password with a time-synchronized token such as those by RSA. Moving to two-factor security where one item (password) is something the Ranger KNOWS, but the other item (60-second numeric code on token) is something the Ranger HAS, is a very large step up. And it won't be very hard to program into the car's OS. There are other, even more secure, solutions, but this one works and has a very reasonable cost.
And by the way, I'm with the group that would like the user to be able to see more data. EVERYONE should be able to see something like tire pressure (that's basic driving safety info), and some "advanced info system monitor" screen with battery temps or whatever details Tesla is willing to share, should also be available for us geeks who care.