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Protection From Lightning
- Thread starter cherrybomb
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- lightning
The EVSE disconnects the car from the line voltage except while the car is actively charging (or conditioning the cabin/pack,) so leaving it plugged in during a storm shouldn't be a risk if the car isn't charging.
It's not obvious how much risk there is while charging. The charger circuitry is basically converting all of the power to DC anyway, and the battery pack inherently has enormous capacitance to eat up a surge.
I haven't read of fried chargers from voltage spikes, but I also haven't read of tests or cases where we know a charger survived a substantial surge, and there certainly have been some failed chargers over the years without a clear explanation for why they failed.
It's not obvious how much risk there is while charging. The charger circuitry is basically converting all of the power to DC anyway, and the battery pack inherently has enormous capacitance to eat up a surge.
I haven't read of fried chargers from voltage spikes, but I also haven't read of tests or cases where we know a charger survived a substantial surge, and there certainly have been some failed chargers over the years without a clear explanation for why they failed.
willow_hiller
Well-Known Member
Seems like all is well unless your car is the direct target of a lightening strike!
[UPDATE] Tesla Model S Struck By Lightning While Charging
Would love to hear an update on that story...
[UPDATE] Tesla Model S Struck By Lightning While Charging
Would love to hear an update on that story...
All this theoretical surge protector stuff is probably really great and works like a charm. However, I had lightning hit a power pole about 50 ft from me, and it set off car alarms up and down the block, blew out a bunch of sensitive computer electronics (1990s). Scared the shhhhhhhheeeeeeeeeetttttt out of me, and I absolutely love storms. Now, when a storm approaches, I unplug any and all sensitive or expensive electronics. Why risk destroying my only charging station within miles?
A direct hit will be pretty unstoppable. But a nearby hit should be able to be dealt with through the right equipment (which means good point of use protectors on computers and consumer electronics). I use series mode surge protectors like these on my most expensive and sensitive electronics. I also make sure I have protection on the incoming cable line which could bypass the surge protectors. Nothing will be as good as unplugging but I’m not always home to unplug during a major storm nor can I always afford to stop working while it passes.
For the Tesla, it’s probably not a bad idea to unplug during major storms if you can but I wouldn’t worry too much about it.
It’s likely the PCS has above average tolerance to surges, partly due to the relatively high apparent inductance of the mains at the higher power you’re likely to be charging at than say a laptop. I didn’t dive too deep into the packages used, but I assume they have sufficient tolerance built in from the past experience to be confident. I’m not sure if a spec sheet is even available at this point. If you get hit with actual lightning nearby, mitigating it is super impractical. The energy involved is remarkable. The whole home surge arrestors only help in some instances. And often times the devices on the line would tolerate the limited energy they would dump anyways anyways. Not all surge arrestors are created equal, most are totally useless garbage. Some work, but they have limited capacity. Typically you more or less pay more for more capacity, so it’s a question of risk tolerance. And they really should be installed as close to the main breaker as possible.
Yes, I forgot to mention that I now live in an area where thunderstorms are rare. Unplugging all the time in DC or the South would be a pain.
Electric700
Active Member
I have a whole house surge protector installed and definitely recommend them. It can help to protect your EV as well as anything else that runs on electricity at your home. Here is a good one:
Leviton 120-Volt/240-Volt Residential Whole House Surge Protector-R02-51110-SRG - The Home Depot
Leviton 120-Volt/240-Volt Residential Whole House Surge Protector-R02-51110-SRG - The Home Depot
ChrisMPK
Member
A $100 whole home surge protector will do nothing about a direct lighting strike. The above device is rated for 80,000 Amps. Lighting is usually less than 10,000 amps. However the 1,000,000,000+ volt potential of that current might still be a problem. The car is not grounded, however, so I doubt that any meaningful current would pass through the vehicle. The HPWC would almost certainly be fried. It would be interesting to hear real-world feedback of direct strikes on a house with a vehicle plugged in.
Solution: Move to California. Not much lighting to worry about and you can just turn on the climate if your house is destroyed in an earthquake.
Solution: Move to California. Not much lighting to worry about and you can just turn on the climate if your house is destroyed in an earthquake.
Yes you are 100% correct, in the case of a direct strike to your house it's not going to do much of anything. The only thing that can help is an extensive grounding system and roof mounted lightning rods to direct the energy to the ground. Surge suppressors can and do help with indirect strikes or surges on power restoration. They can even help voltage spikes from items such as large electric motors on AC or a an air compressor from propagating through your house wiring when they stop/start.
I personally take a multi step approach. I have a large 240kA per phase industrial grade surge suppressor (designed for 208V 3 ph) which starts clamping at something like 250V or 260V L-N. This leaves 120V lines vulnerable so I also have the HEPD80 which starts clamping at 150V L-N. I also have a 125A sub panel in the garage (for charging and other needs) and I put an additional HEPD80 at that location as well.
I also still use surge suppressor power strips for things like computers and other more expensive equipment. One thing I like about the larger Surgelogic TVSS system is it has a surge counter. While it doesn't give you information about the magnitude or duration of the surge, it does register when it suppresses an event. There have been times upon power restoration after an outage that there were over 300 events registered. I'm assuming it was from "ringing" on the lines when a large contactor upstream was closed to bring a large part of the grid back online. It's definitely overkill, but there is too much $$$ connected to the grid in my house to take a chance.
For your reading pleasure:
https://www.nist.gov/sites/default/files/documents/pml/div684/Surges_happen.pdf
https://m.littelfuse.com/~/media/el..._module_design_and_installation_guide.pdf.pdf
Voltage only exists when something foolishly tries to 'block' that surge. That is what plug-in protectors must do. Or what car tires are rumored to do.
Meanwhile, the 'whole house' solution is why your telco suffers about 100 surges with each storm. And your town still has phone service for four days afterwards. Protection from direct lighting strikes is that routine all over the world and even over 100 years ago.
Electronics atop the Empire State Building and WTC were struck 23 and 40 times annually - without damage. How can that be? Because lightning is typically 20,000 amps. And the above 'whole house' protectors are 50,000 amps. To remain functional for many decades after many driect lightning strikes.
This science was even demonstrated by Franklin over 250 years ago. Lightning seeks a connection to earth. Wood steeple (or car tires) is the conductor. But wood (or tire) is not a very good conductor. So 20,000 amps creates a high voltage. 20,000 amps times a high voltage is high energy. Steeple (or car) damaged.
Franklin simple connected that 20,000 amps to earth on a very conductive path. 20,000 amps created a near zero voltage. 20,000 amps times a near zero voltage is near zero energy. No damage. Franklin's lightning rods protect a structure for the same reason the properly earthed 'whole house' protector protects a Tesla and all other household appliances - for about $1 per protected appliance.
Telcos suffer about 100 surges per storm. A homeowner may suffer one every seven years. So informed consumers properly earth one 'whole house' protector. Then nobody knows a direct lightning strike (or many other surges) existed. Even the protector is not damaged.
Protection is about the current. Voltage only exists when one foolishly tries to 'block' or 'absorb' that surge inside - not in earth ground. But this requires most all attention- the item that does all protection - earth ground. A protector (just like Franklin's lightning rod) is only as effective as its earth ground. Upgraded earth ground means that near zero voltage becomes even much closer to zero - protection increases.
Knightshade
Well-Known Member
I believe this spell has been renamed Protection from Energy since 3rd edition 
In most cases it's probably ok, but the safest option is to just unplug it if you can. Whole house surge surpressors can help minimize or eliminate damage from a nearby strike. If you unplug, the only thing that would be a problem is a strike directly to your car.so the consensus is charging is ok during a possible storm?
or will I get 1.21 gigawatts of electricity
so the consensus is charging is ok during a possible storm?
or will I get 1.21 gigawatts of electricity
Its an unlikely event, maybe one that has literally never happened, that you are concerned about. Something to take up w/ insurance agent.
It has happened elsewhere. The threat?
Some venues may suffer one every three years. Some may not suffer any in 20 years. But this effective solution is so inexpensive (about $1 per protected appliance) as to be installed routinely.
Has a Tesla yet been destroyed by a power surge? The theory by one that the Tesla may survive the surge is a valid point.
I had read previously where an owner claimed Tesla would not charge. He claimed he had a surge. Did that Tesla (or its charger) suffer from a surge? Resulting damage, defined by what was repaired, was not posted. So surge damage was only speculation. Unfortunately, many also mistakenly define a brownout or a blackout as a surge. Two completely different and unrelated anomalies.
Tesla would not be destroyed. Surge typically damages one or a few parts. An inconvenience routinely made irrelevant by a well proven and inexpensive solution.
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