Public Charging Etiquette - blocking public chargers

[bwbrs]

If this is the wrong spot for this, mods please feel free to move.

I'll try to keep this short, I'm sure the solution for this is to just call my town's parking authority and see if there is something they can do, like implement a time limit that they probably won't enforce, but if anyone else has had a similar situation I'd love to hear what your thoughts / experience is / was...

I live in an apartment with nowhere to charge at my home, so I rely on public charging. So far it has not been an issue, just have to plan out my days a little more carefully. My town offers free public chargers (Juice bars) in the parking garages, you just have to pay for the hours you are parked. These garages are also home to some residents, so they can be quite busy.

Two residents of this particular garage / building have taken deliveries of a new Y and X in the past month, and have effectively claimed the two free public chargers as their personal parking spots. They leave their cars there for the duration of the weekend, plugged in, blocking anyone else in town or whoever needs to charge. This is a frequent scene during the week too, their cars will be parked and plugged in.

Anyway, just needed a little vent and would like to hear your thoughts on how to approach this. Thanks

 

[Hydrocarbon302]

You could leave the EVC squatters a note with your number to see if you can reach an agreement on when you can all charge.

Not sure if its practical or not but can you ask the owner of your apartment complex to install 5-20 receptacles in the parking lot? I'm sure NJ offers state incentives to install EV charging...

 

[JimBob 909]

My town offers free public chargers (Juice bars) in the parking garages, you just have to pay for the hours you are parked. These garages are also home to some residents, so they can be quite busy.

Why not notify the city to put up limitation signs with enforcment (meter maid?)? They are obviously abusing a good thing. Their phone app is notifying them when the cars are charged. Point that out to the city also that the owner of the car knows the status of their charging status.

 

[Lloyd]

Legislation Reference - Reserved Parking for Plug-In Vehicle Charging | PlugInSites

 

[Marving11]

Not trying to hijack this thread, but let me ask a question (kick me out if not appropriate). If you are at a free public charging station and you see someone is full, is it OK to unplug them?

 

[Rocky_H]

Not trying to hijack this thread, but let me ask a question (kick me out if not appropriate). If you are at a free public charging station and you see someone is full, is it OK to unplug them?

Well....that's going to be a controversial topic. If it's any other brand of electric car, then the perspective usually is: "Yeah, the charging station is a public resource that is supposed to be shared, so that is appropriate and is the intended use."

But from Tesla owners, you usually get this: "DON'T YOU DARE %$#@ING TOUCH MY CAR!!!!!" (even though the charging station handle is not their car)

 

[Rocky_H]

It's funny. I usually get a disagree or two when I post that, but I am basically quoting that from Tesla owners in many threads on this topic on this forum through the years.

 

[Marving11]

It's funny. I usually get a disagree or two when I post that, but I am basically quoting that from Tesla owners in many threads on this topic on this forum through the years.

Ya. I come from a different EV and I would even leave notes on my dash that would say (OK to unplug if battery full). Didn’t realize the Tesla etiquette was different.

 

[bobby g]

One good thing that charge point does, the host actually determines the details, is that free for X, Y grace period and then hefty idle fees - higher often then Tesla - works well in my mind

 

[Candleflame]

Not trying to hijack this thread, but let me ask a question (kick me out if not appropriate). If you are at a free public charging station and you see someone is full, is it OK to unplug them?

you cannot unplug someone. the charger gets locked.

 

[Rocky_H]

you cannot unplug someone. the charger gets locked.

I see you are in Australia. What you are saying is true with the Type 2 cable, where it fits natively into the Tesla charging port for cars in Europe and Australia. That is not true with North America. We have the Type 1 (J1772) that does not match the Tesla cars' charge port. We have to use a small snap-on adapter, so it is totally easy for anyone to unhook the charging cable from the adapter which is still in someone's charge port.

 

[Michaelkelly5]

Ya. I come from a different EV and I would even leave notes on my dash that would say (OK to unplug if battery full). Didn’t realize the Tesla etiquette was different.

I had this happen to me last night. Didn’t appreciate someone unplugging my car when it looked like 2 charger spots were open in the garage. I left a polite note…we will see if there is any blow back

 

[bradtem]

While you can unplug a J1772 charger (particularly when the charge is finished) if it's a Tesla that will leave the adapter in the charge port and the door will try to close on it and fail. It handles it but it's not ideal. Of course you need multiple parking places to access the charger.

This is why free charging is actually a mistake. We like it when we get it, but it causes people to charge (and park) there because "hey, why not, it's free."

Volta chargers are free and generally always full, including employees who park there all day. And since they give you less than $1 of electricity when you stop to shop for an hour, they are pretty much not worth the effort anyway if they aren't near where you are going.

As for your answer, you need a station that charges idle fees. Those are both good and bad. Ideally you want a station that charges idle fees only when somebody wants the station. The way to do this is that you should not get idle fees until somebody else comes up and authenticates at the station. Then you get an alert on your phone and had better come out to move the car. You want to find a trade-off between having to rush out to move your car the moment it's full (even though nobody is waiting) and making people wait for you to come out. For example, once I used a charger in front of my hotel. It was a double charger. Nobody else used the other port all night, but it charged me idle fees after my car was full. (What's the point of a hotel charger if you have to get up at 4am to move your car?) I might have accepted if the other charger got full and a 3rd car showed up and tapped the station I would get fat idle fees if I wasn't down in 5 minutes.

 

[bobby g]

I see people pull up in two vehicles, plug one in and drive away in the other. That I find really rude

 

[bradtem]

I see people pull up in two vehicles, plug one in and drive away in the other. That I find really rude

Why? Do you not people should use chargers that are not next to the place they want to go? Most chargers were installed due to government grants and are not in locations that are actually useful. This lets them get used.

 

[ATPMSD]

These garages are also home to some residents, so they can be quite busy.

Two residents of this particular garage / building have taken deliveries of a new Y and X in the past month, and have effectively claimed the two free public chargers as their personal parking spots.

you just have to pay for the hours you are parked.

Confused, are they paying by the hour?

 

[bobby g]

Why? Do you not people should use chargers that are not next to the place they want to go? Most chargers were installed due to government grants and are not in locations that are actually useful. This lets them get used.

I've seen this at the Metrolink station where there are 60 stations. Not a big deal there but I just saw it at the senior living place where my mom is going. There are I think it's rude and perhaps theft. They are for residents, employees and guests, not some one who burns gas to save pennies on free electrons.

 

[bradtem]

I've seen this at the Metrolink station where there are 60 stations. Not a big deal there but I just saw it at the senior living place where my mom is going. There are I think it's rude and perhaps theft. They are for residents, employees and guests, not some one who burns gas to save pennies on free electrons.

Well, if they put in basic EVSEs then it could be rude. If they put in EVSEs with authentication then they can of course (like many company lots) limit only to residents. But yes, basic ones are much easier to use, especially for guests. If they have any signage saying "residents and guests only" then this is indeed rude or even theft.

I though you were talking about EVSEs that are just in sucky locations, that almost nobody can use because they are not near anything.

 

[Earl]

While you can unplug a J1772 charger (particularly when the charge is finished) if it's a Tesla that will leave the adapter in the charge port and the door will try to close on it and fail. It handles it but it's not ideal. Of course you need multiple parking places to access the charger.

This is why free charging is actually a mistake. We like it when we get it, but it causes people to charge (and park) there because "hey, why not, it's free."

Volta chargers are free and generally always full, including employees who park there all day. And since they give you less than $1 of electricity when you stop to shop for an hour, they are pretty much not worth the effort anyway if they aren't near where you are going.

As for your answer, you need a station that charges idle fees. Those are both good and bad. Ideally you want a station that charges idle fees only when somebody wants the station. The way to do this is that you should not get idle fees until somebody else comes up and authenticates at the station. Then you get an alert on your phone and had better come out to move the car. You want to find a trade-off between having to rush out to move your car the moment it's full (even though nobody is waiting) and making people wait for you to come out. For example, once I used a charger in front of my hotel. It was a double charger. Nobody else used the other port all night, but it charged me idle fees after my car was full. (What's the point of a hotel charger if you have to get up at 4am to move your car?) I might have accepted if the other charger got full and a 3rd car showed up and tapped the station I would get fat idle fees if I wasn't down in 5 minutes.

The solution is that all parking spaces will eventually have chargers at them.
I, for one, remember when we wish there were public chargers. Now, there isn't enough capacity. It is progress.
In the mean time things will be confusing, chaotic, and, at times, inconvenient. It is important to not think that you're situation is more important or the same as whomever is 'hogging' 'your' charger. That Volta user may be have been an under-paid store clerk who scraped together enough money to buy that Fiat500e to support EVs and reduce her carbon footprint. With no way to charge in her apartment and she'd get fired if she left her job to unplug, her only choice was to leave the car plugged in for a while.
It's too bad if you got there later and think you have more right to it than she does.
If providing chargers starts impacting the work productivity of employers because their work gets interrupted to move the car, fewer employers will want EV chargers and the problem will never get solved.
The mall manager near me knows that EV chargers are good for business. If he can get people dependent on coming to his mall regularly, he becomes a part of their lives. This is good. Unfortunately, the Mall parking garage was built in the '60's and '70's so it doesn't have much electric supply. He keeps adding a couple of new chargers whenever he can because he sees the end game.
Personally, my assumption is that Level 2 is for as long as you need to be parked. You're there because you need to be there, not just too charge. There should be no expectation that you'll interrupt what you need to be doing to move your car. Sure, its a nice touch to move when through, but not a moral obligation.
If you find no place to charge your car, the problem is: Not enough chargers. Not impoliteness on anyone's part.
I do prefer paid chargers since they are more likely to be available and, hopefully, more use = more revenue => more chargers.

 

[bradtem]

Public chargers are generally a sign of "doing it wrong" at least for locals. Huge amounts of public subsidy money went in to install 100,000 of them, most of which are barely used.

The effort should be to get chargers in apartment parking lots and office/commuter lots, and curbside in places where the homes do not have driveways or garages and don't commute. And of course, hotels.

The chargers need not be fast -- 3kw is way more than enough, but there need to be a lot of them.

Leave public charging for those very few who can't get charging in the above ways, and for tourists not staying in a hotel. This is the only way to make EVs what they are supposed to be -- superior in every way to gas cars when driving around town. If you charge at home or work, charging takes zero time out of your day. Public charging just involves parking where you don't want to, battling with others over chargers, and wasted time. Zero time is the way to go. Today is an abberation.

That will leave road trips as the only place where gasoline offers an advantage. Work is being done to minimize that. That's where fast charging is used. (You don't need fast charging in town if you have charging at work/home.)