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Preliminary Model S Charging stats via TED

Discussion in 'Model S: Battery & Charging' started by nolngrgrsngslde, Jan 11, 2013.

  1. nolngrgrsngslde

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    #1 nolngrgrsngslde, Jan 11, 2013
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2013
    Guys.

    I've had the car for 4 days, TED for two. This is the first night that i collect data. still learning but wanted to POST it.

    TED is "The Energy detective" from http://www.theenergydetective.com/

    Ted collects KWh data used via my charge port. The energy use shown is done by the car only.

    I also have a temperature datalogger by "La Crosse" which I left in the garage to log temp vs KW usage by the car.

    Car OS version is 4.1


    ted_data.PNG
     
  2. mknox

    mknox Well-Known Member

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    Toronto, ON
    Excellent! I'll be adding another MTU to my TED when my car comes (hopefully) in the spring.
     
  3. nolngrgrsngslde

    Joined:
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    Yeah, this TED thing is cool. I got two MTUs, I have not hooked up the second one yet.

    BTW, my connection is via a NEMA 6-50. The car registers 40A, 21Miles/hr.
     
  4. nolngrgrsngslde

    Joined:
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    #4 nolngrgrsngslde, Jan 13, 2013
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2013
    Latest data:

    Look towards the bottom. Last night, it took 9 hours to finish charging. I think this is because I did not push the connecter all the way in. This time I did not notice it was happening, but once before I saw it charging at half rate and I noticed at the time a warning that the connecter was not latched. I reconnected it and pushed hard and solved the problem.

    I also did not pay attention to the SOC before and after but, I think I only charged up about 100 miles during those 9 hours. It seems to take too many KW to charge only 100 miles. It sure seems to be a lot less efficient at half rate.


    Date - Time Power KWh Cost $0.13/KW
    1/10/13 10:00 PM 9.781 $1.26
    1/10/13 11:00 PM 10.049 $1.31
    1/11/13 12:00 AM 10.12 $1.32
    1/11/13 1:00 AM 4.758 $0.62
    1/11/13 2:00 AM 0 $0.00
    1/11/13 3:00 AM 0 $0.00
    1/11/13 4:00 AM 0 $0.00
    1/11/13 5:00 AM 0 $0.00
    1/11/13 6:00 AM 0 $0.00
    1/11/13 7:00 AM 1.653 $0.21
    1/11/13 8:00 AM 0 $0.00
    1/11/13 9:00 AM 0 $0.00
    1/11/13 10:00 AM 0 $0.00
    1/11/13 11:00 AM 7.382 $0.96
    1/11/13 12:00 PM 9.891 $1.29
    1/11/13 1:00 PM 2.671 $0.34
    1/11/13 2:00 PM 0 $0.00
    1/11/13 3:00 PM 0 $0.00
    1/11/13 4:00 PM 0 $0.00
    1/11/13 5:00 PM 2.438 $0.31
    1/11/13 6:00 PM 8.476 $1.10
    1/11/13 7:00 PM 0 $0.00
    1/11/13 8:00 PM 0 $0.00
    1/11/13 9:00 PM 0 $0.00
    1/11/13 10:00 PM 8.457 $1.10
    1/11/13 11:00 PM 10.017 $1.30
    1/12/13 12:00 AM 10.034 $1.30
    1/12/13 1:00 AM 8.252 $1.07
    1/12/13 2:00 AM 0 $0.00
    1/12/13 3:00 AM 0 $0.00
    1/12/13 4:00 AM 0 $0.00
    1/12/13 5:00 AM 0 $0.00
    1/12/13 6:00 AM 0 $0.00
    1/12/13 7:00 AM 0 $0.00
    1/12/13 8:00 AM 0 $0.00
    1/12/13 9:00 AM 0 $0.00
    1/12/13 10:00 AM 1.847 $0.24
    1/12/13 11:00 AM 5.488 $0.71
    1/12/13 12:00 PM 0 $0.00
    1/12/13 1:00 PM 0 $0.00
    1/12/13 2:00 PM 8.429 $1.09
    1/12/13 3:00 PM 4.031 $0.52
    1/12/13 4:00 PM 4.632 $0.60
    1/12/13 5:00 PM 0 $0.00
    1/12/13 6:00 PM 0 $0.00
    1/12/13 7:00 PM 0 $0.00
    1/12/13 8:00 PM 0 $0.00
    1/12/13 9:00 PM 0 $0.00
    1/12/13 10:00 PM 0 $0.00
    1/12/13 11:00 PM 0.535 $0.07
    1/13/13 12:00 AM 4.14 $0.54
    1/13/13 1:00 AM 4.139 $0.54
    1/13/13 2:00 AM 4.14 $0.54
    1/13/13 3:00 AM 4.148 $0.54
    1/13/13 4:00 AM 4.142 $0.54
    1/13/13 5:00 AM 4.122 $0.54
    1/13/13 6:00 AM 4.104 $0.54
    1/13/13 7:00 AM 4.092 $0.54
    1/13/13 8:00 AM 4.094 $0.53
    1/13/13 9:00 AM 0.27 $0.03
    1/13/13 10:00 AM 0 $0.00
    1/13/13 11:00 AM 0 $0.00
    1/13/13 12:00 PM 0 $0.00
    1/13/13 1:00 PM 0 $0.00
    1/13/13 2:00 PM 0 $0.00
     
  5. EchoDelta

    EchoDelta Member

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    Hey would you mind taking a read of the vampire load of the charger with no car plugged in? Your sheet says 0 kWh but there's gotta be an odd watt here or there. An average over a bunch of hours would be a good enough approximation.

    Btw I've had great experiences getting my TED exposed online and getting the data from google spreadsheet scripts. My gateway is actually with them right now getting a firmware corruption fixed and internal battery changed. The latter seems to be a recurrent issue that zombies units after a couple of years and requires good soldering to DiY.



    X1188. Sorry if this is terse, sent from my phone.
     
  6. keys

    keys Member

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    Graphs... We need graphs! The 0 kWh seems odd to me. In addition, I think it would be more insightful to log realtime power usage (in kW) every minute or so. Nice idea, this TED thing, but a maximum of 3600 datapoints?
    Are they kidding or am I misunderstanding?
     
  7. yobigd20

    yobigd20 Well-Known Member

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    This is VERY good info to have. Please keep us updated. It's probably a pain in the butt, but it would be very useful to know remaining miles before and after each plug in to be able to zone in on a more accurate estimation for everyone to expect. However its still good data either way. Looks like it's costing you about less than $5/day to "fill up" at $.13/kW. I think my rate is $.10/kW. It can also be lower during a certain time of night for many people, or if they are on a special rate plan for EVs with their electric company.

    Here is a question for those that may be getting the "special EV rate plans" - if your state allows you to have different suppliers and distributors like NJ (I elected for Verde Energy as my supplier while Atlantic Electric is my distributor), which one is your ' EV plan' with? The supplier or distributor? Or both?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Actually my rates are now around $.0985 for supply http://www.lowcostpower.com/electricity-rates/new-jersey.html need to check my bill to confirm. I thought I read somewhere that avg California rates are like $.33/KW? that seems absurd.
     
  8. eelton

    eelton Member

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    Location:
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    There are indeed wide geographic variations in electricity costs. However, you have to remember to include transmission charges, distribution charges, taxes, and (in my case) a couple of other fees charged per kWh. So, your cost is somewhat higher than the electricity cost from your provider.


    sent via Tapatalk
     
  9. FlasherZ

    FlasherZ Sig Model S + Sig Model X + Model 3 Resv

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    Other than the $28/month facilities charge ("meter charge"), this is all-inclusive at $0.09/kWh for me.
     
  10. nolngrgrsngslde

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    The Zeros in the middle of the night, (before 7:00 am) are when the car stops charging. The Zeros in the middle of the day are mostly with the car NOT plugged in. BTW, i had a problem withe configuration, the 5kwh in the table above should be 10Kwh.

    - - - Updated - - -


    Tonight, i plugged it in around 9:30 when it had 140 miles SOC. It pretty much pulls 9.8 KW consistently until it is full. I will post that table in the morning.
     
  11. nolngrgrsngslde

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    #11 nolngrgrsngslde, Jan 16, 2013
    Last edited: Jan 16, 2013
    Last night's charge. Note, I changed the $ per KW to $.11/KW after talking to BG&E.

    Also note, unlike previous posts, data below is listed most recent first.


    Date Power KWh Cost $.11/KW Comment
    1/16/13 6:00 AM 0 0 SOC 239 miles.
    1/16/13 5:00 AM 0 0
    1/16/13 4:00 AM 0 0
    1/16/13 3:00 AM 0 0
    1/16/13 2:00 AM 0 0
    1/16/13 1:00 AM 3.827 0.42
    1/16/13 12:00 AM 9.914 1.09
    1/15/13 11:00 PM 9.931 1.09
    1/15/13 10:00 PM 9.931 1.09
    1/15/13 9:00 PM 2.067 0.23 SOC 140 miles
    1/15/13 8:00 PM 0 0 Car not plugged in
    1/15/13 7:00 PM 0 0 Car not plugged in
    Minute by minute data get large, if you want it PM me. Here is what happened this morning by the minute.

    Date Power KW Cost $.11/KW Comment
    1/16/13 7:29 AM 0 0
    1/16/13 7:28 AM 0 0
    1/16/13 7:27 AM 0 0
    1/16/13 7:26 AM 4.683 0.52
    1/16/13 7:25 AM 9.866 1.09
    1/16/13 7:24 AM 9.887 1.09
    1/16/13 7:23 AM 9.911 1.1
    1/16/13 7:22 AM 9.901 1.09
    1/16/13 7:21 AM 9.914 1.1
    1/16/13 7:20 AM 6.091 0.68
    1/16/13 7:19 AM 0 0 Took kid#2 to bus stop. 0.25 miles. Heater on. Lights on. Waited about 5 minutes
    1/16/13 7:18 AM 0 0
    1/16/13 7:17 AM 0 0
    1/16/13 7:16 AM 0 0
    1/16/13 7:15 AM 0 0
    1/16/13 7:14 AM 0 0
    1/16/13 7:13 AM 0 0
    1/16/13 7:12 AM 0 0
    1/16/13 7:11 AM 0.907 0.1
    1/16/13 7:10 AM 9.805 1.08
    1/16/13 7:09 AM 9.865 1.09
    1/16/13 7:08 AM 9.907 1.09
    1/16/13 7:07 AM 9.918 1.1
    1/16/13 7:06 AM 5.069 0.56
    1/16/13 7:05 AM 0 0 Took kid#1 to bus. 0.25 miles. Heater on. Lights on. Waited about 5 minutes
    1/16/13 7:04 AM 0 0 SOC 239
     
  12. donauker

    donauker Member

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    Location:
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    I use a product called "it's electric" with my TED units. This free product gives me data archiving and graphing capabilities. I have lifetime second data since installing this product several years ago.

    Here is a 40 amp Model S Charge Cycle:

    Model S Chg 1.jpg



    Here is a 40 amp Model S Charge followed by a Roadster charge limited to 32 amps:

    Both Charges.jpg


    I will need to unplug my electric mower and snow blower chargers to check vampire loads since they are both connected and in float charge mode. With both of them in float and the Roadster and Model S chargers plugged in the graph was showing 56 watts of load. I expect the Model S charger will only be a few watts after charge completion.
     
  13. yobigd20

    yobigd20 Well-Known Member

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    This chart doesn't look right. It's saying that it cost you over $5 each time to drive your kid to the end of the block come home and plugin. No way. Think about that. The most you were seeing was 9 per HOUR originally and this is showing the same per minute. Perhaps that is the avg rate/hour for each minute, in which case you need to divide by 60 to show accurate readings per minute.
     
  14. donauker

    donauker Member

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    Yes, this is how they show cost data.
     
  15. ToddRLockwood

    ToddRLockwood Active Member

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    I'm curious about your TED installation. Does it require two current transformers to read your 14-50 circuit? If so, are the CT's hanging inside your panel?

    Is the computer interface Mac-compatible? How far away can the computer be located from the main TED unit?
     
  16. nolngrgrsngslde

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    #16 nolngrgrsngslde, Jan 16, 2013
    Last edited: Jan 16, 2013
    The TED web site has videos and such showing you exactly how to install it.
    http://www.theenergydetective.com/videos


    Yes, the CTs are inside the panel. An MTU unit comes with two transformers, one for each 120v leg/phase.

    Be careful with the orientation of the CTs as outlined in video. The little red light needs to be on the power source side. They mean it.

    The interface is web based so, the MAC should be fine.

    The gateway unit acts as a webserver. It connects to your Ethernet network on your home router or switch. This is how your computer connects to it. It defaults to DHCP which automatically picks up an IP address from your router. The installation program that you download from the TED site basically only finds it for you so you can browse to it. You can change the settings to give it a fixed IP address. This ensures that you can always find it even if the router reboots or something. The gateway unit needs a default gateway because it reaches out to the National Weather Service site to get weather information. It also synchronizes its clock with internet based time servers (pool.ntp.org).

    The MTU transmits data to the gateway unit via the electrical wiring. This is my conclusion since there is no wireless capabilities and they strongly advise you to connect the MTU power supply to the same circuit that the gateway unit will plug into. The manuals may have more info, I did not read them.

    The installation was not difficult but, you have to be very careful, if you have no experience with wiring, let someone do it. If you have no idea what you are looking at, better stay safe and don't open that panel.

    HTH, if you have other questions ask.
     
  17. swaltner

    swaltner Member

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    The web interface generated by the TED Gateway works on Mac OS X (tested in Safari on OS X 10.8.2) as well as iOS (Safari both on the iPad and iPhone). The iPhone screen is a little small to read the web page on, but it does render the page properly. TED sells an optional wireless display, which I didn't get. An iPad works great to carry around the house as you monitor the power consumption of various devices.
     
  18. nolngrgrsngslde

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    I did not get the wireless display either but, come to think of it, the gateway or something must have wireless capabilities. As I mentioned, I did not read the manuals, just watched the videos.
     
  19. mknox

    mknox Well-Known Member

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    The transmission between the MTU (in your panel) to the Gateway (near your router) is via powerline carrier. There is a daughterboard in the Gateway with a ZigBee radio for transmission to the (optional) tabletop display unit.
     
  20. ToddRLockwood

    ToddRLockwood Active Member

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    Thanks, guys! Very helpful.
     

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