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Question about install NEMA 14-50 in Garage

Discussion in 'Model 3: Battery & Charging' started by wallyttttt, Jun 20, 2018.

  1. wallyttttt

    wallyttttt Member

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    Hi, I got a question about installing a new NEMA 14-50.

    Currently we dont use the 50 AMPS breaker for the SPA so we are thinking to wire it to NEMA 14-50 outlet.
    The panel is 120/240v 1 phase 3 wire panel.
    Is NEMA 14-50 require panel that can support 2 hot line with difference phase to be install?

    I was shopping around for new 50a breaker on amazon but found the review said it won't work with Tesla becasue
    "Will not work for a NEMA 14-50 outlet to charge a Tesla using the UMC, which looks for opposite phases on the two hot lines. Using this thin breaker on an "E" shape slot in the breaker box will give you the same phase on both lines."

    does not work as breaker for Tesla charger
     

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  2. Acps110

    Acps110 Member

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  3. swaltner

    swaltner Member

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    That breaker panel is labeled as a Federal Pacific brand. The general knowledge is that this is just an accident/fire waiting to happen. In reality, you should talk to an electrician to quote replacing the whole breaker panel with a new one in addition to the proposed installation of a 14-50 outlet.
     
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  4. eprosenx

    eprosenx Member

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    I am not intimately familiar with that model of breaker panel, but from the pictures you provided it does look like that breaker is a double wide breaker that spans two breaker positions which are fed from two “legs” of the same phase which are 180 degrees out of phase from each other - so it would provide 240v. What is odd is that they have two sizes of breakers in that panel (physically). I am not sure if the upper breakers are considered service disconnects and the lower ones are not or what (would need a better picture of the label and maybe some other technical details to figure it out).

    So yeah, you could probably use that circuit for car charging, though the panel does say it is only 125 amp rated so you may need to be careful about doing the load calculations.

    But perhaps most importantly- These old Federal Pacific panels are straight up considered dangerous. They don’t work very well apparently and basically the recommendation it to replace them ASAP from what I have seen (though do your own research). I personally would not be willing to live in a house with one and I would have serious concerns about hooking a new high draw device such as a car charger to one.

    It can be expensive, but I recommend spending the $$$ on a new service panel and perhaps a service capacity upgrade at the same time. Think of it as a 30yr investment in your house.
     
  5. wallyttttt

    wallyttttt Member

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    which model of breaker are consider good from homedepot or lowers?
     
  6. wallyttttt

    wallyttttt Member

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    I mean model of panels not breaker.
     
  7. eprosenx

    eprosenx Member

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    Any modern panels sold today are safe and of good quality.

    I happen to like the Siemens ones.

    I also like to get ones with solid copper bus bars.

    I will call out that swapping out a main breaker panel is not a simple do it yourself project.
     
  8. wallyttttt

    wallyttttt Member

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    thanks for the input, we will get an electrician to swap out the panel + the NEMA.
     
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  9. eprosenx

    eprosenx Member

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    If you are having that work done you might consider doing a wall connector at the same time. I personally want to keep my UMC in my car at all times so that meant buying a second UMC ($300) for home or getting a wall connector for $500. The Wall Connector will charge a model 3 50% faster than the UMC and so that is the route I went.
     
  10. iluvmacs

    iluvmacs Member

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    Agree with all above... you need a panel replacement. But, for the interested: the only reason that breaker didn't work for that reviewer is that it was installed in the wrong location in the panel. It's a 2-pole breaker, which if installed on both phases would be fine... but they basically even admitted that it didn't work when they put it in a location in the panel that wasn't meant to support it (and it wouldn't have worked for *anything* in that case). Clearly that reviewer didn't know much about how home electrical works.
     
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  11. eprosenx

    eprosenx Member

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    If you look closer at the schematics I am pretty sure it is across phases properly. It should work fine in that location. (But yeah, the layout of these panels is super odd)
     
  12. timk225

    timk225 Active Member

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    #12 timk225, Jun 21, 2018
    Last edited: Jun 21, 2018
    Cutler Hammer CH type panel, the one with the tan colored breaker handles. May be listed as Eaton / Cutler Hammer panels. The BR type is good also. Here's one of the 2 CH panels in my house when we got the place (upstairs apartment has its own CH panel), before significant electrical improvements began. The previous owners were idiots.
     

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  13. eprosenx

    eprosenx Member

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    I would probably go with the BR style panel over a CH style one. Seems more popular and Eaton will be making them *forever*. An Eaton BR panel I would hazard to guess is one of if not the most popular panels...

    CH seems like more a legacy product at this point?
     
  14. Rocky_H

    Rocky_H Active Member

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    Square D is also a very well known and commonly used maker of panels and electrical equipment.
     
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