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Posting issues publicly vs direct to Tesla

Discussion in 'Tesla Motors' started by Right_Said_Fred, Jan 3, 2013.

  1. Right_Said_Fred

    Right_Said_Fred Model S - Sig. 283 EU

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    If we - in our own interest but also that of Tesla-employees and of EVs in general - are so concerned these issues 'leak out' to the press, then I don't understand why we post these issues here at all.

    Why do they have to be shared on a public forum? Why not inform Tesla directly? Tesla will deal with these issues. It's not like not posting them on this forum means Tesla will not find a solution. But I can guarantee you that posting them here will eventually result in bad press (if only because of all those people short on Tesla stock who will start tipping off journalists who want to do some Tesla trashing). It happened to Fisker and if Model S-owners keep up these reports (of issues that in my opinion for the most part can easily be fixed) it will happen to Tesla too. Fisker is struggling, and Tesla will too if these issues get magnified in the press.
     
  2. ElSupreme

    ElSupreme Model S 03182

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    Well You find solutions to the problems here. That is why you post them. And also for the security that you aren't the only one having the same problem. This feeling makes you feel better about Tesla fixing the problem.
     
  3. Suzieq

    Suzieq Member

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    Posting these issues on this forum is an important method of communication to those who have an interest and have no other way of knowing about these issues. It's also a big motivator for Tesla to be open, honest and IN FRONT of these issues. Taking these complaints underground would be a very inappropriate response.

    full disclosure: I am in the "Invitation to configure" window, and I would be less than honest if I said these issues don't give me pause about consummating the deal.
     
  4. SteveH

    SteveH Member

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    I agree with Suzieq. Everyone please keep posting. There's a reason that the term "spin-doctor" has a negative connotation. If we only talk about the positive things then we come off as being less than genuine. We can best represent Tesla by being open and honest about our experiences. If some people choose to wait because of that, then that's likely the right decision for them. TM will fix the problems and as they do the folk who are less comfortable with the "early adopter" issues can come on board as they are ready. The alternative is that we convince people to buy a $80,000 with promises of "no problems, you'll love it" and they become vocal detractors because it didn't meet expectations.

    Don't let fear hold you back. Be honest, let people buy when they are ready, and just keep talking. Tesla will take care of the rest.
     
  5. pete8314

    pete8314 Vendor

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    +1. That's the whole point of this forum, and to date Tesla have probably been more responsive than any other manufacturer on many, many issues raised right here. Also, remember this is one thread with a lot of (in most cases) minor issues, vs. the hundreds of other threads saying how great the car is. I locked in just before Christmas, fully aware of these issues, but with confidence they'll be fixed, many via a software update, though I suspect a few will require a tech bulletin which will get taken care of at the first service visit.
     
  6. Right_Said_Fred

    Right_Said_Fred Model S - Sig. 283 EU

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    'Finding solutions to problems'. 'Feeling better because you're not the only one'. I guess everyone has reasons to post issues here, or to want to read about them. I don't dispute these reasons or their validity.

    I can however guarantee you, as a Fisker Karma-owner, that it will backfire. The Fisker-forum was full of complaints about technical issues with early cars and it was picked-up by the press looking for a stick to beat an EV-company that received a government loan (which other EV-company got one?). I've seen many people cancel their Karma-reservations or not even making one in the first place. And look where Fisker is... now that's a cliff. Ofcourse we can say that being on the edge of a technological breakthrough is not for everyone, not for the faint hearted. But Tesla cannot survive if it only attracts the 'tough guys and girls' among car shoppers.

    Ofcourse Tesla is not Fisker (it's more viable, with a bigger order book) and the Model S in not the Karma (it has been tested longer and better). And I am not telling anyone to hide issues. I just suggest reporting them directly to Tesla, and not necessarily posting everything on a public forum. But ofcourse everyone has the right to do so. Just remember, for those who care about the value of their car, that an 8 year guarantee isn't much good if a company goes bankrupt.
     
  7. Doug_G

    Doug_G Lead Moderator

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    First of all I want to make it absolutely clear that I love the car!

    I'm faithfully reporting my experiences with the car, including some very positive ones, such as several very successful "hard winter" road trips. Yes, I have encountered a couple of glitches, but I don't think there's anything that can't be fully resolved by Tesla - and mostly through firmware updates.

    The number of problems is nowhere near what was being reported by Fisker owners in the early days. Also while Fisker owners were reporting that the touchscreen was extremely difficult to use and unreliable, I have to say the Tesla touchscreen is simply marvelous! Beautifully engineered, functional, attractive, responsive... can't say enough good things about it.

    If some reporter scrapes out one of my remarks out of context I will be pissed. Do I need to put a copyright notice in my footer???
     
  8. dsm363

    dsm363 Roadster + Sig Model S

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    It definitely is a fine line to walk. I typically try and get it solved through Tesla first and then post here if it seems to be something that might be more widespread. My pano roof stopped working after the 4.0 update but they solved that quickly by dialing in and recalibrating. My car fortunately has been working great so far from a physical standpoint with only minor software glitches but understand others have had more serious problems.
     
  9. lolachampcar

    lolachampcar Active Member

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    First, if the people who care about Tesla stop posting then you are left with those with an agenda.

    Second, the internet has made life an open forum. There is no putting that genie back in the bottle.

    I considered both the above before writing the note to Tesla. The only solution from my point of view was to actively engage and make sure the whole picture is made clear for every issue. Putting the exact number of occurrences out there in the context of the number of units in service will go a long way to adding perspective. If the picture is bad, fix it quick. Putting energy into any other solution is wasting valuable time and precious credibility.

    Obviously, the above is only my opinion.
     
  10. nolngrgrsngslde

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    I don't disagree with anything but i want to make a quick point. Fisker is struggling because they built a poor excuse for a vehicle much less a car. After seeing the Fisker karma owner's review, on you tube, i can't see how anyone would buy this car.
     
  11. jerry33

    jerry33 S85 - VIN:P05130 - 3/2/13

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    The FUD mongers will monger FUD regardless (even if they have to invent something). Prius FUD mongers have done it ever since there was a Prius. Most of the "second wave" of Prius purchasers bought one because they knew someone who had one and raved about it. FUD questions from prospective owners were answered by the owners. The amount of people that the FUD will scare off is actually quite small and once there are a number of happy campers out there, many of the ones that backed off initially will get one later.

    Of course, if the typical experience with a Model S is nine days in the shop for every driving day, that's a different story but it appears that's unlikely to happen.
     
  12. dtich

    dtich #P708

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    holy cow. thanks for pointing that out, i had never seen that. i fully admit to an embarrassing degree of schadenfreude while watching that, a giggle inducing level in fact. what a pos. top. to. bottom. a lot of bad thinking and seriously misplaced priorities.

    (apologies, sincerest, to any fk owners out there.)
     
  13. dennis

    dennis P85D

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    If you are willing to form your opinion on the single data point of a dissatisfied owner 10 months ago, go right ahead. But if you want additional data, check out the recent owner satisfaction poll on the FiskerBuzz forum here. 90+% satisfied owners. And BTW, the guy who posted the YouTube video still owns and drives his Karma.

    Every new car has issues. The question is how does the company respond. Tesla is doing an excellent job responding to owner complaints, and so did Fisker. With 361 days and 8500 miles on my Karma, I can tell you that at the current moment, my Karma is more reliable than my Model S. But the Model S is more reliable than the Karma was at the same point in its delivery lifecycle. Which is not unexpected since the Karma is Fisker's first car, and the Model S is Tesla's second.

    Personally, I support both companies and want both to succeed to further the EV industry.
     
  14. stopcrazypp

    stopcrazypp Well-Known Member

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    Tesla had a lot more positive reviews to go by. Fisker had a bunch of negative ones. Not exactly the same. I think Tesla has enough reservations to handle any FUD from early issues. I think the fire issue(s) was the one that did Fisker in (the Volt was able to weather through it though). Tesla has not have as much as a safety issue yet, and so far most of the issues are fixable with software tweaks. I don't think we have to worry too much about posting possible issues here.
     
  15. brianman

    brianman Burrito Founder

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    I'm starting to think that would be a good idea, or at least an entertaining one. I'd love to see some anti rag have to publish an official retraction (or worse) after violating such notice.

    Can one of our legally-minded forum members chime in with some recommended text?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Technically there is - close the internet pipe. Especially during wartime (which seems to be globally stuck to 'on' at the moment) internet censorship and/or disconnection has been a normal occurrence in some regions of the globe.

    - - - Updated - - -

    If you (Fisker followers and owners) have a way to contact the original reviewer, I would definitely be interested in seeing an updated video. If not by him, perhaps by another owner. It's both interesting and instructive to see how the company has addressed the issues and advanced on the vehicle design and implementation.
     
  16. lolachampcar

    lolachampcar Active Member

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    brianman,
    Yes, the internet can be shut down. I should have limited that comment to forum posts about MS.

    The main point was for T to get out in front and manage the issue as opposed to letting it run a muck.
     
  17. brianman

    brianman Burrito Founder

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    Yup, agreed on that one.
     
  18. Suzieq

    Suzieq Member

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    "closing the Internet pipe" is not an option in the USA thankfully. I travel to China regularly for business and the censorship there is frustrating-- and stifling. I am pretty confident that a product like the MS would never happen in that environment. So user forums like this are a permanent feature of the consumer landscape, and a mostly beneficial one. Companies that know, understand, and take advantage of this will add to their success. Those that ignore it will do less well. So far the jury is out on how TM is doing on this front but from my perspective the early indications are positive.

    It is very important that owners communicate their issues to TM but I also think it's incredibly useful for MS owners to communicate peer to peer as well. And it's just as helpful for potential buyers like myself. Keep posting please!
     
  19. yoda

    yoda Member

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    Maintaining open and honest discussions on the forum is the ONLY way to ensure that MS owners become aware of issues that could possibly happen to them before they are fixed. This is crucial. Having said that, one can only hope that minor issues are not blown out of proportion because they caused some temporary inconvienience.
     
  20. vfx

    vfx Well-Known Member

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    There have been times when people seem to post an issue here on TMC first. You can go back to many "problem" threads or posts and see the next comment that says, "Contact your DS/service center/Ranger and tell them" .

    If they had done that first the "dirty laundry" would not be aired to the whole world for Tesla bashing press. Unfortunately the owners who would do such a thing would probably not read this thread.
     

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