Powerwall in New England ?

[EdA]

Here are the pics as promised.

The first one is the before picture, I hope it is not flipped.

Second one was the back of the box which was inside the truck.

Third and fourth are the final product. Thanks Elon, JB and Franz!

 

[masam]

Now that I’ve got NG approval for my installation, I received two purchase agreements from Tesla this week - one being almost 25% more than the other. The incorrect agreement has a huge upcharge in “additional charges” without any explanation whatsoever. I’ve already signed the correct agreement with the lower price and not the new, incorrect one. Anyone have something similar happen ? Haven’t been able to get to of anyone over at Tesla energy yet. Thought I’d ask here.
Thanks !

 

[ivolodin]

It only took a year and a half, restarting the project completely from the scratch, escalation to upper management and a whole lot of back and forth, but I finally got my powerwalls installed and connected! I had to drop secondary solar system, because Eversourse would just not budge... So now I have two powerwalls that are feeding off of 7.6kWh solar system. But at least it means that I have backup for a day or two of fridge, water and a few other essentials.

 

[masam]

Very nice ! Great to see completed projects.

 

[brianbsl]

I heard that the Demand Response program for energy storage in MA will be launching very soon and will include Powerwall support. I guess the numbers are not finalized yet but something along the lines of "close" to covering the cost of the unit over the 5 year rebate commitment assuming you discharge at full power during every event.

I have been working with MassRenewables on mine as Tesla directly wanted to charge more for installation due to my specific panel configuration, and they also gave me more confidence that they could handle the modification to my SMART filing for the energy storage adder since my PV is under that program (not SREC)

 

[mswlogo]

I heard that the Demand Response program for energy storage in MA will be launching very soon and will include Powerwall support. I guess the numbers are not finalized yet but something along the lines of "close" to covering the cost of the unit over the 5 year rebate commitment assuming you discharge at full power during every event.

I have been working with MassRenewables on mine as Tesla directly wanted to charge more for installation due to my specific panel configuration, and they also gave me more confidence that they could handle the modification to my SMART filing for the energy storage adder since my PV is under that program (not SREC)

That would be awesome. Thanks for sharing that news. MassRenewables installed my Solar system. Those guys are a little pricey but they really do excellent work.

Question: My 100 Amp Panel is pretty full. In fact when they installed the Solar they tapped the main lines coming into the panel because there was no room to back feed a breaker (or there was some other restriction of how many amps they could back feed through a breaker). It's 7.6 kW of panels on a 6 kW inverter.

If I wanted a Powerwall, would that all tie into the Solar System boxes or does that require more stuff in the main panel. It would probably only be one Powerwall.

 

[ivolodin]

Powerwall is usually installed between the meter and your main panel (if you are backing up the whole house). If you will be backing up partial breakers, they usually install subpanel and move backed up breakers to it from the main panel. No new breakers in the main panel are required (as far as I know).

 

[mswlogo]

Powerwall is usually installed between the meter and your main panel (if you are backing up the whole house). If you will be backing up partial breakers, they usually install subpanel and move backed up breakers to it from the main panel. No new breakers in the main panel are required (as far as I know).

I think I understand.

Can it be installed different ways?

Like for "Off Peak balancing" only, basically filling in where Solar tails off (and Peak demand rises) and never exceed the amps the Solar back feed does now?

I don't care all that much about the backup and 1 Powerwall would never cover the whole panel.

 

[ivolodin]

I think in that case it would be the same hardware setup, but management would be through software. Right now there's only 3 options in the software. Backup-only (powerwall will only be used when the power goes out). Self-powered with reserve (use powerwall to offset usage up to reserve value) and Advanced (time-based control for use when you have time of use metering). In your case you would probably use either Advanced to offset usage during peak hours, or Self-powered with reserve set to 0%.

 

[mswlogo]

I think in that case it would be the same hardware setup, but management would be through software. Right now there's only 3 options in the software. Backup-only (powerwall will only be used when the power goes out). Self-powered with reserve (use powerwall to offset usage up to reserve value) and Advanced (time-based control for use when you have time of use metering). In your case you would probably use either Advanced to offset usage during peak hours, or Self-powered with reserve set to 0%.

Thanks that's very helpful.

 

[brianbsl]

That would be awesome. Thanks for sharing that news. MassRenewables installed my Solar system. Those guys are a little pricey but they really do excellent work.

Question: My 100 Amp Panel is pretty full. In fact when they installed the Solar they tapped the main lines coming into the panel because there was no room to back feed a breaker (or there was some other restriction of how many amps they could back feed through a breaker). It's 7.6 kW of panels on a 6 kW inverter.

If I wanted a Powerwall, would that all tie into the Solar System boxes or does that require more stuff in the main panel. It would probably only be one Powerwall.

They will run your 100A service entrance into the Powerwall "Gateway" which is like the DPST ATS that disconnects you from a grid.
On the output lugs of that they will run a new cable into your panel, and one to a new "generation" panel where they will combine together the Powerwall plus your existing PV. This will replace your existing line-side connection. There should be no busbar rating limitation (only the rating of the lugs on the gateway, which is far more than 100A as it is designed to supply 200A load panels plus generation).

FWIW the incentive will be paid by average kW discharged during a capacity event, so you could do two and get double the incentive. And two is not linearly more expensive than 1 since the overhead (generation panel, disconnect, Gateway, most of the install labor) is all the same. In fact with 6kW inverter they may even say the only way is to have two, because the Powerwall can only charge at 5kW. The MassRenewables guys are very knowledgable on this so I am sure they can walk you through it. Note that since the incentive is paid on production there is a caveat that if you do not have enough PV production you may not have charged your Powerwall enough to get full value of the incentive in a discharge event, because if you have PV and want to discharge to the grid (which you will want to do to get the full incentive) you are not allowed to charge from the grid, you can only charge from PV.

The incentive should be available without PV also, and then it is much more clear since you can charge from the grid and discharge to the grid (which you can not do with PV).

 

[masam]

I heard that the Demand Response program for energy storage in MA will be launching very soon and will include Powerwall support. I guess the numbers are not finalized yet but something along the lines of "close" to covering the cost of the unit over the 5 year rebate commitment assuming you discharge at full power during every event.

Do you know if the powerwalls have to be installed after the program starts to be eligible for this ? Or do existing installations qualify ?
Thanks !

 

[yousexy]

Typically, the program cannot go retroactive.

 

[brianbsl]

Do you know if the powerwalls have to be installed after the program starts to be eligible for this ? Or do existing installations qualify ?
Thanks !

Typically, the program cannot go retroactive.

The application form I was sent by MassRenewables does say something about applications for units installed before April 2019 do not need a quote attached, that would imply to me that existing installations will qualify, but we won't know for sure until it officially launches. Personally since I am paying for mine, I was holding out until it was clear, but for those who got them as part of the referral program it seems like a really sweet deal if you can get this $.

 

[brianbsl]

I managed to find this which describes some of the details of the program. https://files-cdn.masscec.com/NGrid Eversource Powerpoint .pdf

This specifically says existing owners can participate (see last slide)

 

[masam]

Here's the webinar :

 

[brianbsl]

Tesla side of the program finally live today: MA Virtual Power Plant | Tesla

 

[robby]

Tesla side of the program finally live today: MA Virtual Power Plant | Tesla

Thanks for posting this! I filled out the form yesterday morning and got a call in the evening. They are going to enroll me next week. Sounds like everything is managed by Tesla -- nothing the end-user really has to do. They are still pretty light on pricing/revenue generation. Curious to hear more about that but looking forward to the program.

 

[ivolodin]

Any news on when Eversource might join this program? Right now it seems to be only for National Grid customers.

 

[masam]

According to the webinar above, they claim to pay $250/kWh and an additional $75/kWh in winter. If that’s really the case, it becomes a very appealing program.