[Poll] For the Fence-Sitters... What's the #1 Change/Improvement That'd Get You To Buy A Model S?...

[SoCalNick]

Include the PUP in the price already.
Paying $5K for an "upgraded sound system", an air filter, heated seats and XM radio that i wont use (and won't work unless I spend 2K on a sunroof.)

Honestly drop the XM radio (unless you're getting a kickback.)
or include the XM Radio with the sunroof option, since you need it anyway.

The PUP is with 2K at most - please just include it.

The upgrades that are now included are great; air suspension, lift gate, center console, etc.

Now, if they want to redesign the interior...
I need STORAGE!
I need a center console (arm rest) with storage.
I need storage in the door pockets.
I need "map pockets" behind the front seats.
I need a "sunglass holder" in the roof area.

I have kids. They have coloring books. They have no place to put anything in the car.
I'll probably have to get one of those 'seat organizer' things, and mess up my tidy car.

 

[FutureShock]

For myself, if the base MS went to a 85kWh batt pack with no price increase... done. I'd order a new Model S tomorrow.

Rumor has it that there are already a few new base MSes shipping with 85kWh packs. Wonder why. Leftover parts?
.

 

[FutureShock]

Well, over 100 votes in the poll at this point. Results so far...

The #1 thing that'd get you off the fence about buying a new Model S: 10K (i.e. major) price cut. Money talks, and the MS is a pricey car. Duh.

That said, I almost didn't include this one as a poll option, due to its 'Captain Obvious' nature. But, the Model 3 and 'comparative shopping' seemed to necessitate its inclusion, to see if potential MS buyers had become highly price-sensitive with the appearance of a cheaper alternative (if they weren't very price-sensitive already). Though I would've been really interested to see how the poll would've come out with only the 5K price cut included in the poll, no 10K.

At #2... a better interior, Elon, pls. This is actually a close second, and a pretty big deal, what with luxury German automakers set to enter the EV market only a couple of years hence. Presumably *they* will up the ante on nice EV interiors, if Tesla refuses to beat 'em to it.

For #3, consistent and reliable Autopilot. I made a comment elsewhere that AP2 is a Cylon-written human extermination program. A joke. But jokes are funny when they're kinda almost true. Eep.

At #4... more range. People obviously want still more of it, particularly at the base model/75D level. And if you put the 'minor' and 'major' range increase votes together, range goes to #3 in votes. 'Range anxiety' is alive and well.

Not sure exactly what level of range would finally put a stake through the heart of the anxiety, except to say 'more'. Though ICE-level range plus very rapid (320kw+) supercharging in a well-built-out nationwide charging network would seem like a pretty safe guess.

_______

Everything else in the poll is pretty far back, even vehicle reliability. Even though that particular mountain certainly hasn't been fully conquered yet, and matters a great deal to buyers who run afoul of it.

Interesting stuff. Especially to me, since I'm a potential MS buyer in the next 6 months or so (i.e. before 50% of the federal tax credit goes away).

A lot of the holding off is just me waiting to see if any further improvements come along... and to see I can justify a purchase if none do, in my time window.
.

 

[jbcarioca]

Since presumably everyone posting is already a EV fan and Tesla too I suspect these results are likely fairly accurate. It is quite logical that the large discriminators are modal, with price range one big factor and features the other, with increased range the largest feature.

It's also clear that fairly minor factors act as impediments for a small but very valuable group of cohorts. Such things as interior trim (mirrors, seat belt/settings for people outside the mean (i.e. short/tall), storage, etc) really act as major impediments for some people and nice to have for everyone else but cost next to nothing. 3 seems better than X is better than S so Tesla clearly is learning. A refresh of S and maybe X will go a long way to fix such irritants.

Something not mentioned in the questions is also a significant factor to a small but lucrative cohort. That is absolute size. Some people want smaller but do not want any reduction in features or capability. They're sometimes quite visible, the ones that buy the absolute top of smaller size range despite prices that are similar to loaded larger vehicles. These include things like BMW M, Mercedes AMG etc, of course, but also some who tend towards Porsche 911, Jaguar F etc.

Overall, it is clear that some people who wanted 3 are opting to take S or X rather than 3. That probably, I think, is a positive indicator of fur=ture 3 and Y demand too.

As usual the major issue is faster production and model introduction by Tesla. The major unknown: How will we all really react to non-Tesla compelling BEV offers. I am convinced they will expand the market dramatically including for Tesla.

 

[rinconryder]

Of course people would want to see a price cut in the MS but is that reasonable - no. This is a high end car with a nice interior and killer performance specs at the price point. So price drop is an unreasonable option in this poll in my opinion and will skew the results.

I LOVE my MS. But I like it mainly because it is an electric car. If it were the exact same car but an ICE car I would still have our 2007 BMW 5 series because it was just fine as a car. I still have a 2006 Chevy Tahoe which I also love because it is simple as can be and effective. The only thing it doesn't have which I would like is blue tooth. I am a knobs and sliders guy when it comes to controls - basic, easy and functional.

What I would really like to see is something like a Jeep Wrangler with a battery pack. So give me less tech, more knobs and sliders, and a battery! I know, totally unrealistic but still. I frequently ponder what the price point of the X would be if it had "normal" doors. My guess is probably in line with the MS. I think Tesla made a huge mistake with the X wing doors - yeah they are cool, but I am guessing they add at least 5,000 if not more to the cost of the car. They are not 5,000 dollars cool to me.

 

[FutureShock]

Of course people would want to see a price cut in the MS but is that reasonable - no. This is a high end car with a nice interior and killer performance specs at the price point. So price drop is an unreasonable option in this poll in my opinion and will skew the results.

Pretty much covered the reasoning for its inclusion in the poll in post #23.

The issue you bring up was indeed something I did think about.

.

 

[ltgfrk]

All I want are real blind spot monitors. The ones in the mirrors, like every other car that has them.

 

[jjh1234]

All I want are real blind spot monitors. The ones in the mirrors, like every other car that has them.

Yeah, but you won’t need them since these are **cough** self driving cars. Lol

 

[Bet TSLA]

I'm very happy with my P85 with AP1. I'm planning on upgrading soon, mostly because I want AWD and AP2. The most important feature I want that isn't here yet is fast charging. More range is also important to make it a perfect road trip vehicle, especially when we're talking about an X that's towing something.

 

[Skotty]

I wish I could make the round trip between Kansas City, MO and Columbia, MO, a frequent work route of mine, without charging, but I can't. So I'd have to say more range. it was an absolute requirement that Tesla finish superchargers on my highway route, which they did. I wouldn't be driving a Tesla today if they didn't have those superchargers in place.

Mind you, I have an older P85 that can only do about 250 miles. If the newest ones can really hit 300, that might just do it for the round trip. At least in the summer, anyway. But I wouldn't really be tempted to upgrade until they can hit 350.

FYI -- Round trip for me isn't just back and forth; usually also requires about 20 miles of around town driving plus an overnight stay without overnight charging.

 

[SucreTease]

I have the following concerns that are holding me back from ordering an S100D at present:

1) The CPU in the MCU of the Model S is obsolete (not updated since 2012, as far as anyone knows) and the GUI (maps, in particular) has become sluggish for many owners. The Model 3 MCU is instantly responsive from videos I have seen. Because Elon has promised that the Model S/X will always have move advanced technology than the Model 3, the MCU in the Model S is simply going to have to be updated to improve its performance in the near-term. I intend to own my Model S for many years, so if I buy it now, when its MCU is already sluggish for current software, it is going to become a source of continual annoyance in the future as the GUI is made more powerful. And this is something that cannot be addressed with an over-the-air software update, and something I would be stuck with for years. There are rumors of a part-number change for the MCU, alongside the change to AP 2.5, but no reports yet as to whether that is an update to the MCU CPU that addresses the above concern.

2) The price premium for the S100D over the 75D is $19,500 (down from $23,000 only a few weeks ago), for an increase of 25 kWh of battery. Tesla used to charge a premium of only $10,000 for that same increase over a year ago between the 60 and the 85, and only charges a $9,000 premium for the same battery capacity increase for the Model 3 (which gets the same EPA mileage as the S100, contrary to another promise Elon made that the Model S will always have more range than the Model 3). Why is the price premium for the S100D twice those amounts? And why $19,500 more for the S100D, when the same battery increase for the X100D only costs $16,500?? For a time, that price premium for the 100D also provided a better acceleration than the 75D and an automated lift gate. However, the automated lift gate was made standard and the 75D was updated to the same performance as the 100D. Yet, the unreasonable 100D price premium remains and buys solely a battery increase at a far higher price than price Tesla charges everywhere else.

Now, for a few months, people receiving Model S deliveries in Europe have found that their S75D contained an 85 kWh battery that is software locked to 75 (option code BTX8). This portends a move to a larger base battery for the 75D, and a suggests the possibility of a further price reduction to the S100D.

3) For at least an entire month, the spec sheets for all S100D inventory vehicles in Europe were listed as having a 0-100 kph acceleration of 3.3 seconds. No one could get an answer from Tesla as to what was going on. The theory/claim that it was a simple web page mistake doesn't fly since the so-called error was allowed to remain for an entire month before they were changed back, even though corporate was aware of the issue, since many called corporate about it (per forums). This suggests that a change was made, or soon will be made, to the S100D acceleration, which would make the price premium for the S100D discussed above more acceptable to me.

There was recent chaos in user forums over the past couple of months that resulted from some owner's and purchaser's reports that their S75/D models were being "uncorked" to the faster acceleration of the current custom ordered S75D -- even much older inventory vehicles sold recently. But Tesla provided no clear policy on who got it and who didn't (people who inquired were told that there was "a list" one was either on or not), until it was later clarified to be anyone who took delivery on or after July 1, when the increase was announced. I take this to mean that if Tesla subsequently increases the acceleration of the S100D, previous, even recent, purchasers would not get it. So I wait to see, since I would be overjoyed to have that and would gladly pay the extra premium of the S100D to have get it).

So, those are the issues holding me back from ordering at present. I find myself believing that any day now, the above issues might be resolved, so I wait, paralyzed by an inability to commit to purchase. I am aware that waiting will mean I will lose the $1,000 discount (and possibly the free supercharging, too) my referral will get me. But the above issues are worth much more to me than those are.

(Would love ventilated/cooled seats that work as well as those on my Toyota Avalon, too, but I can reluctantly give those up.)

 

[lux_cars]

For me, a MAJOR upgrade to the interior as well as comfort, convenience and luxury features, and, better build quality would definitely make me pull the trigger!

The MS I specced out comes in at $87,800 (autopilot, premium upgrades package and “leather” interior). To me, the Model S seems like a ~$50k car with an expensive electric drivetrain and not a true flagship worthy of the $90k - $100k price tag.

For comparison, you’ll be able to buy the next gen Audi A8 or Lexus LS (in a few months when they start selling stateside) for that kind of money. Add in ~$10k and you can get a “base” S-Class with some options. Model S cannot compete with these cars IMO in terms of quality, comfort, convenience and luxury. The new A8 for instance appears to be a technological tour-de-force.

IMO Tesla should make Model S into a true flagship. Major items on my wish list would be:

1. Premium materials throughout cabin (metal, leather [real or fake], wood etc).
2. Better build quality, no mis-aligned rubber seals, no squeaks and rattles in a few short years etc.
3. Better and more comfortable seats: 20+ adjustments, extendable thigh support, softer headrest, ventilation etc
4. Improved interior design with ambient lighting etc
5. Active road-sensing suspension that keeps car level on bumps, potholes, divots etc (see next gen Audi A8 active suspension or Bose concept suspension from a few years ago)
6. Other convenience and comfort features eg. Soft-close doors, more sound-deadening, double-glazed windows
7. Safety features including adaptive headlights with always-on, glarefree highbeams and blind spot monitor

I didn’t include improved AP2 reliability because I assume this would come, whether in 2018 or 2019.

 

[cameronr]

I have the following concerns that are holding me back from ordering an S100D at present:

1) The CPU in the MCU of the Model S is obsolete (not updated since 2012, as far as anyone knows) and the GUI (maps, in particular) has become sluggish for many owners. The Model 3 MCU is instantly responsive from videos I have seen. Because Elon has promised that the Model S/X will always have move advanced technology than the Model 3, the MCU in the Model S is simply going to have to be updated to improve its performance in the near-term. I intend to own my Model S for many years, so if I buy it now, when its MCU is already sluggish for current software, it is going to become a source of continual annoyance in the future as the GUI is made more powerful. And this is something that cannot be addressed with an over-the-air software update, and something I would be stuck with for years. There are rumors of a part-number change for the MCU, alongside the change to AP 2.5, but no reports yet as to whether that is an update to the MCU CPU that addresses the above concern.

2) The price premium for the S100D over the 75D is $19,500 (down from $23,000 only a few weeks ago), for an increase of 25 kWh of battery. Tesla used to charge a premium of only $10,000 for that same increase over a year ago between the 60 and the 85, and only charges a $9,000 premium for the same battery capacity increase for the Model 3 (which gets the same EPA mileage as the S100, contrary to another promise Elon made that the Model S will always have more range than the Model 3). Why is the price premium for the S100D twice those amounts? And why $19,500 more for the S100D, when the same battery increase for the X100D only costs $16,500?? For a time, that price premium for the 100D also provided a better acceleration than the 75D and an automated lift gate. However, the automated lift gate was made standard and the 75D was updated to the same performance as the 100D. Yet, the unreasonable 100D price premium remains and buys solely a battery increase at a far higher price than price Tesla charges everywhere else.

These two are at the top of my list too.

 

[GaryW]

Can I answer why I did?

I needed range to drive three to four hours without worry. Check.
I needed SC stations in critical spots for me. Check.

I wanted a beautiful interior that would take use and still look great. Check.
I wanted a car that would be as fun to drive as my BMW was. Check.
I wanted a car as environmentally friendly as my 10 year old Prius was. Check.
I wanted terrific all wheel drive for when I must drive in poor weather. Check.
I wanted exciting new technology. Check and a half. (Two checks when more of it is working)
I wanted all this at the best price possible.

I have no confidence any car maker other than Tesla has aspirations to build a car like this.

I think in 1 - 2 years I could get a lot of this from an all AWD Model 3.

When Tesla offered a great price break on a car with ~2000 Miles, and I became certain that an AWD Model 3 would have no Federal tax credit, the difference in price was close enough to me. I bought the beautiful car you see on the left.

 

[BrianKH]

I am holding off for the exact same reasons stated by SucreTease in post #31. I will continue to watch for some movement by Tesla on those issues.

 

[whitex]

I'll be upgrading soon (according to Elon's timeline) - just waiting on a fully working FSD (as in "car hailing" and "ride sharing" as per description in the Design Studio - car drops me off at the airport, goes home to park and picks me up few days later). Once that comes, I'm paying for EAP+FSD for our AP2 car and trading in our AP1 car for a new FSD one.

 

[FutureShock]

I'll be upgrading soon (according to Elon's timeline) - just waiting on a fully working FSD (as in "car hailing" and "ride sharing" as per description in the Design Studio - car drops me off at the airport, goes home to park and picks me up few days later). Once that comes, I'm paying for EAP+FSD for our AP2 car and trading in our AP1 car for a new FSD one.

Maybe it's just me, but I get the feeling that EAP/FSD won't be able to do stuff like that until 5+ years from now.

Am I being pessimistic, optimistic, or 'just about right'?
.

 

[whitex]

Maybe it's just me, but I get the feeling that EAP/FSD won't be able to do stuff like that until 5+ years from now.

Am I being pessimistic, optimistic, or 'just about right'?
.

Personally I don't thin AP2 hardware will ever achieve FSD, but would like to be proven wrong. If Elon is right, he'll get another $100K+ worth of sales from me, if not, he won't get it. For the last Model S I didn't even pay for EAP as I learned from prior Tesla purchases to only pay for what is ready at delivery time, not to buy vapourware.

 

[Bet TSLA]

For the last Model S I didn't even pay for EAP as I learned from prior Tesla purchases to only pay for what is ready at delivery time, not to buy vapourware.

Hmm. Just about the best part of owning a Tesla is the experience of it getting better and better. That is worth a significant sum to me, and makes a Tesla different from all other vehicles. I am happy to pay for what I get. I am also happy to pay for what I will get. The things that I hope for that aren't delivered are dwarfed in number by the amazing things I get that I never expected.

Today I'll get camper mode!

I can't imagine why not getting expected things would make you not buy the car. You must think it's not worth the price as it stands, which to me seems absurd. Because if you think that then one more feature isn't going to magically make it worth it.

 

[whitex]

Hmm. Just about the best part of owning a Tesla is the experience of it getting better and better. That is worth a significant sum to me, and makes a Tesla different from all other vehicles. I am happy to pay for what I get. I am also happy to pay for what I will get. The things that I hope for that aren't delivered are dwarfed in number by the amazing things I get that I never expected.

Today I'll get camper mode!

I can't imagine why not getting expected things would make you not buy the car. You must think it's not worth the price as it stands, which to me seems absurd. Because if you think that then one more feature isn't going to magically make it worth it.

Glad to hear that there are people who don't car if they spent $8,000 for FSD feature which does nothing a year later. Last largest feature I paid for was $22,500 for 691hp which was supposed to come with the "highway speeds OTA update" but never did. I got 463hp max and eventually some BS excuse that the car is capable but no the battery - sadly Tesla wouldn't accept a similar logic to sell me a new P100D, I would give them a check capable to pay for the car but my bank account would limit it to 66% of the amount. Oh, and the 85KWh battery they sold me turned out to be an 81.5KWh battery (with only 77KWh usable) - again, they would not accept any such round up rules for checks paying for their product. Oh, and the BSM feature Elon sold me also turned out to barely work 50% of the time (hmmm... I wonder why ALL the other guys use radar for this and Tesla removed it as a feature a little while later). My AP1 doesn't park itself and summons anywhere on private property as promised by Elon, not even meet me at the curb perpendicular to the driveway. All promises from Elon I paid for never got. Still waiting on the automatic wipers for our latest Tesla too (they had a working solution, Elon thought he was smarter and now almost a year later we're still waiting for it). I could go on. If I wanted to support Elon's brainfarts, I would invest in TSLA stock. I prefer reward results (buy products) rather than empty promises. When I buy products, I expect them to deliver, but to be fair there are all kids of people in the world, including this guy (his post here) that claims he loves the fact that Tesla cars have faults and that's why he buys them. That's what makes the world so interesting.