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Preventive eMMC replacement on MCU1
- Thread starter widodh
- Start date
Then it is not an issue that you don't have working Wifi. The car will go to sleep once it failed to check for updates
S100D
Member
Phil is busy building out his new shop. I think he said he should have it finished sometime in August.
Tripple_T
Cincinnati Member
There is definitely an increase of this issue. I've got a MCU that has failed and is only displaying a black screen. I'll document and post some videos on this soon. When the "screen bubbles" were first an issue I was able to raise the issue enough with engineers and service that they started to replace just the screen, not the whole MCU. I think we are in another scenario where that is appropriate. The main processing board is the only component failing in these MCUs. This should be a $500 or less repair. The service centers now know how to replace a screen. Replacing the MCU processing board is one additional set in that work. We really need to pressure them to replace the board and stop replacing components that are not broken.
I’m all for that. Also more sustainable as replacing a whole mcu for a single chip is a waste of resource.
Tripple_T
Cincinnati Member
Bottom line is that there doesn't appear to be anyone that is providing this service right now. Phil (ingineer) is likely the closest you will find to someone able to do this commercially. However, it seams that he is working on a few other projects. A few of us have been unable to contact him.
I personally have the knowledge and ability to do it. However, I have not done it yet. I am currently 7000 miles away from my car and shop. Once I get back I will start working on the problem. I'm likely a few months away from having any major contributions. (Sorry)
My goals / process in order:
1. Replace the MCU processing board with a known working one and see what results I get. Then see if Tesla service is able to reprogram. This is the safest and should allow the car to not be in exile from future dealer services.
2. Develop a cradle / docking station that you can place the MCU processing board into. I'm sure I can get it to allow read access for backing up the eMMC. My hope is that I can get it to allow me to also write to the eMMC. This will allow us to backup the data and transfer it to another (good) processing board.
3. Work on the replacement of faulty eMMC chips. This requires some delicate/microscope soldering work. Most good cell phone shops are able to do the work. The chips are identical to ones used in major cell phone brands.
My goal is the reduce the cost of repair on an issue that is becoming common. As some are aware, once you get into this level of linux system recovery you are walking a fine line with any person that supports said system (Tesla or others). The information can be used to gain root/administrator access to the system. I believe most people that own these cars are not interested in gaining that access. However, most people are interested in paying $500 vs $3000+ to repair their car.
The 3G to 4G upgrade was $500 and required very similar effort. There is a little more OS/Data that needs to be done in this effort but even then it won't be out of the wheel house of the Tesla service centers. Ideally, we can raise the issue and show a working process that can be pushed to corporate and supported. At one point the reduction of service / repair costs was a priority. I'm hoping it will still be so.
They can but they won't. (Unless something has changed recently.) In the past someone replaced their whole MCU with a different working one, towed it to Tesla to have it programed, and they refused. He ended up putting the bad MCU back and paying Tesla to do the whole MCU replacement.
I'm sure they are already doing the eMMC replacements themselves, just not at service centers. (Where do you think the remanufactured MCUs come from?) Though I suppose they could contract out the actual eMMC replacements, and just do the tear-down, re-assembly, and programming themselves.
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Good points. Why would tesla let someone take away their ~$3.5k fix? I wonder if this will ever turn into TSB as clearly there is a flaw and danger to the design. Being stranded and unexpectedly not having many of your controls (ac/heat/charging) could be deadly.
Are you saying that the cell modem is on the same board as the eMMC? Does a 3G to 4G upgrade get me a new eMMC? My 3G car will be out of warranty soon; I'd happily pay $500 if it got me 4G and a new eMMC.
Tripple_T
Cincinnati Member
No, I’m saying the eMMC is on a board next to the cellar modem. It requires the same level of effort to replace.
Tripple_T
Cincinnati Member
I can assure you I understand the frustration this issue can cause. The MCU failure in my car caused a major crisis in my family that I was helpless in. However, the MCU in my car lasted 170,000ish miles and 7ish years. The eMMC is a component that has a specific span of life. Much like tires and break pads. Those components can also present safety issues in the right situation.
I am a fan of this car and the company that produced it. I do not believe either is without their faults. I choose to contribute to the improvement of the company and the cars. I've participated in online car forums since the early 90s when it was basically an e-mail distribution. I've watched as many of them made a turn for the worse and became mostly negative. Please do not turn this forum into a negative environment that bashes the company and products it is founded on.
Please don't take this as a personal attack as I would have made the same comments to MP3Mike. It's a request to make this an environment where people want to participate and share information. Right now there are too many people not willing to share the information they have.
With the recent news that Tesla's are 8 times less likely to catch fire. Let's try to make the statistic the same for its online posts.
People don't not share information publicly because Tesla will close it as soon as it's disclosed. Tesla has to be one of the most unfriendly self service type cars ever. They sign the parts specifically preventing you from just dropping in replacements, unless you know the magic. So, even if you had a part that was brand new and willing to do the work to replace it, you can't because Tesla hasn't signed it for your car.
Tripple_T
Cincinnati Member
Do we have evidence to this? Honestly want to know before I start sharing information. From the issues that I've seen / heard of, Tesla hasn't been the one that intervened.
I personally have a reputation as a non-standard customer with my local service center, but they have always worked with me. I did my own 4g upgrade with them supplying parts and enabling the SIM card. When my MCU failed and my wife was in a state of panic, they spent a good amount of time looking at the issue and trying to recover it for her. Despite obvious signs of non-standard hardware. (i.e. network switches where there shouldn't be switches and service ports that have been modified.)
Yes, Tesla plugs any security holes they become aware of. And they will even pay for the knowledge. So for example if you share information on how to root a Tesla privately with a few people one of them could sell it to Tesla and it would get closed for everyone.
If you are only talking about information on how to replace the eMMC, I would think that is safe as I can't imagine how Tesla could block that. (Well I suppose they could have their software look for a non-standard eMMC chip, but I don't think that is something they would do.)
Tripple_T
Cincinnati Member
electricar
Member
This is hardly unique to Tesla - anyone who has worked in the service end of the car business knows that replacing many parts requires registering the part or a software update. This means the dealership or shop has to buy ever changing proprietary diagnostics/software from the OEM ( or even worse some hideously expensive piece of hardware that will be obsolete before it is paid for ) and discourages the DIY folks because they have to bring their car in to have this done after they have replaced something as simple as an alternator. In the case of Tesla with cars that have new and unique technology it makes total sense to have strict controls on the service end of their business because of the delight the media has in publicizing any problem with the cars or charging system. I can just imagine the stories about the mechanic or do it yourselfer who cooks themself or does work that causes injury to the car owner or someone else and the subsequent lawsuits by attorneys who " only want justice " for their client.
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