Porsche Taycan Vs Tesla Model S: Review, Road Test, Race, Charging

[dfwatt]

Will you stop your nonsense when we show you proof of quicker times?

Nope. I predict he will not. He's not interested in facts he's interested in calculations. Unfortunately he doesn't seem to be able to find the error in his calculations so he insists that his calculations are more factual than the facts. After all we are in the post fact era aren't we? Facts are not as critical as ideology. Ideology tells a few resident trolls here along with the Knuckleheads at Top Gear that the Porsche is faster than the Tesla. You just can't argue with it.

After all something like three million people in the United States believe that the Earth is flat. And that the myth of a globe is promulgated by a deep state government conspiracy to obscure the Deep truths of the Bible. We're dealing with something not quite that crazy here but it's also refractory to evidence. Okay that's my rant for the day. Now I'm going to soak my head!

 

[bhzmark]

And I find Dragy to be fairly accurate as well.

my calculations the fastest Raven does a clean 1/4 mile in about 10.8s with the top speed of 126mph.

 

[FactsBot]

Will you stop your nonsense when we show you proof of quicker times?

I can prove my calculations on the Raven in a different way and you can double check it yourself.

Take @Racerx22b 's first video with the 96% SoC.

On Youtube you can play the videos frame by frame with the < and > buttons. This video is 30fps = 30 frames per second which means you need to push > button 30 times to cover 1 second. (some videos are 24 or 60fps, always check this by counting one second)

Go to 0:07 with the > button Exactly to the point where the time jumps from 0:06 to 0:07.
Go forward one more frame and this is the last time the car was standstill. From here it is accelerating. Watch the grass on the lower left corner to check that.
Go forward 8 frames, this is when the light changes to green.
Go forward one more frame: the timer shows 0.03s. Since it took us 9 frames to get here, 1 frame is 1/30 second. In reality we are at 0.3s.
Keep playing the video until 0:18s. At the very first frame of the 18th second the timer shows 10.68s. Remember that the car moved first at the 3rd frame of 7th second. The first frame of the 18th second is at 10.93 second.
So the clean 1/4 mile time for this run is around 10.9 seconds.

 

[dfwatt]

I can prove my calculations on the Raven in a different way and you can double check it yourself.

Take @Racerx22b 's first video with the 96% SoC.

On Youtube you can play the videos frame by frame with the < and > buttons. The video is 30fps = 30 frames per second which means you need to push > button 30 times to cover 1 second.

Go to 0:07 with the > button Exactly to the point where the time jumps from 0:06 to 0:07.
Go forward one more frame and this is the last time the car was standstill. From here it is accelerating. Watch the grass on the lower left corner to check that.
Go forward 8 frames, this is when the light changes to green.
Go forward one more frame: the timer shows 0.03s. Since it took us 9 frames to get here, 1 frame is 1/30 second. In reality we are at 0.3s.
Keep playing the video until 0:18s. At the very first frame of the 18th second the timer shows 10.68s. Remember that the car moved first at the 3rd frame of 7th second. The first frame of the 18th second is at 10.93 second.
So the clean 1/4 mile time for this run is around 10.9 seconds.

This is where certain political factions in the United States would say "don't believe what Your Lying Eyes and Ears are telling you . . . . .just believe what I'm saying.

 

[Eno Deb]

huh? Dragy gives 0-60 times both with and without rollout. As does Vbox. And drag strips inherently can't avoid using rollout which depends on deep or shallow you stage.

According to @Racerx22b the rollout time was excluded from the 1/4 mile time, but not from the 0-60 time. Using rollout times when not on a drag strip is nonsense and not done outside of North America, so it is highly likely that Topgear did not use rollout but the full time from a stop, and 2 out of 3 metrics confirm that. Let's look at the numbers again:

0-60: Topgear 2.68 s, Racerx 2.68/2.73 s, perfect match
1/4 mile trap speed: Topgear 124 mph, Racerx 124 mph, perfect match
1/4 mile time: Topgear 11.08 s, Racerx 10.67/10.7s, this is the only mismatch

The ~0.3s mismatch in the 1/4 mile time is exactly what you'd expect if the rollout time is subtracted, and the other two results confirm Topgear's numbers perfectly. If you see another logical explanation, let us know.

I find it interesting that at first the Tesla fans and this Youtuber were disputing the 0-60 number, and now all they see is the 1/4 mile time as if the other numbers that validate Topgear's results didn't exist ...

 

[Daniel in SD]

0-60: Topgear 2.68 s, Racerx 2.68/2.73 s, perfect match
1/4 mile trap speed: Topgear 124 mph, Racerx 124 mph, perfect match
1/4 mile time: Topgear 11.08 s, Racerx 10.67/10.7s, this is the only mismatch

The ~0.3s mismatch in the 1/4 mile time is exactly what you'd expect if the rollout time is subtracted, and the other two results confirm Topgear's numbers perfectly. If you see another logical explanation, let us know.

Thank you! The difference is a little larger since the time Top Gear published was an old time. The best time they got with their test car was:

The best figures we recorded for the Tesla Model S Performance were:

0-60: 2.83
0-100: 6.64
¼ mile: 11.23s @ 123.2mph

This shows that they didn’t get as good a launch as Racerx but I feel like that could easily be explained by a slightly less sticky surface. The trap speed delta of 0.8mph does suggest that they were about 2% low on power relative to Racerx.
It’s going to be funny when people take the Taycan to the drag strip and it’s 0.4 seconds faster than the Top Gear time.

 

[Realist]

The Taycan Turbo S has actually done low 10s in internal Porsche testing.

 

[ICUDoc]

The Taycan Turbo S has actually done low 10s in internal Porsche testing.

Yes, Porsche are always conservative.
The competition between the Taycan and the Plaid Model S / or Roadster will be fantastic!

 

[juanmedina]

Thank you! The difference is a little larger since the time Top Gear published was an old time. The best time they got with their test car was:

This shows that they didn’t get as good a launch as Racerx but I feel like that could easily be explained by a slightly less sticky surface. The trap speed delta of 0.8mph does suggest that they were about 2% low on power relative to Racerx.
It’s going to be funny when people take the Taycan to the drag strip and it’s 0.4 seconds faster than the Top Gear time.

For $80,000 more I hope they run a faster time.

 

[bhzmark]

It’s going to be funny when people take the Taycan to the drag strip and it’s 0.4 seconds faster than the Top Gear time.

It's going to be funny when people race the Taycan and the Raven anywhere and they both run around 10.5 to 10.6 whether measured by Dragy, Vbox or drag strip timers as that is what all the evidence indicates will happen.

There is no way a shallow stage accounts for 3 tenths. at most it is one tenth, and usually people are midstage and it doesn't even affect anything which is why dragy and vbox are often very close to time slips.

 

[Daniel in SD]

It's going to be funny when people race the Taycan and the Raven anywhere and they both run around 10.5 to 10.6 whether measured by Dragy, Vbox or drag strip timers as that is what all the evidence indicates will happen.

There is no way a shallow stage accounts for 3 tenths. at most it is one tenth, and usually people are midstage and it doesn't even affect anything which is why dragy and vbox are often very close to time slips.

They didn't test on a drag strip so there is no "shallow stage" since they didn't use timing lights. I'm betting they used a VBOX with no rollout (it uses the same rollout setting for 0-60 and 1/4 mile). 1 foot rollout is 0.35 seconds for 0.5G acceleration and 0.25 seconds for 1G acceleration which is why it's always about 0.3 seconds.

 

[bhzmark]

They didn't test on a drag strip so there is no "shallow stage" since they didn't use timing lights. I'm betting they used a VBOX with no rollout (it uses the same rollout setting for 0-60 and 1/4 mile). 1 foot rollout is 0.35 seconds for 0.5G acceleration and 0.25 seconds for 1G acceleration which is why it's always about 0.3 seconds.

The whole rollout discussion makes no sense.

Are you seriously trying to argue that a properly tested Raven does a quarter mile in 11.08 seconds? Really?

 

[FactsBot]

It's going to be funny when people race the Taycan and the Raven anywhere and they both run around 10.5 to 10.6 whether measured by Dragy, Vbox or drag strip timers as that is what all the evidence indicates will happen.

There is no way a shallow stage accounts for 3 tenths. at most it is one tenth, and usually people are midstage and it doesn't even affect anything which is why dragy and vbox are often very close to time slips.

Have you done your homework described in post #103 above?


I find it very entertaining that this message from @dfwatt applies to both of you @dfwatt and @bhzmark

Nope. I predict he will not. He's not interested in facts he's interested in calculations. Unfortunately he doesn't seem to be able to find the error in his calculations so he insists that his calculations are more factual than the facts. After all we are in the post fact era aren't we? Facts are not as critical as ideology. Ideology tells a few resident trolls here along with the Knuckleheads at Top Gear that the Porsche is faster than the Tesla. You just can't argue with it.

After all something like three million people in the United States believe that the Earth is flat. And that the myth of a globe is promulgated by a deep state government conspiracy to obscure the Deep truths of the Bible. We're dealing with something not quite that crazy here but it's also refractory to evidence. Okay that's my rant for the day. Now I'm going to soak my head!

 

[bhzmark]

Have you done your homework described in post #103 above?


I find it very entertaining that this message from @dfwatt applies to both of you @dfwatt and @bhzmark

can you say something with precision and actually make a point?

Do you also think a properly tested Raven does a quarter mile in 11.08? If not, what is your point?

 

[bhzmark]

So the clean 1/4 mile time for this run is around 10.9 seconds.

Then how do you explain this? And the youtube video and common sense?

 

[Daniel in SD]

The whole rollout discussion makes no sense.

Are you seriously trying to argue that a properly tested Raven does a quarter mile in 11.08 seconds? Really?

No. I'm saying that the way that Top Gear tested it, no rollout on a less sticky surface, a Raven could get 11.08s.
Look at 0-60 times people are getting on the street, 1 foot rollout is 0.3 seconds. Top Gear's trap speed is about 0.8mph lower than other results so maybe they were a couple percent low on power for some reason but I just don't think it's that big a discrepancy.

 

[bhzmark]

No. I'm saying that the way that Top Gear tested it, no rollout on a less sticky surface, a Raven could get 11.08s.

They didn't use launch control or the full easter egg.

This guy was on a street with 100 pounds of gopro in the car and he got 10.5 again.

 

[Daniel in SD]

Then how do you explain this?

Dragy include 1 foot rollout in 1/4 mile times!
How much does the -0.8% slope make? I guess someone should calculate that.
Anyway, we'll know soon enough!

 

[FactsBot]

Then how do you explain this?

rollout

can you say something with precision and actually make a point?

The best precision I can give you is 0.03sec in post #103. That is already good enough to make a difference between 0.1s and 0.3s. If you need higher precision, search for a launch video with 60fps, then the resolution increases to 0.017s. Search for a video where the speed can be read from GPS device as car's speedo might be off.

Do you also think a properly tested Raven does a quarter mile in 11.08? If not, what is your point?

I have never said that. I said 10.8s.

 

[Daniel in SD]

They didn't use launch control or the full easter egg.

This guy was on a street with 100 pounds of gopro in the car and he got 10.5 again.



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