Powerwall 2 + UPS Connundrum - and solution

[miimura]

This is mine.

The CTs that were factory installed on the grid input of the switch and shown in the picture, were relocated to the main panel out of the frame to the left. This picture is from Jan 31, 2018.

The Generation panel is the one on the right. The installer also moved the feed for that panel from the bus lugs to a 100A breaker. As shown in the picture, there was no breaker between the generation panel and the sub panel that is fed from the other set of lugs on the Gateway switch.

 

[jrweiss98020]

I use Cyberpower 1500PFCLCD UPSs. They work fine with my PWs and Enphase microinverters.

 

[bob_p]

Our panel (installed in Dec 2019) had the breaker installed from the factory.

 

[woferry]

I'd imagine it depends on what the overall system looks like. If the Gateway is directly-tied to a meter, then it makes sense for the breaker to be in the Gateway, otherwise another panel/disconnect would have to be added in-between. If the Gateway feeds off another panel (as it does in my case), there would have to be a breaker in that panel anyway, so having another one in the Gateway would be redundant at best. My Gateway comes after my original service panel (which is integrated with the meter), so my breaker is in that service panel, with no breaker installed in my Gateway. The Gateway's panel front does have knock-outs for breakers of different sizes/shapes, but none of them are knocked-out, and there's only the transfer switch and electronics inside.

 

[bob_p]

Could be a configuration option selected when the PowerWall is ordered - whether or not a breaker is present.

Or it's possible our electricians installed the breaker at their shop before they came out for the installation.

For those looking at new installations, make sure there is a way to disconnect grid power from your TEG - since that makes it much easier to do off-grid testing and ensure your system should operate correctly when a real power outage occurs.

 

[Robotpedlr]

Called Tesla last week and requested my PW cut off be changed to 62 hz (since I confirmed that my Invertors cut off at 60.5hz). I got a vm yesterday that the change was done.

Did a test this morning and no UPS issues, a quick blink and everything is working like normal. Thanks for the guidance and tips. All my UPS devices thank the group also

 

[jboy210]

Called Tesla last week and requested my PW cut off be changed to 62 hz (since I confirmed that my Invertors cut off at 60.5hz). I got a vm yesterday that the change was done.

Did a test this morning and no UPS issues, a quick blink and everything is working like normal. Thanks for the guidance and tips. All my UPS devices thank the group also

Sounds great. What UPS units do you have?

 

[aesculus]

Tesla called yesterday and stated the have been trying to contact me about the cutoff frequency for a month? I did change my logged phone number from a landline to a mobile but they are both still valid. I got rid of the landline phone because they seem to like to text and that won't work.

Anyway, they stated they had changed the frequency to 63 Hz but did not seem to want to go lower even though I stated my inverters cut out at 60.5 Hz. On top of that they want to physically come out to validate the situation. I tried to get them to let me run the tests for them but they still want to come out.

So in the world of COVID-19 and that fact that we may not have a sunny day when they want to come I am kind of stuck with this.

EDIT: Going into the GW I noticed you cannot assign a permanent IP address with WIFI and only when connected via ethernet. I even tried to connect via ethernet hoping that would lock the IP address but it just spun forever and then that made me lose the connection I did have with the browser. Coming out of that mess the router still shows the GW with it's IP address but I cannot get to the GW so it's wonked. Still works over cellular so I will just have to wait until it gets it's act together again.

 

[jjrandorin]

Tesla called yesterday and stated the have been trying to contact me about the cutoff frequency for a month? I did change my logged phone number from a landline to a mobile but they are both still valid. I got rid of the landline phone because they seem to like to text and that won't work.

Anyway, they stated they had changed the frequency to 63 Hz but did not seem to want to go lower even though I stated my inverters cut out at 60.5 Hz. On top of that they want to physically come out to validate the situation. I tried to get them to let me run the tests for them but they still want to come out.

So in the world of COVID-19 and that fact that we may not have a sunny day when they want to come I am kind of stuck with this.

EDIT: Going into the GW I noticed you cannot assign a permanent IP address with WIFI and only when connected via ethernet. I even tried to connect via ethernet hoping that would lock the IP address but it just spun forever and then that made me lose the connection I did have with the browser. Coming out of that mess the router still shows the GW with it's IP address but I cannot get to the GW so it's wonked. Still works over cellular so I will just have to wait until it gets it's act together again.

You should be able to see what address it pulls and then go into your router and assign it that one on the router end, unless your router software doesnt allow that.

 

[aesculus]

It's in the router but the gw does not respond currently to the IP request. I'll wait several hours or a day and then I might have to power off the gw to get it to reboot. Somehow it's server is not recognizing the wifi IP connection but it does the cellular, so I know it's working OK.

 

[Robotpedlr]

Sounds great. What UPS units do you have?

I have several basic APC home office UPS units and the newest one is an CyberPower CP1500. All worked fine today when I tried the test. They came on for a second and then resorted back to normal...no beeping or freaking out.

 

[jboy210]

I have several basic APC home office UPS units and the newest one is an CyberPower CP1500. All worked fine today when I tried the test. They came on for a second and then resorted back to normal...no beeping or freaking out.

Great. I have several CP 1500s Pure sinewave units and was hoping they would work

 

[Robotpedlr]

One more question for the experts.

As I mentioned, battery test the other day. I flipped the breaker off in the Tesla Gateway and my house instantly switched to battery power as expected. I ran it down to about 88% (over an hour and half) but I never did see my solar kick back on during the process (according to my Tesla power flow graph in the app). I understand while the PW SoC is hight (upper 90s) that it is cutting off the micro-inverters. But shouldn’t they come back on when it drops down? It was a low solar day here in Seattle, but there was some solar and nothing showed in the Tesla app. Once I flipped the breaker back on, about 5 min later solar was back.

Am I dont something wrong or should I have seen the solar feeding the PW/House some juice once it was down to 95% or so?

 

[power.saver]

No, there is something wrong with your install. Either the frequency is too high (shouldn't be at 88%) or the solar is mis-wired and got disconnected when you flipped the breaker.

Does your inverter have a display that you can see to find out what the error code is?

 

[Robotpedlr]

No, there is something wrong with your install. Either the frequency is too high (shouldn't be at 88%) or the solar is mis-wired and got disconnected when you flipped the breaker.

Does your inverter have a display that you can see to find out what the error code is?

thanks. I have a “kill a watt” coming this week. I will check the frequency and rerun the test. Will also do it on a stronger solar day. If I still don’t get solar during the simulated outage (after soc % drops) I will call the installer (3rd party).

also my inverter has a display but I didn’t check it. Will note if there are any errors during the next test.

 

[bob_p]

We lost power yesterday morning.

When the lights flashed, I brought up the Tesla app and confirmed we were operating off-grid.

Even though the PowerWalls weren't close to full (they were 20% charged), we were running entirely off the PowerWalls with the solar panels offline.

And after a few minutes, the solar panels started generation power - with some of the power going to the house and the rest of the power going to charge the PowerWalls.

And when the grid power came on, it took a few minutes for the system to switch back to grid power.

While the system will immediately switch to PowerWall power, it appears there are delays built-in when switching to grid and solar power.

It would be very helpful if the Tesla app and TEG web interface could indicate when a timer is counting down before turning on solar or grid power...

It would also be very helpful if the two interfaces would also display the KWh of power left in the PowerWalls - which would make it much easier for customers to estimate how much time they have left operating off the PowerWalls (since the app/TEG web displays show current house KW usage).

 

[Dan123]

It would be very helpful if the Tesla app and TEG web interface could indicate when a timer is counting down before turning on solar or grid power...

It would also be very helpful if the two interfaces would also display the KWh of power left in the PowerWalls - which would make it much easier for customers to estimate how much time they have left operating off the PowerWalls (since the app/TEG web displays show current house KW usage).

The delay in solar power production is 5 minutes (300 seconds) by default. That doesn't depend on the Powerwall, but depends on the inverter settings. It can be changed, but the settings depend also on how your system is designed and local electrical regulations.

 

[jrweiss98020]

Each PW has 13.7 KWh of available energy, so you can easily estimate what remains from the percentage.

The Gateway waits 5 minutes after it detects grid power before it reconnects with the grid, to minimize the likelihood of switching back during a transient time.

 

[miimura]

Each PW has 13.7 KWh of available energy, so you can easily estimate what remains from the percentage.

The Gateway waits 5 minutes after it detects grid power before it reconnects with the grid, to minimize the likelihood of switching back during a transient time.

In addition to checking the stability of the grid, the Powerwalls synchonize their own AC waveform to the grid before reconnecting. That is why the reconnection is seamless - there is no current flow across the switch when it reconnects.

 

[bob_p]

The delay in solar power production is 5 minutes (300 seconds) by default. That doesn't depend on the Powerwall, but depends on the inverter settings. It can be changed, but the settings depend also on how your system is designed and local electrical regulations.

That makes sense, since the Tesla Gateway doesn't have any communication with our Chilicon Power microinverters. The only control the Gateway has on solar power generation is setting the off-grid powerline frequency above 60Hz to tell the microinverters to turn off. So the 5 minute timeout must be programmed into the microinverters - when they see the powerline frequency shift from high to 60Hz, they must be waiting 5 minutes before supplying power to the Gateway. Crude solution - but effective...