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please help: Front door latch just failed have to drive 400 miles in AM with latch warning beeping!

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#61
Drivin said:
That isn't the point.
The point is that cars in this price bracket don't have a lot of problems for the first several thousand cars of a new release.
There were other changes in the S and all the other high end cars with a major redesign.
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@Drivin - while I always appreciate that you bring the other perspective to a discussion, can you also tell which year did the basic design of cars you quoted like 2014 S class came about? All of the redesigns you mentioned are refinements of previous generations of vehicles that have a well established supply chain.
And though some people may revel bashing Tesla, the parts that have failed are manufactured by suppliers. Designs may have belonged to Tesla and it is likely that the designs need to be refined too. However the key thing is that there is no established supply chain for software controlled door latches. That's a new frontier that Tesla and its suppliers are at and thus you cannot compare their failure rate to an automobile that has gone through several generations.
 
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#62
As a proud Model X owner without any issues yet..., I had an early BMW X5 that was plaque by problems. Aside from leaving me stranded with a bad fuel pump in its first year, I also had the door locks fail and lock me in the car. Every time I tried to open the door locks, they immediately locked again. I had to climb out the window in the parking of a store!! Eventually I got the door locks to work again but I still remember climbing out my window on hot summer day in July in a parking lot with several on-lookers. Heck, even one of my Lexus RX had a gas cap issue and a battery issue it is first 3 months.
 
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#63
xkwizit said:
@Drivin - while I always appreciate that you bring the other perspective to a discussion, can you also tell which year did the basic design of cars you quoted like 2014 S class came about? All of the redesigns you mentioned are refinements of previous generations of vehicles that have a well established supply chain.

That's a new frontier that Tesla and its suppliers are at and thus you cannot compare their failure rate to an automobile that has gone through several generations.
Click to expand...

I am not sure I fully understand your question.
I mention the 2014 S Class since that was a redesign. Of course it was not a brand new car like the X.
The 2016 E Class is also a redesign and IIRC it was after a multibillion dollar investment in a new plant. Again, not a brand new car, but significantly different - both of those lines did not appear that "several thousand initial cars for even legacy car manufacturers come with problems"
Ok. If you don't like those examples, then look at the new 2014 AMG GT-S, LS400, Q45. Lexus IS, the SC - new lines, without significant problems (I am familiar with those new lines, I am sure there are others, and there may be some lemons in the mix somewhere too). but the claim that new lines all have such significant problems just does not ring true - at least for 80k+ cars.

Sure, I can't compare the failure rate of new technologies vs. old technologies. But that isn't the point. A quality manufacturer, customer-focused organization would not put out a product with that high of a failure rate - certainly not for a 80k+ vehicle.

But Tesla is different, or at least they say so and seeing how they viewed putting out the Roadster given its issues, maybe they are different in a way I didn't expect.
 
#64
ohmman said:
I agree. It isn't the point. But it was yours. At least, your examples.

Regardless, it's good to agree with you again.
Click to expand...

Do you disagree with what I said: "The point is that cars in this price bracket don't have a lot of problems for the first several thousand cars of a new release." ?

Or is the point that the point is not the point that I pointed out but rather the point that someone made that I disagreed with as the point?
 
#65
Drivin said:
I am not sure I fully understand your question.
I mention the 2014 S Class since that was a redesign. Of course it was not a brand new car like the X.
The 2016 E Class is also a redesign and IIRC it was after a multibillion dollar investment in a new plant. Again, not a brand new car, but significantly different - both of those lines did not appear that "several thousand initial cars for even legacy car manufacturers come with problems"
Ok. If you don't like those examples, then look at the new 2014 AMG GT-S, LS400, Q45. Lexus IS, the SC - new lines, without significant problems (I am familiar with those new lines, I am sure there are others, and there may be some lemons in the mix somewhere too). but the claim that new lines all have such significant problems just does not ring true - at least for 80k+ cars.

Sure, I can't compare the failure rate of new technologies vs. old technologies. But that is a distraction from the real issue. A quality manufacturer, customer-focused organization would not put out a product with that high of a failure rate - certainly not for a 80k+ vehicle.

But Tesla is different, or at least they say so and seeing how they viewed putting out the Roadster given its issues, maybe they are different in a way I didn't expect.
Click to expand...
 
#66
Drivin said:
Do you disagree with what I said: "The point is that cars in this price bracket don't have a lot of problems for the first several thousand cars of a new release." ?

Or is the point that the point is not the point that I pointed out but rather the point that someone made that I disagreed with as the point?
Click to expand...
As I mentioned, I agree. It's always nice to agree with you.
 
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#67
Drivin said:
I am not sure I fully understand your question.
I mention the 2014 S Class since that was a redesign. Of course it was not a brand new car like the X.
The 2016 E Class is also a redesign and IIRC it was after a multibillion dollar investment in a new plant. Again, not a brand new car, but significantly different - both of those lines did not appear that "several thousand initial cars for even legacy car manufacturers come with problems"
Ok. If you don't like those examples, then look at the new 2014 AMG GT-S, LS400, Q45. Lexus IS, the SC - new lines, without significant problems (I am familiar with those new lines, I am sure there are others, and there may be some lemons in the mix somewhere too). but the claim that new lines all have such significant problems just does not ring true - at least for 80k+ cars.

Sure, I can't compare the failure rate of new technologies vs. old technologies. But that isn't the point. A quality manufacturer, customer-focused organization would not put out a product with that high of a failure rate - certainly not for a 80k+ vehicle.

But Tesla is different, or at least they say so and seeing how they viewed putting out the Roadster given its issues, maybe they are different in a way I didn't expect.
Click to expand...
@Drivin - I think the difference of opinion we are having is that I see all of the traditional cars as pretty much the same basic design. They really did not innovate the doors for example. And thus there are established supply chains for parts that have produced those parts for decades. It's like the door hinge on the doors in your house - having a Kevo lock on the door is not world shattering. The hinge is still the same.
With Model X, they changed the latch design at core and there isn't an established supply chain that has had years of experience manufacturing that design. And that's what you're missing seeing when comparing the other cars to Model X.

And you have probably by now seen other posts of X5 problems too. And a lot of corvettes also had issues. It is infact common for high end exclusive cars to have issues because of the complex design. You aren't going to see faults in mass produced geo prizms.
And as to your comment on customer focused there isn't another car manufacturer in the US that even comes close to the customer care Tesla provides. It didn't need CR to write up or a long court case for them to voluntarily do all the recalls they have done in their entire history of producing cars.
 
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#68
Drivin said:
Do you disagree with what I said: "The point is that cars in this price bracket don't have a lot of problems for the first several thousand cars of a new release." ?

Or is the point that the point is not the point that I pointed out but rather the point that someone made that I disagreed with as the point?
Click to expand...

Cars in that price bracket don't accelerate as fast, are not as smooth, easily tip-over, don't have all around 5 star safety rating, will not open doors for you, will not drive themselves w/o beeping, seat 7 with baby seats installed, have >100 buttons, cannot be updated OTA and need gas.

Plus Model X has less issues with door handles than Model S used to have:) I'm curious if all latches come from the same supplier. If you recall X mules had FWd latch issue that kept them from alignment, rear seats were recalled due to latch issue and some front doors apparently had their latches replaced as well.
 
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#69
Update:
First off I'll start by saying that Tesla went above and beyond in their customer service in both handling the logistics of my rental, my towing and prepping a Model S loaner in case the car needed to stay with them.
The car just arrived in the Decatur service center and within 5 minutes of their MX expert analyzing and popping off the hood to do some hard resets (technician reset not the ones we can do on steering wheel or 17" display) they were able to bring the door back to life. They assured me it was not a latch issue and there is no need to replace it or the driver latch as a precaution as I had inquired.

They said it is a firmware issue and Tesla engineers are working on improving these over the next several updates (pretty much what Elon said during the shareholders meeting).

They are now detailing my X and I'll be on my way. As I wait here in the owners lounge, I walked over and hopped in a showroom S.
#Claustrophobic
;-)

The S is such a sexy beast and I still love the auto present handles as I approached it, but I'm excited I'll be taking My X back home here shortly.

As of right now, the X feels far more luxurious and comfortable when your inside compared to the S!
 
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#75
xkwizit said:
as it was your own decision to get the car earlier.
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One thing I've learned in the last few years is that this is no consolation when you feel deceived. No one expects and can be prepared for a brand new car to have such a failure. In OP's case, he even thought his production date suggested that his was built after the first perfect X rolled out of the line (Apr 29).

While it is true a lot of us did commit the order knowing the initial issues and knowing ours could also suffer those issues, it is everyone's right to vent their frustration when issues happen to them. If all of us kept quiet putting up with all the problems, Tesla wont know there are some serious problems to fix. I am glad Tesla agreed to give pj a rental and tow his X back to SC.

Some like ModelXBoy and pjjava are a lot more patient than others (including me). Mine had some alignment issues at delivery. Scouring the forums for few months before delivery helped me mentally prepare for such imperfections that I took them lightly at delivery. Tesla though promptly scheduled a service appointment to take care of them.
 
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#77
digicool said:
One thing I've learned in the last few years is that this is no consolation when you feel deceived. No one expects and can be prepared for a brand new car to have such a failure. In OP's case, he even thought his production date suggested that his was built after the first perfect X rolled out of the line (Apr 29).

While it is true a lot of us did commit the order knowing the initial issues and knowing ours could also suffer those issues, it is everyone's right to vent their frustration when issues happen to them. If all of us kept quiet putting up with all the problems, Tesla wont know there are some serious problems to fix. I am glad Tesla agreed to give pj a rental and tow his X back to SC.

Some like ModelXBoy and pjjava are a lot more patient than others (including me). Mine had some alignment issues at delivery. Scouring the forums for few months before delivery helped me mentally prepare for such imperfections that I took them lightly at delivery. Tesla though promptly scheduled a service appointment to take care of them.
Click to expand...
@digicool - of course it's ok to vent. And I empathize with the OP as he felt let down and faced embarrassment and inconvenience in addition to a trip spoilt.

However, I disagree with you that TM would use the temperature of the forums to gauge severity of an issue. I would expect TM to rely on reports from the SCs on severity and frequency of an issue not unreliable fan forum posts.
 
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