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Pre-heating the car when still connected to the net

Discussion in 'Model S' started by widodh, Mar 4, 2011.

  1. widodh

    widodh Model S R231 EU

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    On a Dutch forum some users started to bash on EV's since heating would cost you range.

    That is true, so I thought, can't we pre-heat our cars while they are still connected to the grid? This would be nice for the Model S, 10 min before you leave, you could pre-heat the car, or let the AC do it's job, thus saving you much needed energy from the battery.

    Wouldn't this be an idea for the Model S?
     
  2. dpeilow

    dpeilow Moderator

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    It was done on 90s EVs and it's also done on the LEAF. So most do it and I expect the Model S will be no exception.
     
  3. widodh

    widodh Model S R231 EU

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    Ah, didn't know the LEAF has it. I expect the Model S to have this feature, would be very nice if you could remotely control this via your smartphone. If the car keeps it's 3G/4G connection up all the time, that should be possible.
     
  4. Doug_G

    Doug_G Lead Moderator

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    With the current firmware, the Roadster keeps the battery warm while it is plugged in (unless in storage mode).
     
  5. vfx

    vfx Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, It's too bad the car smarts do not have any control of the interior HVAC. If it did the Scott's SMS device would work on all this.
     
  6. ckessel

    ckessel Active Member

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    It's hard to imagine the preheat/cool is going to save more than a minuscule amount of range. I can see it'd be convenient, but it doesn't seem very relevant to range.
     
  7. Doug_G

    Doug_G Lead Moderator

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    It would help the range somewhat in extreme cold, but I think they mainly do it more to keep regen working.
     
  8. stopcrazypp

    stopcrazypp Well-Known Member

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    Maybe not for the interior, but the battery preheat is pretty important. You drop capacity significantly in the cold, and its not because of heating requirements, but rather the characteristic of batteries. That's why Nissan won't sell their Leaf in certain regions until the cold weather package is out.
     
  9. WarpedOne

    WarpedOne Supreme Premier

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    2kW for 10 minutes is 330 Wh which is enough for about one mile of driving.
    You gain much more by driving a bit less agressive, do one passing less or drive behind another vehicle for a while.

    People lack perspective.
     
  10. Cobos

    Cobos S60 owner since 2013

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    Well it all depends on how cold it is outside. A engine block heater is usually in the 500-1000W range. My experience with cold soaked cars inside a flimsy garage needs at least 2 hours to get just the engine slightly heated. Heating the cabin would have taken another hour I believe. That's from -10C to -15C during the night. So for winter areas the pre-heating is a very usefull feature not to mention a great luxury feature that ties into the 4G connectivity they brag about.

    I see this as an essential feature.

    Cobos
     
  11. ckessel

    ckessel Active Member

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    Really? So you'd never buy a car that didn't have this particular feature? A feature that I had never heard of before this thread.
     
  12. drbradfo

    drbradfo Member

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    I think this would be an awesome feature from luxury point of view not from a range pov. When I pack up the laptop from the office, I could warm up the car so the time I get out to the parking lot the car is warm (or cool in summer).
     
  13. Cobos

    Cobos S60 owner since 2013

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    Well without this feature the idea of the Model S is a lot less interesting. Especially since I know the Model S can talk through 3G/4G net, and preheating will be important for range during winter times in Norway. Looking at the MiEV in Norway real range in cold winter climates is around 60-70km, they before said range upto 160km. That is a huge difference, which means preheating is important for range, especially for someone with the 160miles battery. Someone like me for instance :)

    Cobos
     
  14. jkirkebo

    jkirkebo Model S P85+ VIN 14420 EU

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    You've never heard of pre-heating devices ? They are extremely common over here, either the electric aftermarket kind or the factory-installed Webasto diesel heaters.

    My VW Touran 2.0TDI has the 5kW Webasto unit, this can be started preprogrammed from three different timers or via remote (radio) control with approx 2000' range. If it's really cold, up to 45 minutes of 5kW output will be needed. This is very nice compared to getting into a 0F car in the morning after using 10 minutes to brush of snow and scrape off ice from the windshield, and if you drive off without warming the car up first the windshield will instantly fog up on the inside...

    I agree, this is an essential feature in cold climates. One could always install one of the aftermarked electric 2kW units but they take up space in the passenger footwell and then you'd need to plug in two different plugs, one for charging and one for heating :(
     
  15. jkirkebo

    jkirkebo Model S P85+ VIN 14420 EU

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    Up to 45 minutes at 5kW output is needed over here if it's really cold. That is 3750wh or nearly 20km of driving.
     
  16. WarpedOne

    WarpedOne Supreme Premier

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    You compare the incomparable ...

    Webasto heats the whole engine cooling system, engine itself and the passenger compartment. That is about 10 liters of water, 5 liters of oil and about 250kg of steel that don't exists in electric case.

    Roadster's heater is 2kW electric, Model S might have 3kW unit. They need to warm up only the air in the cabin.
     
  17. doug

    doug Administrator / Head Moderator

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    Regardless of range, it's still a nice feature they should have in the car since most of the hardware will already be there. I think it would be cool to be able to check the interior temperature of my car via iPhone app and to cool off or heat up the interior before I got there.
     
  18. dsm363

    dsm363 Roadster + Sig Model S

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    I agree. I think it's one of those must have features that makes an EV unique and appeal to the masses. Telling someone they can even heat up their car while in the garage (no emissions) in the winter from the comfort of their home is a good selling point. As is cooling the car after it's been sitting outside in the sun when you're walking to it from work, the mall...etc
     
  19. vfx

    vfx Well-Known Member

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    And for the most part this is what Tesla does real well. The whole structure of the car is a ground up EV. Would be logical that all depts will take advantage of what makes an EV unique. This only times they skimped on the Roadster were to save costs. The S might have this issue on the base model.
     
  20. Cobos

    Cobos S60 owner since 2013

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    I agree that lots of stuff will be options probably, but as they've said the 17'' screen is a standard, that also implies that the 4G connectivity is standard for the screen to do it's magic. And since we know Tesla want to be able to communicate with the car, turning off this App feature for the base model would seem like spite more than economical sense...

    Cobos
     

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