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President Obama Calls for End To Oil and Gas Subsidies

Discussion in 'Energy, Environment, and Policy' started by NigelM, Mar 2, 2012.

  1. Beavis

    Beavis Model S Signature 991

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    S. 2064 and HR 3308. Democrats introduced Obama's clean energy proposals in the House at the end of February. HR 4108. It was introduced by Berkley of Nevada.
     
  2. NigelM

    NigelM Recovering Member

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    To cover lobbying costs and campaign contributions! Why else....
     
  3. eledille

    eledille TMS 85 owner :)

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    Duh. Why didn't I think of that... :redface:
     
  4. Robert.Boston

    Robert.Boston Model S VIN P01536

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    Note that while many of the subsidies on liquid fuels would terminate on 31 Dec 2012, the proposed bills would end EV subsidies for equipment placed in service after 31 Dec 2011.

    I'm not too worried -- there's no chance anything like this will pass this year.
     
  5. Beavis

    Beavis Model S Signature 991

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    Agree. A lot of posturing and nothing will happen until after November. It is fun to watch the battle lines being drawn, though.
     
  6. vfx

    vfx Well-Known Member

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  7. vfx

    vfx Well-Known Member

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  8. vfx

    vfx Well-Known Member

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  9. vfx

    vfx Well-Known Member

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  10. vfx

    vfx Well-Known Member

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  11. Lloyd

    Lloyd Well-Known Member

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    #51 Lloyd, Mar 7, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 13, 2016
  12. JRP3

    JRP3 Hyperactive Member

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    Without higher gas prices most people will simply be complacent and never push for alternatives. Gas prices were artificially lowered by the recession, with an improving economy, and increasing world wide demand, prices will climb. Take off the subsidies and they will climb even higher, which is what is needed to wake up the populace with a dose of reality.
     
  13. dsm363

    dsm363 Roadster + Sig Model S

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    He's right though. You need a slow, predictable rise in gas prices if possible. If people still think that the promised $2.50 gallon of gas is going to happen again soon, they are unlikely to change behavior and therefore less likely to purchase more fuel efficient cars or EVs which cost more upfront.
     
  14. Lloyd

    Lloyd Well-Known Member

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    Agreed. It is difficult to defend what you have previously said with today's technology and YouTube!
     
  15. dsm363

    dsm363 Roadster + Sig Model S

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    What he said today is 'what president wants higher gas prices doing an election season'? I'm sure that's accurate but so is what he said during those 2 youtube clips. Electricity rates probably will have to go up to retrofit old coal plants or take them offline and replace with with natural gas or other alternatives.
     
  16. JRP3

    JRP3 Hyperactive Member

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    Yes, there is a distinction between what one might want in an ideal situation, (low prices for everyone), and the reality of how the world works.
     
  17. Beavis

    Beavis Model S Signature 991

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    After the election I think Obama will propose to index the gas tax for inflation. I dont think it's been raised in a very long time.
     
  18. vfx

    vfx Well-Known Member

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    Timing is everything!
     
  19. dsm363

    dsm363 Roadster + Sig Model S

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    They should have done that a long time ago, I agree. According to Wikipedia, federal gas tax was last raised in 1993 and is not index to inflation as you said. Ultimately, they need to find another source for infrastructure revenue other than gas tax. If the whole point of more fuel efficient cars and EVs is to use less or no fuel, then that revenue source should get less and less. Our infrastructure seems to be in bad shape in the US and probably needs a few hundred billion in repairs and upgrades at least.
     
  20. Arnold Panz

    Arnold Panz Model Sig 304, VIN 542

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    The other possibility is a tax "floor", where if gas prices fall to a certain level the price floors out and any additional revenue becomes tax revenue. This serves a few purposes. First, it provides some much-needed revenue that the US government needs when prices are low, but doesn't become politically unpopular (and subject to repeal) when gas prices rise because the tax phases as the price of oil rises. Second, it gives people price predictability -- if everyone knows that the price of gas will never go below a certain price (e.g., $3/gallon), they can factor that into things like "which car do I buy?" or "how far should I live from work?" etc. Finally, knowing gas prices aren't going lower than a certain level allows for innovators to do their business without worrying about gas prices undermining their efforts. This not only impacts EV makers, but any alternative fuel provider (solar, natural gas etc.) trying to come up with alternative to petroleum. Thomas Friedman from the NY Times has been pushing this idea on and off for years, and the logic of it is fairly unassailable.
     

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