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Politics proposal

Discussion in 'Site Feedback' started by brianman, Jan 29, 2014.

  1. brianman

    brianman Burrito Founder

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    I think the Politics quarantine thread has been useful but has taken on too much "black hole" ness. While I agree taking threads off topic warrants some moderator activity, there are legitimate topics worthy of discussion.

    One of them was the discussion about the SOTU speech last night. What looked like an interesting discussion was very quickly banished to the Quarantine thread.

    Perhaps we're due for a Politics subforum (of the Energy forum?) with a(t least 2) moderators that are interested in such discussion. I suggest multiple moderators to hopefully address the natural bias that any individual moderator will likely have w/r/t to political leanings.

    Just a thought.

    So let me get more concrete on the proposal:
    1. create a Politics subforum (PS) somewhere
    2. move the Quarantine thread to the PS
    3. move the 2014 SOTU discussion from the Quarantine thread to its own thread in PS
    4. (consider) move the Unions discussion to PS
    5. designate moderators for PS
    6. (recommend) moderators of PS have a designation in their profile and/or signature that indicates this deputized role
    7. for a period of 1 month, anything remotely off-topic in designated threads of PS is briskly moved to the Quarantine thread
    8. after 1 month, normal "off-topic" moderation applies to moving posts out of designated threads into the Quarantine thread

    I think we're missing out on some useful discussions because of the current model. This is just one proposal to try out.

    Sidenote: I'm sure there are several threads of discussion embedded in the Quarantine thread. If the new PS moderators are willing, it would be an interesting (though likely time consuming) exercise to attempt to tease out threads of discussion from Quarantine into designated threads. It could be a great way to "warm up" to the moderation role.
     
  2. SeminoleFSU

    SeminoleFSU Member

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    Agreed. I had a post moved for saying you can't trust mainstream media. My comment was on topic, I didn't attack anyone and wasn't being argumentative, etc. Jusy making a statement of fact that is easily proven 100's of times over. Pretty lame actually
     
  3. bonnie

    bonnie Oil is for sissies.

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    It seems like a reasonable request, but honestly, it usually takes <4 posts for things to get nasty even after a seemingly innocent comment like yours, Seminole. There are forums for political discussions. TMC doesn't have a quilting subforum either. We have had discussions about the impact of things like government shutdown over on the investment section, and every 5th post or so had to go to quarantine, because people just couldn't help placing blame. We kept reiterating it was about impact.

    Way too much work for the moderators. My opinion, fwiw.
     
  4. Doug_G

    Doug_G Lead Moderator

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    A great example of what Bonnie mentioned is the activity today on the Fox News video thread. I was actually surprised how long it lasted before the first personal attack. At that point I asked people to stop, and when they didn't I banished the whole thread to the quarantine.

    Ideally people should be able to discuss the issues as reasonable adults, but unfortunately things are so polarized these days it quickly devolves into name calling. I for one am not willing to referee a political playground!

    - - - Updated - - -

    I'm pretty sure you posted in the Fox News video thread. So no, that wasn't the reason your post was moved. That whole thread was quarantined.

    It's a mess to wade through the whole thread trying to suss out what crosses the line and what doesn't, especially when people quote others' comments that need to be banished. The result is usually unreadable because there are holes in the conversation. The topic has to be especially interesting and relevant for one of the moderators to make that effort (and the result is usually still a mess).
     
  5. dsm363

    dsm363 Roadster + Sig Model S

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    Politics and religion are topics that quickly turn ugly as I have never seen someone say 'you know what? You make a good argument and I now feel the exact opposite of that way I've thought for the last 20 years. Thank you'.
    A quilting subforum though. I wonder how quickly that would turn ugly.
     
  6. SeminoleFSU

    SeminoleFSU Member

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    #6 SeminoleFSU, Feb 14, 2014
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2014
    I've actually changed my mind on a lot of things over the years.. And probably not finished either. Having said that, my comment wasn't political, merely a statement of fact about ALL mainstream new media... It's a stretch to say criticizing all media outlets equally is politics.. More like criticism of mainstream media.

    Edit: However, I understand it is harder to tease out the personal attacks, etc and leave things that are kosher and still have a thread that makes any sense.
     
  7. dsm363

    dsm363 Roadster + Sig Model S

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    'mainstream media' is now a buzzword. Some people hear that and think it is a Fox talking point that somehow doesn't apply to the #1 viewed news channel. I realize you might have been talking about all TV news but just an example about how an innocent comment can start an argument that then turns into questioning people's political views. As noted above their are other forums and comment sections for politics (check out level of discussion below articles on CNN and other sites like that for how these discussions go). This site has grown very busy in the last few years so trying to keep and handle on Tesla drama with the addition of politics would be too much.
     
  8. lorih

    lorih Member

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    We don't have a quilting thread, but we have a thread about wine...

    Good red wine under $10 a bottle.

    and one discussing espresso machines...

    What super automatic espresso machine do you use?


    But seriously. I am one of those people here that loves the political discussions (though to avoid getting picked on, I often just lurk) and yet, I agree with Bonnie. It gets ugly far too quickly, and requires too much of the moderators' time.

    On the other hand, it has been a good method for culling members, as it quickly exposes people that end up banned for not playing nice.
    ;)
     
  9. SeminoleFSU

    SeminoleFSU Member

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    #9 SeminoleFSU, Feb 14, 2014
    Last edited: Feb 14, 2014
    Actually, reading back I suppose I criticized one outlet more than the others because I mention the ads on MSNBC. So I guess it was semi-warranted :cool: my main thing is I felt like my post should be allowed to stay if I don't attack anyone personally. However, I do understand the difficulty and tedium of moderating individual posts...
     
  10. Doug_G

    Doug_G Lead Moderator

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    Well, regardless, you have to admit that it was far off topic. The Tesla-to-noise ratio was way too low in that thread. If there was on-topic content in the thread I would have taken the time to fish it out.
     
  11. bonnie

    bonnie Oil is for sissies.

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    We have plenty of methods. -rubs hands together gleefully- We don't need more.
     
  12. SeminoleFSU

    SeminoleFSU Member

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    This is true it did appear to quickly go into my channel tells the truth nanna nanna boo boo... My amazement is how many truly brilliant owners on here still fall for the 2 party charade and believe what the system feeds them.. But I digress...
     
  13. Doug_G

    Doug_G Lead Moderator

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    LOL, I only just actually looked at your avatar. Politics right there! How about a nice car picture? :biggrin:
     
  14. SeminoleFSU

    SeminoleFSU Member

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    Less politics than it is history. It's illegal, and it's robbing the entire world. And the folks behind it sure as hell don't want EVs to take off and become popular, because they're deep into oil. We are on the petrodollar now after all. Anyhoo- sorry. Not changing the avatar. It is the single biggest issue in America, it is something I work hard to educate people on, and fighting the FED is part of the fabric of my being...it's a topic that we should UNITE around... Regardless of political persuasion... Sound, legitmate money should matter to everyone.
     
  15. bonnie

    bonnie Oil is for sissies.

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    -sigh- How did this thread become political? And sorry, Seminole ... not passing judgment on your position, but it is a political position. So these posts will need to go over to the political quarantine thread.

    Sheez.
     
  16. SeminoleFSU

    SeminoleFSU Member

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    Disagree. It's an economic position that people on both sides of the isle agree on, I could happily give examples. Move my posts around where ever you want... I used to be deeply into politics until I researched it... follow the money and you'll quickly realize politics is pointless when all sides are fed from the same beast ;-)
     
  17. bonnie

    bonnie Oil is for sissies.

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    i'm not a moderator for this area of the forum, but no doubt it will get moved - just because you feel your position is a universal truth doesn't mean it isn't political. And just because you can show people with opposing views agree with you, you haven't made an argument that it isn't political. If it wasn't political, it would no longer be an issue to be discussed. But it is. You petition to change minds on this issue. Welcome to politics.
     
  18. SeminoleFSU

    SeminoleFSU Member

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    Bonnie, I like your posts. You seem like a really nice person... But my position is based on economic theory. The PC police work hard to make topics taboo and rude to discuss.. And the topics that people deem or consider "political" seems to curiously expand every year that passes. Making topics seem off limits is a fairly old tactic historically speaking. Anyhow, wherever the mods move my posts is fine. I'm just happy that I got good people like yourself to think about the Fed. To me, that's progress. Goodnight.
     
  19. bonnie

    bonnie Oil is for sissies.

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    It's not rude to discuss and it's not taboo. It's just a lot of work for the mods to keep under control (we're a volunteer bunch afterall) and this is a car forum.

    Not every podium is appropriate for every speech. (And I've got some favorites, just not appropriate for here. So I save them for other places. Sometimes it leaks out on my twitter feed. But that's kind of like my own personal forum.)
     
  20. AmpedUP

    AmpedUP EV Nut

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    There are folks that love to swap political quips, and folks that find any political remarks very off-putting. As one who loves the political stuff, I think that all too often, those who dislike politics have all the say within forums. I would enjoy a politics thread very much. I think there's a line that can be drawn in moderating such a forum, and it's a line I'd call "personal attack." I think the quarantine should be for any personal attacks, be they political or otherwise. I find it interesting that a person can be mocked openly for a slip in their use of grammar, but the moment someone mentions the media, etc., they're sent to Siberia. I think a political forum could be successful ONLY as long as it is moderated by political junkies. Sorry, but the fact is that Tesla and EVs are VERY political, especially in the U.S., and there needs to be some way to discuss this fact without getting shut down at every turn.
     

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