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SteelClouds

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Nov 12, 2021
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I have a Y on order for my wife but we went out this weekend and looked at a Polestar 2. Impressive car on the surface. Super build quality, fit, finish etc. But, my wife and I got into and within 30 seconds, went "nope, nope, nope".. very tight cockpit design and the massive center console is a complete turn off to us. I will say we are probably spoiled now after having a Model 3 all this time. But we both noticed things like the chunky user interface, there is a "drive line" hump between the rear seats on the floor? what the heck is that? the rear seats were tight.. even for the two of us at 5-8 each.. My observation was that the Polestar is a ICE car with two electric motors wedged into it. Is that bad? Not really.. if you want the refined and luxury car feel, it fits the bill nicely. In some ways, better than BMW and some of the others. But it's not a Tesla.. doesn't have the range even with the extended range pack and doesn't have the software or tech. We decided to stay with the Y order for now. But we are still poking around at the newest crop of EVs. Its very interesting to see where the market is going for EVs. I hope Tesla takes a few lessons of their competition to heart in the coming year or two. I will add the neither of us were interested at all in the ID4.. the interior just didnt measure up to the price tag.

Any other suggestions for a competitor to the Y?
 
I have a Y on order for my wife but we went out this weekend and looked at a Polestar 2. Impressive car on the surface. Super build quality, fit, finish etc. But, my wife and I got into and within 30 seconds, went "nope, nope, nope".. very tight cockpit design and the massive center console is a complete turn off to us. I will say we are probably spoiled now after having a Model 3 all this time. But we both noticed things like the chunky user interface, there is a "drive line" hump between the rear seats on the floor? what the heck is that? the rear seats were tight.. even for the two of us at 5-8 each.. My observation was that the Polestar is a ICE car with two electric motors wedged into it. Is that bad? Not really.. if you want the refined and luxury car feel, it fits the bill nicely. In some ways, better than BMW and some of the others. But it's not a Tesla.. doesn't have the range even with the extended range pack and doesn't have the software or tech. We decided to stay with the Y order for now. But we are still poking around at the newest crop of EVs. Its very interesting to see where the market is going for EVs. I hope Tesla takes a few lessons of their competition to heart in the coming year or two. I will add the neither of us were interested at all in the ID4.. the interior just didnt measure up to the price tag.

Any other suggestions for a competitor to the Y?
Have you checked out the Volvo C40? It's basically the same car as the Polestar 2 (at least its underpinnings), but looks much different inside and out. That's what we ended up getting for my wife. In our case the C40 works well because the range is plenty for my wife's use case (typically around 60 miles per weekday for work - all family driving on weekday goes on my MYP) and she likes the styling. When she decided to go with an EV, we both agreed that we didn't want two of the same cars, so that eliminated the MY or M3. While I love my MYP, I think the C40 is a great car and I do enjoy driving it on weekends. The infotainment in the Volvo is currently a bit half baked, but Apple Car Play and Android Auto is supposed to be added via OTA sometime this year, and I actually think it works fine right now and do see potential of it being an excellent system once it's fully fleshed out.

Other more typical competitors for the MY are the Kia EV6, Hyundai Ioniq5, Audi Q4 e-tron (not sure when available in USA), Ford Mach-E. All of these are bigger than the C40/XC40 so if space is a consideration then perhaps these will suit you better, along with the MY.
 

thesmokingman

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Jun 21, 2021
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Any other suggestions for a competitor to the Y?
There really isn't anything that is on the same level efficiency wise. To me it comes down to how much you are willing to give up to drive something that's not a Tesla. For ex... video below section linked gets into detail charging vs range vs time vs efficiency, etc. Note that the Tesla could have charged sooner and been back on the road sooner had they not forced it be at the same level as the 5.

 
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tm1v2

Active Member
Oct 18, 2021
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USA
@SteelClouds The Polestar 2 is Model 3 size, actually a little shorter. Not what you want if you're Model Y shopping. I think the Polestar 3 is going to be significantly larger, and a crossover.

The big center tunnel is where the P2's batteries are. Upside is the back seat is much higher off the floor and more comfortable than a Model 3, because there's no battery under your feel. The skateboard layout of a Model 3 results in kness-in-the-face for adults in the back, it's fine for short trips, but would be intolerable for long ones for me. (Model S back seat is slightly better but still suffers the same issue from the same skateboard layout.)

Model Y is way bigger and more comfortable inside than Polestar 2 or Model 3. Skateboard layout + crossover height gives that. But the Y's driving dynamics suffer for it vs Model 3 or Polestar 2...either of those is much more satisfying to drive, in my opinion. Need to pick your priorities.

Polestar 2's range is its weakest point in my book. Barely competes with our 9+ year old Model S. More than anything that was the deal breaker for us. We wanted more range, and got it with a Model 3.
 

SteelClouds

Member
Supporting Member
Nov 12, 2021
353
505
CA
Polestar 2's range is its weakest point in my book. Barely competes with our 9+ year old Model S. More than anything that was the deal breaker for us. We wanted more range, and got it with a Model 3.
Yeah,... I'm putting a reservation in for the new Caddie Lyriq.. they are aiming squarely at Tesla. Good range.. good appointments.. 100 bucks to hold it.. I'll gamble that in order to see what I think when I can touch one.
 
Polestar 2's range is its weakest point in my book. Barely competes with our 9+ year old Model S. More than anything that was the deal breaker for us. We wanted more range, and got it with a Model 3.

The Polestar 2 does not have that good electricity economy, which obviously affects range. Comparison with a 2013 Model S 85 and a 2022 Model 3 LR:

It has a battery with almost as much capacity as the Model 3 LR, but its worse economy gives it a range similar to a Model 3 RWD.
 

tm1v2

Active Member
Oct 18, 2021
2,034
1,680
USA
Volvo and Polestar are falling behind on infotainment. 9” screen on Volvo C40 and 10” screen on Polestar 2 just isn’t big enough.

Even though they run Android I find it shocking how many apps are missing like YouTube.
@Ritzcarlton123 Ehh I sort of agree, but the 3/Y interface makes terrible use of its screen size. The 15" 3/Y single display should be a decent size, but it feels very small and constrained compared to my Model S because so much space is wasted on the mandatory AP/FSD visualizations.

The P2 center display is smaller than 3/Y but makes better use of the space, and the P2 has a driver's display, so overall it matches up well to the 3/Y in that regard.

I don't miss having a driver's display, at all, but I absolutely miss having efficient use of the center display (compared to my 2013 S).
 
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jjrandorin

Moderator, Model 3, Tesla Energy Forums
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Nov 28, 2018
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To me it comes down to how much you are willing to give up to drive something that's not a Tesla.

Thats pretty much what it boils down to, to me as well. There are alternatives, but it always seems like a choice "in spite of".

I just took a look at the Lyric that the OP put a down payment on, because I think that vehicle looks nice, at least in the commercials. The RWD version has a rated range of like 312, but with a 100kW battery... and thats in the RWD guise with 360-370hp.

They dont have a range estimate for the AWD version, that has more horsepower, but that vehicle has the same size battery, so I doubt its "more". I guess they are figuring their target market will not care about the relative lack of efficiency there. I am sure it will feel more luxury appointed. Caddy has made some really good cars in recent years, but I dont think many bought them with the exception of their luxobarge Escalades.

The most promising ones seem to be the Ioniq and EV 6. I like Hyunidai cars (I bought an elantra new for my daughter for a college car in 2015, and its still going strong with no real issues). With that being said, I definitely would lease one of those before I bought it, just because I am expecting all of these manufacturers to have teething pains on these new EVs.

There is some stuff about tesla that annoys me (some more than others), but the total package is pretty darn good. We are super happy with my wifes 2022 Model Y, she is still grinning about it when she gets in it to drive it, and thats coming from an 2019 X3 M40 that we custom ordered with basically every option that was her previous car.

Most of the other options out there currently seem to be what you said, "how much you are willing to give up" (or wait). Rivian has vehicles that are very different, and interested me, but they feel like another tesla in that they will struggle to "make it" so will see how that goes.
 
I just took a look at the Lyric that the OP put a down payment on, because I think that vehicle looks nice, at least in the commercials. The RWD version has a rated range of like 312, but with a 100kW battery... and thats in the RWD guise with 360-370hp.

They dont have a range estimate for the AWD version, that has more horsepower, but that vehicle has the same size battery, so I doubt its "more". I guess they are figuring their target market will not care about the relative lack of efficiency there.
Seems curious that many companies are not trying to squeeze every bit of electricity economy out of their EVs, when improved electricity economy give improved range, an important number for many potential EV buyers.
 

thesmokingman

Active Member
Jun 21, 2021
2,816
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Socal
Seems curious that many companies are not trying to squeeze every bit of electricity economy out of their EVs, when improved electricity economy give improved range, an important number for many potential EV buyers.
Curious? No, they simply cannot compete at this time. Just look at what the Plaid can do. The next fastest EV is a Formula E car. The only thing faster is a 2 million dollar Rimac Nevera. It's not just Tesla's battery tech ya know...?
 

SteelClouds

Member
Supporting Member
Nov 12, 2021
353
505
CA
Seems curious that many companies are not trying to squeeze every bit of electricity economy out of their EVs, when improved electricity economy give improved range, an important number for many potential EV buyers.
Making something work is easy.. making it work efficiently is harder. My Pacifica Hybrid has roughly the same usable pack capacity as my i3.. but the i3 has over twice the range. Some of that is just sheer weight but the pac could have been optimized much better than what it was.

Lucid made a big deal about their range being in large part to obsessive attention to efficiency instead of making mega packs. Motors tires, bearings, aerodynamics etc.. all play a big role in how well or how poorly a car works as an EV. Stuff that an ICE car could skate on counts now..
 
I’ve been tempted by the P2. My 3 is nearing the 4 yr mark and resell values are crazy. I have a new 3 on order but who knows when it will come in. There are some things I like about the P2 but it’s just a little off. It does have s hatchback, great power, good styling for me, the tax credit, and it’s now a lot more rare, Downside is the inefficiency, wasted center console space, sparse dealers, It’s solidly 4K overpriced, etc…. Still I might go there one day.
 
I am driving a single motor P2 with no options, it will be just over $35K when I get the rebate and tax credit. With the recent price increase, it would now be over 38K. That is a bargain for this car and I fully expect to get that and more back when I sell it. I plan to drive it till my Y comes in. So far the car has been great.

My girlfriend has the M3 so I have both to compare. I love the second display, the android auto and it handles well. It certainly is not as fast as the dual motor M3, but I find it is plenty fast. Actually faster than my Lexus IS300 for sure.

The two displays are nice as are the extra knobs and switches. The car handles very well and I have no rattles to speak of. I am thrilled I am able to be driving an EV in this crazy gas crisis. Especially with our new Telsa Solar system.

If I were to buy one I would get the Pilot package for sure as the base version does not have adaptive cruise, it does have radar and accident avoidance. It also gives you notice when the car in front of you takes off if you are distracted at a stoplight. The car also features a hands-free trunk opener. I am 6'2" and I feel very comfortable driving the car.
 
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I recently visited a Polestar showroom and sat in one. I thought that while the front seats are pretty nice, the rear was cramped. I'm not particularly tall, but my head was pressed against the roof if I leaned back. I also thought that having a giant hump in the middle didn't make any sense and made it feel even more cramped.

If you want things like AWD, leather seats and a panoramic roof, the car becomes over 60k. At that price point, I think that many other EVs are more compelling.
 
Our 2022 Polestar 2 with Performance Pack, Plus Pack, Pilot Pack, and Nappa Leather is as good and in some ways much better than our 2017 Model S 75D. Not trying to poke the bear, though I think the Polestar 2 does deserve some credit.

Pros
-The UI is excellent. Essentially the best we have used next to Tesla.
-The steering, suspension, and overall handling is superior to the Teslas I have driven: S, X, YP. 3P.
-Headlights are outstanding and really contrast with how terrible our Model S headlights are.
-Range is superior to our S and is not as optimistic.
-Charge Rate/time is equivalent if not superior due to lower use at CCS charging stations; not sharing power.
-Styling is form follows function.
-Acceleration is equivalent if not superior to our S.
-Excellent NCAP safety ratings, certainly exceed our Model S, and likely equivalent, possibly superior to 3 and Y. Volvo and Polestar utilize an offensive strategy for SORB, getting the vehicle away from the impact and not twisting the broadside into oncoming traffic.
-Awesome leather seats with ventilation.
-Heated Steering Wheel actually gets hot and stays hot. Three levels of heat to choose from.
-Excellent friction brakes and ability to choose almost no regen, light regen, or standard regen.
-Pilot works great and could definitely save you from a terrible accident.
-$7,500.00 Federal Tax Credit eligible.
-It has well placed grab handles.
-Rear Seats have a center armrest and are not uncomfortable after 10 minutes like Model S rear seats.
-Super fun to drive.
-Battery preconditions with route planning to charging stops. Google based system works exceptionally well even with iPhone.
-Utilizes buttons and knobs where you want them.
-Has HVAC louvers that can be adjusted by hand.

Cons
-Yes, the Polestar 2 is a 2022 and the Model S is a 2017.
-Polestar App needs much improvement to emulate Tesla though it has made some big improvements such as showing vehicle location. Still needs to be able to set charge limit, etc.
-No Sentry Mode or DashCam unless you purchase aftermarket.
-Currently only one EV model to choose from.
-Very large center console with only one cup holder unless you open the console lid.
-Pilot is not as good as FSD in terms of lane-centering/changes.
-FWD model is dumb, really need the AWD (dual motor) with all available packs to really enjoy the car IMHO.
-Turtle Mode is dangerously underpowered (around 5-7% SOC).
-Too much piano black plastic in high-touch areas,
 
I have a Y on order for my wife but we went out this weekend and looked at a Polestar 2. Impressive car on the surface. Super build quality, fit, finish etc. But, my wife and I got into and within 30 seconds, went "nope, nope, nope".. very tight cockpit design and the massive center console is a complete turn off to us. I will say we are probably spoiled now after having a Model 3 all this time. But we both noticed things like the chunky user interface, there is a "drive line" hump between the rear seats on the floor? what the heck is that? the rear seats were tight.. even for the two of us at 5-8 each.. My observation was that the Polestar is a ICE car with two electric motors wedged into it. Is that bad? Not really.. if you want the refined and luxury car feel, it fits the bill nicely. In some ways, better than BMW and some of the others. But it's not a Tesla.. doesn't have the range even with the extended range pack and doesn't have the software or tech. We decided to stay with the Y order for now. But we are still poking around at the newest crop of EVs. Its very interesting to see where the market is going for EVs. I hope Tesla takes a few lessons of their competition to heart in the coming year or two. I will add the neither of us were interested at all in the ID4.. the interior just didnt measure up to the price tag.

Any other suggestions for a competitor to the Y?
The Polestar 2 has a "hump" because it's the CMA platform used by Volvo/Polestar for the XC40/C40 ICE, PHEV, EV models. Our Taycan also has hump because Porsche chose to make "foot garages" as Lucid and many ICE manufactures always have because it is uncomfortable to lift the knees towards the chest of the sitting rear passenger, especially without thigh support. Porsche uses the "hump" for batteries and BMS as their platform is not shared with ICE/PHEV models.

Having a flat floor is really not a big deal to me especially after spending hours in the rear seat of our Model S and realizing how uncomfortable it can be. Tesla has done and is doing some truly amazing things while setting a high bar for EVs, however, as a company they are really missing many of the "needs" a good car should have, such as comfort, good headlights and brakes (Model S refresh) and writing those needs off as their design minimalism.

Polestar has a long way to go, then again so does Tesla.
 
my wife and I got into and within 30 seconds, went "nope, nope, nope".. very tight cockpit design and the massive center console is a complete turn off to us.
We also test drove a Polestar2 as a possible replacement for our 2012 Nissan LEAF, and we excluded it for exactly the same reasons. We really liked the vehicle a great deal and most of its shortcomings were not issues for us. But this one was. It was like driving, and for the front passenger sitting, in a military jet cockpit…so cramped, nowhere to move your legs etc. because of the unnecessarily (in our opinions) huge console widening as it joins the dash. For us this was a “what were they thinking” moment. Very much looking forward to the Polestar3 CUV though with hopes for a less confining front seating area.

For alternatives to the Polestar2 and MY, we’ve also tested the Ioniq5 Limited and really like it, so much so that if we could actually get one we would…but apparently we cannot. Hyundai for whatever reason is not taking factory orders in the US as they are in Europe so best you can do is get on a dealership waitlist. Worse, dealers are getting very limited allocations; one blog preferred a recent shipload from South Korea contained 135 Ioniq5’s for the entire US. So next up is the Genesis (Hyundai) GV60 sedan with information just starting to trickle in with possible realistic availability in mid- to late 2023. Also on the horizon is the all-electric GV70 CUV but more likely a 2024 availability. We’ve also considered a new LEAF and the supposedly upcoming Ariya but we’re a bit gun-shy on these after our 2012 LEAF and it’s horrible battery capacity life. We may have to get over that though.
 

SteelClouds

Member
Supporting Member
Nov 12, 2021
353
505
CA
For alternatives to the Polestar2 and MY,
I put a reservation in for a 2023 Cad Lyriq. I am NOT a GM man.. have not been for years and years. The last few I have tried have been rolling disasters. But, this is looking good and since GM is betting the bank on it to a large degree, I have hopes that they have put in the homework to make it right. I won't know for sure till I can actually sit in one. Meanwhile, the Y is still on order
 
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